College suggestions? UChicago, NU etc

College Search & Selection
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<p>I'm a female Asian from northern Europe that has come to the U.S. to study. I've already been here for 3 years (I'm currently a senior in a highly ranked high school in my state) and I'm currently in the IB programme. </p>

<p>To be honest I'm overwhelmed by the whole idea of going to college in the U.S. and I have no idea where to apply. I don't really see the point of applying to mediocre schools as I may as well return to my country if I do so (as it would be cheaper) but at the same time I'm not sure if I have what it needs to get into Ivies. And since I don't really know many other schools beside Ivies, I'd like to ask you guys if you could provide me suggestions of competitive colleges that I may have a good shot in getting into based on my academic performance. I'd prefer a university more than small LAC. Any suggestions/ideas would be appreciated.</p>

<p>ACT: 31 (superscore: 32)
GPA unweighted: 3.89
GPA weighted: 5.02 (since I had honors classes, double honors, APs and IBs, so my gpa got a bit messed up. On my latest semester I got 5.7)
Rank: 11/465</p>

<p>No APs below 3 but the scores are nothing stellar, same goes with SAT I (low 1900s)
Know 2 languages fluently, speaks one relatively fluently and am learning a new one. </p>

<p>Freshman year (1st semester/2nd):
Honors survey lit A/A
Honors rdg workshop A/A
Honors biology A/A
Honors world history A/A
Accelerated algebra II A/A
Orchestra/music A/A
PE B/A</p>

<p>Sophomore year:
PIB lit A/A
AP US history B/A
PIB pre-calc/trig A/A
PIB foreign language A/A
Art A/A
PE etc A/A
PIB Chemistry A/A</p>

<p>Junior Year
IB HL lit B/B
IB HL Chemistry A/A
IB foreign language A/A
IB history B/A
IB HL math A/A
AP calc bc A/A
IB TOK A/A</p>

<p>Senior Year
IB HL lit
IB HL Chemistry
IB foreign language
IB foreign language 2
IB HL math
IB TOK</p>

<p>Achievements
state finalist history fair twice
AP scholar
NHS</p>

<p>Extra curric. during high school
Chess team
Math team
Tennis varsity
Badminton (founder/leader)
Summer college course at NU
IBSCA
Volunteered at a summer camp for people w/disabilities
Small volunteering programs here and there
Volunteered at library and attended academic programs during the summer at my country</p>

<p>I got a bunch of extra curricular from pre-high schools year but they are all done in my home country. My country doesn't really put that much focus on extra curricular.</p>

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<p>A 32 on the ACT is supposed to be like a 2100 on the SAT so Ivies may be difficult but schools slightly less selective could be sensible reaches. And your grades are excellent. You’re identified Northwestern and U. Chicago. Just note that they are very different----Northwestern more pre-professional and preppy and Chicago quirky and intellectual. You might also look at Johns Hopkins. For slightly easier but still top notch maybe take a look at Emory, Carnegie Mellon and U. Rochester. But you might want to mix in some smaller schools—what about Wellesley and Barnard? Bowdoin. Slightly easier to get into but still well known----Colby, Hamilton.</p>

3

<p>So you are an international student, unfamiliar with many American schools, you have rather high stats, and prestige/reputation is important to you. Presumably, you’d be a full-pay student (not expecting need-based aid)? In your situation, probably the easiest way to start is to go through the US News National Universities list ([National</a> University Rankings | Top National Universities | US News Best Colleges](<a href=“http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities]National”>http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandreviews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities)). Focus on the top 50 or so.</p>

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<p>I am not following. You do not know other schools besides Ivies yet you went to NU for a summer? Do some more research on schools using the top 50. There are lots of schools besides Ivies that I think you will find can be deemed more than mediocre.</p>

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<p>In most countries, there are only a few really prestigious universities - and almost everyone just goes to their regional school unless they are studying something really unique. So many foreign students (even those who have been in the US for a few years), think it must be similar here: The Ivies (maybe Stanford and MIT too) and then ‘mediocre’ (meaning regional). That’s a common mistake - one of the great ‘products’ of the US university system is that, as a result of competition, wealth and a diverse population, we have many outstanding universities and colleges often tailored to specific target audiences. The top 100 are likely to be excellent - although not every one of them will be excellent for a specific student. That’s part of what makes the process complicated: You have to know what you want. Figuring that out is, by itself, a lot of work and it’s not just foreign students who get baffled by the range of options. </p>

<p>OP, I agree with others - you need to spend more time thinking about what you want from your education - what your selection criteria are for a college. Once you know more, we can offer better suggestions.</p>

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<p>@Murphy600: Oh, I didn’t mean I don’t know ANY schools at all; I meant that know only a few beside Ivies. To be honest I didn’t know of Northwestern or UChicago (even though they’re so well-known!) before I came to Illinois. I studied at NU because my school sent me a scholarship program via e-mail which I applied to and got accepted into, if my school didn’t send it I would probably not have gone at all. </p>

<p>Unfortunately, Just like M’s Mom says, not that many American universities beside the Ivies are known outside of America. When I first came to the U.S., I had only heard about Harvard, Yale and Brown (I learned the last two from reading the Gossip Girls series, lol).
I’m not aiming for the brand name Ivy League, but I’d like to enter a university that is to some extent known for its academics. </p>

<p>@tk21769: I’ve looked at USNews top 50, but I don’t really know where I stand. I can’t really ball park what my match schools are since all I can see is the ACT score, and ACT score alone doesn’t reflect a student’s achievements. So I want to ask people who are more familiar with the colleges to give me an idea of that. </p>

<p>What really appeals to me about American education is the focus on intellectual stimulation. In my country there is a very relaxed and noncompetitive academic atmosphere and many go to universities just for the sake of getting a degree/pursue a certain career path. What I want, however, is not just to obtain a degree because I need it to get a job, but to obtain an education that exposes me to the world and improves me as a learner and person in general. I probably sound very vague, but basically what I want is like an extension of the International Baccalaureate program in which I can pursue a more specific direction of study. I’m very interested in the sciences, particularly biology and chemistry, less so in humanities but I know they are necessary in order for me to receive a good overall education. So perhaps a university that is good in pre-med, pre-pharm? I’m also very good at languages, so a good linguistic department would be great as well. </p>

<p>Other factors:

  • a university instead of undergradute college
  • in a suburb or city or somewhere where things are easily accessible
  • academic atmosphere, I don’t study 24/7 but I’m not a party person either
  • quirky/laid-back? I’m not a very competitive person. I do care about my grades, however.
  • diversity. I’d love to meet and get to know new people with different cultures. I think this is one of the most appealing factors of American colleges!
  • (if possible) good financial packages. Studying abroad is very expensive regardless of one’s financial situation (unless you’re Bill Gates that is) and getting a bit financial help wouldn’t hurt
  • I’d prefer a smaller school than, let’s say, Urbana-Champaign. Not small colleges either. Somewhere in the middle would be nice. </p>

<p>NU and UChicago first caught my attention because they are the most known colleges in Illinois. I found out they both have liberal arts department which I really like, though Chicago seems to weigh more on it than NU does. Since I’m not sure yet what career path within science I want to pursue, I’m leaning toward UChicago because it seems like the Core Curriculum allows you to explore more. Also, it has a Scandinavian language/literature course which I’m interested in taking, not to mention the campus is formed like a small village - very fancy! NU seems laidback and fun, but I’m worried it’s too laidback. Also it seems … isolated somehow? I feel like the college is split into different social groups that don’t really interact with each other. I’d like to meet new, different people all the time, and the idea of being in a specific group doesn’t appeal to me. But I know both of these are difficult schools to get into, so that’s why I’d like to see if anyone has other suggestions of schools that they think may suit me.</p>

<p>@Barnard: I researched Wellesley and it seems like a nice school. However, it seems like it’s very focused on academics and very serious. A place that’s a bit quirkier would be nice. Wellesley, Barnard and Bowdoin are all LACs, and while the idea of a liberal arts education is really appealing, I’d prefer a university instead. </p>

<p>Nonetheless, I appreciate the comments and suggestions made!</p>

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<p>How about Tufts?</p>

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<p><a href=“if%20possible”>quote</a> good financial packages. Studying abroad is very expensive regardless of one’s financial situation (unless you’re Bill Gates that is) and getting a bit financial help wouldn’t hurt

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<p>You won’t get need-based aid unless the college determines your family truly needs it. You won’t get need-based aid, regardless of need, at most public universities. </p>

<p>Use the Net Price Calculators on the college web sites to estimate your Expected Family Contribution, and discuss with your family whether you are able and willing to cover those costs. If not, you’ll need to focus on less expensive colleges, or seek “merit” aid (which typically means applying to schools where your stats clearly are in the top 25% or better).</p>

<p>Here is a list of schools with relatively generous aid to international students:
[url=&lt;a href=“http://www.desperateguide.com/us/top-25-financial-aid-colleges-in-us-for-international-students-need-aware]Top”&gt;http://www.desperateguide.com/us/top-25-financial-aid-colleges-in-us-for-international-students-need-aware]Top</a> 25 Financial Aid Colleges in US for International Students (Need-aware) - Desperate Guide: Undergraduate College Financial Aid, Scholarship<a href=“notice%20that%20with%20few%20exceptions,%20these%20are%20small%20LACs”>/url</a></p>

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<p>Your other qualifications are more or less congruent with your ACT score, so just start with that score as a crude indicator of where you stand. Here is a ranking of colleges by 75th percentile ACT scores:
[College</a> Rankings - Top 500 Ranked Colleges - Highest ACT 75th Percentile Scores - StateUniversity.com](<a href=“USA University College Directory - U.S. University Directory - State Universities and College Rankings”>Top 500 Ranked Colleges - Highest ACT 75th Percentile Scores)
Schools with scores of 32 or below start at the bottom of page 2 (Barnard, Wesleyan, etc.) Look for schools on page 2-5 (or so) that match your other criteria (size, setting, etc). Possibilities: Boston College, UC Berkeley, Case Western, USC, UCLA, Michigan, NYU, University of Miami, Tulane, American, UCSD. These are mid-large urban/suburban research universities that ought to be “match” or low reach schools for your stats. Whether your family can afford them is another question. Several are public. As an international student, you almost certainly won’t get need-based aid from public schools. You might get some merit aid from a private school in this range (like Case Western), but to increase the likelihood of that, you probably need to look at LACs or less selective research universities.</p>

<p>Some of the schools on the first 2 pages are realistic reaches. Rice, Vanderbilt, Carnegie Mellon, Georgetown, and Northwestern seem to fit your criteria. The same caveats about costs apply to these schools. I would recommend also looking at some of the larger urban/suburban LACs that give good aid to internationals.</p>

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<p>How about Johns Hopkins in Baltimore for pre med</p>

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<p>@tk21769: I forgot to mention I’m a permanent resident and I estimate my family’s contribution to be 0. </p>

<p>Does ACT score really matter that much? You’re telling me to aim for colleges that suit my ACT score, but I know several classmates of mine that have similar stats as me but with higher/lower ACTs. Should I perhaps retake my ACT then and aim for a higher score?</p>

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<p>That’s not what I’m saying.<br>
At selective schools, especially very selective private schools, the whole package matters. However, your ACT score appear to be fairly consistent with your other qualifications. So I think the schools where your ACT score is at about the 75th percentile mark are schools where you have a reasonably good shot at admission.</p>

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I interpret that to mean your Expected Family Contribution (EFC) is zero.
In other words, you have low income and very high need. In that case, you probably should focus on need-blind, full-need colleges.
(<a href=“http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Need-blind_admission[/url]”>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Need-blind_admission&lt;/a&gt;)</p>

<p>So it’s not that “getting a bit of financial help wouldn’t hurt” (as stated above). You absolutely need financial aid, and lots of it, to attend the kinds of schools that interest you.</p>

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<p>Apply to UC Berkeley, if you think your parents can afford to send you there. Your very high GPA will give you higher chances of getting accepted there. And, Berkeley, as you may have already known it, is a globally prestigious school name, solid top 10 in the world!</p>

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<p>I’ve assembled a list of colleges that are qualified for financial aid from my country. </p>

<p>Brown University (RI)
Columbia University (NY)
Cornell University (NY)
Duke University (NC)
Emory University (GA)
Georgetown University (DC)
Harvard University (MA)
Johns Hopkins University (MD)
New York University (NY)
Northwestern University (IL)
Princeton University (NJ)
Rice University, Houston (TX)
Stanford University (CA)
Tufts University (MA)
University of Chicago (IL)
University of Illinois – Urbana – Champaign (IL)
University of Michigan, Ann Arbor (MI)
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill (NC)
University of Notre Dame (IN)
University of Pennsylvania ¶
University of Rochester (NY)
University of Southern California (CA)
University of Virginia (VA)
UoC Berkeley (CA)
Vanderbilt University (TN)
Washington University in St. Louis (MO)
Wellesley College
Yale University (CT)</p>

<p>… and some extra that don’t qualify but that I’ve been suggested to look further into:
University of Illinois at Chicago
Wellesley College
Smith College
Bryn Mawr College
University of Minnesota</p>

<p>Based on my stats, are the certain colleges you would pick out as match schools? Or any that you think I won’t get into at all? I’m very interested in UChicago, NU and Columbia, so I’ll be applying to those for sure though I’m not sure how I will stand. Oh, and feel free to suggest other colleges beside those on the list. </p>

<p>@RML: thanks for your input! UC Berkeley seems to match my interests indeed (I used College super-match lol). I’ll look deeper into it. :slight_smile: </p>

<p>@tk21769: by “your ACT score appear to be fairly consistent with your other qualifications” do you mean that my stats are what you’d expect from someone with 31/32 ACT? Thank you for your site earlier by the way; it had really interesting stats! And yes I meant EFC. The thing is, my country will offer aid for many of the colleges in the U.S. so finance is not what I’m most concerned about. I don’t emphasize certain factors for a reason.</p>

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<p>Yes. 33+ would definitely help you get into schools of the intellectual caliber you seem to want.</p>

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<p>32to 33 will make very little difference!,</p>

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<p>Well, I sincerely think you should. Because unlike almost all the other schools in your list, Berkeley does weigh more of your HS GPA than they do your SAT or ACT scores, that’s why the average SAT scores of Berkeley is lower relative to the Ivies’, whilst the HS GPA is higher.</p>

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<p>Something like this:</p>

<p>High Match
University of Southern California (CA)
New York University (NY)
University of Michigan, Ann Arbor (MI)
University of North Carolina at Chapel Hill (NC)
UoC Berkeley (CA)
University of Virginia (VA)</p>

<p>Match
University of Illinois – Urbana – Champaign (IL)
University of Rochester (NY)</p>

<p>HYPS, Columbia and Brown have single-digit admit rates. I think they’d be long reaches, bordering on out-of-reach.</p>

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<p>^ I believe she’s a match for Berkeley. Her (unweighted) GPA is 3.89, not to mention, she has taken several honors classes. Berkeley cares the applicants HS GPA. Yes. More than they do SAT or ACT scores. </p>

<p>

I doubt that those schools would be “out-of-reach” for the OP. The bottom quarter of students of those schools have SATs equal to what the OP has. And her GPA is in the upper half of those students admitted to those schools. She has a chance – something like from 10% to 40% – at those schools.</p>

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<p>OP, here’s last year’s stats for international students applying to and attending in Berkeley:</p>

<p>Applications: 9,170 (11,599 for OOS)
Admitted: 1,137 (2,522 for OOS)
Admit Rate: 12.4% (22.6% for OOS)</p>

<p>Avg. GPA Admit: 3.89 (3.91 for OOS)
Avg. SAT Admit: 2136 (2141 for OOS)
Avg. ACT Admit: 31 (32 for OOS)</p>

<p>[Student</a> Profile | UC Berkeley Office of Undergraduate Admissions](<a href=“http://admissions.berkeley.edu/studentprofile]Student”>Student Profile - Office of Undergraduate Admissions)</p>

<p>**HOW BERKELEY SELECTS STUDENTS</p>

<p>Selection is based on holistic review of all information—both academic and personal—presented in the application.**</p>

<p>*UC Berkeley is among the more selective universities in the country, becoming more competitive each year. Due to student demand, selectivity varies among Colleges, and—in the College of Engineering—among majors; for example, it is more difficult to gain admission to the Electrical Engineering and Computer Sciences major than to the Mechanical Engineering major.</p>

<p>For applications to the College of Letters and Science and Natural Resources no consideration is given to the indicated major in the review process. However, for the professional colleges of Chemistry, Environmental Design, and Engineering demonstrated interest in the major is also taken into consideration. Furthermore, in the colleges of Chemistry and Engineering, Berkeley faculty in these disciplines have asked that readers place added emphasis on sustained achievement in mathematics and science, and have indicated a preference that these applicants take the Math Level 2 SAT Subject Test and a science test (Biology, Chemistry or Physics) that is closely related to the applicant’s intended major.*</p>

<p>[How</a> Berkeley Selects Students | UC Berkeley Office of Undergraduate Admissions](<a href=“http://admissions.berkeley.edu/selectsstudents]How”>Selection Process - Office of Undergraduate Admissions)</p>