<p>admissiongeek is lying again
After providing contact info at the networking events, some studnets get job interviews. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Columbia Alumni directory search shows that everyone under the category of ‘Columbia University’ graduated from Columbia College/SEAS. No one is from GS.</p>
<p>you know there is a far cry different from networking leading to interviews and it being a recruiting service. but i am laughing at your logic. i’ll call your bluff - i don’t deny that dean wittner’s office is great and does some pretty awesome things. but anecdotes of ‘some interviews’ is a far cry from a recruiting service.</p>
<p>there are also many networking events in which gs students are invited to. and because i know how infrequent the cc/seas events are, the cce open to everyone events are far more likely places in which students gain access.</p>
<p>re: simpson thacher, i suppose if you went through each (wow you have time on your hands), i was just commenting on how vague it could be. and just because no one is presently there from gs, doesn’t mean there hasn’t ever had someone from gs. the latter is unprovable.</p>
<p>Here is another top law firm </p>
<p>[Patterson</a> Belknap Webb & Tyler LLP - Attorneys - Search](<a href=“http://www.pbwt.com/attorneys/]Patterson”>http://www.pbwt.com/attorneys/)</p>
<p>The alumni directory search shows that Nobody graduated from GS. All attorneys with BA/BS from Columbia graduated from
CC/SEAS</p>
<p>Another top law firm.</p>
<p>[Attorneys</a> - Search](<a href=“http://www.wlrk.com/Page.cfm?Thread=Attorneys&SubThread=Search&Criteria=Yes&Name=Yes&FirstName=&LastName=&Position=&DeptID=&UndergradSchoolID=12&LawSchoolID=0&LawGradYear=]Attorneys”>http://www.wlrk.com/Page.cfm?Thread=Attorneys&SubThread=Search&Criteria=Yes&Name=Yes&FirstName=&LastName=&Position=&DeptID=&UndergradSchoolID=12&LawSchoolID=0&LawGradYear=)</p>
<p>ALumni directory search shows that
NObody graduated from GS. All Columbia BA is from CC.</p>
<p>dea collegeboy</p>
<p>im trying to establish what ur point is…
r u making an effort to point out that GS is not a worthwhile school? or that those who attend gs can forget about big firms, big law/med schools etc?</p>
<p>moreover what is there to gain by you trying to solidify that argument?</p>
<p>Someone has been claiming that CC/SEAS is the same as GS, which is clearly wrong.
That is the point that I want to establish. GS is an excellent school but it is different from CC/SEAS.</p>
<p>to be truthful, other than the endowments which i know differ greatly (and impact financial aid given by the school) and the few writing courses the classes for a premed student like myself would be the same classes a CC student would take. Hence, if me and my CC counterpart (with equal GPAs, MCATs) would apply to a medschool i dont know why they would feel hat the CC student is a stronger applicant. We both had to pass the same courses with the same rigorous criteria…
my point is, if the vast majority of the classes (and hence the faculty) are shared, how can CC be a better school than GS?</p>
<p>collegeboy - so your argument is they are not the same. no one has ever said they were.</p>
<p>but then why does your argument come across as: gs is not as prestigious as columbia college, which impacts outcomes. to bolster your argument, you use some white shoe law firms to prove that somehow one can’t be a big time M&A lawyer if they go to gs. it is sort of like saying that attending an ivy (and at columbia only attending cc/seas) somehow is life affirming. </p>
<p>never mind that there are plenty no-name firms that were until recently still paying out 150k a year to new associates. or that 10 years ago the same stuff was lodged at seas. (i’ll emphasize this because to be honest if you were to be on this board 10 years ago you’d say - cc is not the same as seas, instead of putting them in the same argument).</p>
<p>i think this is an elitist/arrogant argument. since not everyone can be admitted to cc, and people develop at different rates it is great there is something like gs. it’s unfortunate that there is someone on this board from columbia that acts so negative toward a fellow columbia school - if you think it is excellent, please frontload this in your opinion. because otherwise it makes you look - well elitist.</p>
<p>well what i gathered from collegeboy is that he is saying that GS is a good school, but not as good. Im perplexed because both students are getting the same level of education, with the same faculty and besides very few exceptions, the exact same courses.</p>
<p>that is what i meant by saying that it is the same thing. i was speaking in reference to the level of academia…</p>
<p>and my point to offer is that you shouldn’t overvalue things about cc/seas that really are not significant. in truth what is significant is certainly the name, but rarely do folks ask me if i went to columbia college or seas or gs. </p>
<p>i know how great columbia is, and i do care a lot for columbia college. but i think it is important not to overvalue its impact, and second to proclaim that it is significantly better than gs. it is different, in fact you can’t compare the two. ultimately when it comes to the education - as ziv points out - they are the same. but the populations they serve and yes the resources they have are not the same. i think though - there is a lot that cc/seas could learn from gs in terms of how it arranges and works with students in a more personal way. and i hope that gs continues to grow, is funded better and ultimately can support students even better. but regardless on the administrative aspect at the core of it - students receive the same education.</p>
<p>CC is not better than GS. CC is different from GS. </p>
<p>Since GS students can not take CC section of Core Curriculum, GS students’ educational experience is different from CC. The pre-med resources for CC is also different from GS. [The</a> Office of Preprofessional Advising | Student Affairs](<a href=“http://www.studentaffairs.columbia.edu/preprofessional]The”>Preprofessional Advising | Columbia College and Columbia Engineering)
Pre-med courses are also different. ( Courses with letter F)
Since GS allows part time, taking 1-2 courses per term with grade A+ is not that impressive. </p>
<p>I just want to correct the false claim that GS is the same as CC/SEAS.</p>
<p>admissiongeed </p>
<p>If GS is really the same as CC/SEAS, then why there is almost no GS working at top law firms ?</p>
<p>collegeboy,
i looked into the site u provided (preprof advising @ office of student affairs) and found that GS offers a very similar support service as well:
[Postbaccalaureate</a> Premedical Program :: Columbia University](<a href=“http://www.columbia.edu/cu/gs/postbac/program/advising.html]Postbaccalaureate”>http://www.columbia.edu/cu/gs/postbac/program/advising.html)</p>
<p>do you major in the core curriculum? and we are taking about at max 19 credits of your time at columbia are reserved for columbia college/engineering students only. so 85% of your time and in all your major classes you are with or could be with gs students.</p>
<p>gs students can take C level courses (and W and F) with the exception of the 19 credits above mentioned. and they can take some E courses if they have the prerequisite. ex. they can take c1403 even if it is registered to Columbia College. or they can take the W class. yes F level is the GS prefix, but consider, only intro physics has an F section, and the C section gs students can register for.</p>
<p>taking 1-2 courses and working 40 hrs a week is impressive.</p>
<p>and if your goal is merely to claim they are not the same, you could do so far easier than being so negative (read your statement about impressiveness).</p>
<p>if gs is the same academic experience as cc why are there almost no white shoe lawyers from gs.</p>
<p>there are tons of explanations that have nothing to do with the academic environment or resources. i mean you can’t control the other reasons enough to make your statement true. you can’t prove that you are truly right that some how not being in top law firms means they are different.</p>
<p>a) gs is smaller than cc and seas. thus fewer potential lawyers.</p>
<p>some speculative ones</p>
<p>b) gs students care less about becoming white shoe lawyers, though not any less about being lawyers. or gs students don’t care to be lawyers.
c) gs students face age discrimination to a higher degree.
d) gs is more international (as dean awn says it has a lot of former israeli military officers) and thus more students choose to leave the country.<br>
e) the heavy number of gs students that are part of list college means more gs students choose the rabbinical way.
f) as many gs students have families we could say this limits their ability to do the same things as young puerile cc grads. they don’t have the time to put up with going to school for many years and then working 100hr weeks.
g) gs students have a solid career already, but just want the degree. </p>
<p>the most obvious ones.</p>
<p>h) gs students are different, coming from different backgrounds and at different ages.
i) cc students have higher expectations placed on them by society.</p>
<p>it is like saying - if columbia is so prestigious, why does sewanee have as many rhodes scholars than columbia. the priorities of a students at a school (i.e. school culture) at times do not synch with priorities of prestige. </p>
<p>i mean we could go on and on. but ultimately, how does gs not having white shoe lawyers matter? and how does this matter regarding the quality of the education students will receive.</p>
<p>admissiongeek i did want to comment about a few things u listed, if i may.</p>
<p>I am a 25 year old Israeli Army veteran, but i do not believe that graduating undergrad at 28-29 will create potential problems for medschool applications due to age discrimination. also, maybe i misunderstood the tone of some of your examples, but it seemed like you were implying that GS students have lower aspirations in terms of career? (if i misunderstood what u meant i apologize) I am choosing to go to an Ivy for premed in hopes of increasing my chances of going to a prestigious medschool, i am shooting for the highest aspirations possible, knowing full well that the career that follows will demand insane work-weeks.
i dont think it is possible to generalize that GS students dont have time to put up with school for many years and then working 100 hr weeks.
however what i feel will benefit collegeboy to know is that veterans (from the US and abroad) applying to columbia (as GSers) do posses certain qualities that set them aside from 18 year old kids at CC. there are just some lessons that the army teaches that i dont think can be taught anywhere else. Moreover, army service especially in a conflict zone (ie marines in Iraq/afghanistan, israeli soldiers) helps put everything in perspective. the hardships that a CC student would complain about might not seem as overwhelming to an army vet.</p>
<p>ziv - you didn’t get my post.</p>
<p>i was coming up with alternative arguments to collegeboy.</p>
<p>honestly, i think gs is great. i am a huge fan. i hope you could read the speculative nature of my post. and i think gs is very similar to cc especially in the academic arena. you don’t need to prove to me the importance of GS. </p>
<p>i was just arguing against collegeboy’s narrow view of prestige.</p>
<p>oh no no i understood your counterargument, i just didnt completely see eye to eye with all of your points. specifically that GSers have lower career aspirations, and that they face age discrimination. while that may be true for some of the older GS students many of them like me, are in their 20’s and i dont think, that we will be subjected to discrimination (at least i hope not…)
but what i was trying to point out to collegboy (if hes still reading these posts) that most GSers have unique qualities and skill sets (ie accomplished businessmen, army vets etc)</p>
<p>other than those 2 points you and I are on the same page…</p>
<p>As an outsider, I am extremely impressed with the GS program, particularly in light of the support provided to war and other military veterans. All y’all probably know more about it than I, but I love the notion that the program was created (in part, at least) as a means to welcome WWII veterans home. I also love the Yellow Ribbon program. Mostly, I love the Anderson Cooper special last year about the Iraq war veteran GS student who ended up at Columbia after the military would not let him return to Iraq after losing a leg in battle. His argument for returning to Iraq? “With only one leg left, the odds of losing a leg are reduced by 50%.” He had a 1.7 GPA in high school, but Columbia welcomed him. Warms my heart.</p>
<p>SchoolBoy, KingJames didn’t ask about City College (at least not in the post to which I responded). KJ asked if law schools would judge students with identical transcripts/test scores from GS and CC differently or the same. It’s apples & apples (say, fuji and granny smith), not apples & oranges.</p>
<p>I don’t know if prestige itself is KJ’s main concern, but as someone so concerned with it, you very well know that even people who did not do well in high school often attend private schools because private, in general, is seen in some social circles as a matter of prestige.</p>