Hello,
At my school, the math class after precalculus is AP Calc AB, and AP Calc BC/IB HL math after that (Further Math isn’t offered). BC students are expected to already know AB material, so taking BC without AB means you need to skip out of AB, and because I’m already skipping precalc this won’t be an option.
Current math progression (I’m a freshman):
9th: Geometry
10th: Algebra 2 trig
(summer precalc course)
11th: AP Calc AB
12th: AP Calc BC/IB HL
This means I need to stretch the two semesters of calculus out over two years, and I was thinking about taking them through community college in one year (junior) so I could take more math my senior year.
I’ve been teaching myself a LOT of math, and I should be able to start some basic calculus stuff this school year. I have the Life of Fred book series, and there isn’t a precalc book so I’ll be starting LoF Calculus soon. LoF Calculus isn’t as rigorous as many calculus classes would be, I know that, but it’s still a solid level of material and I’m not trying to replace a class with it. I know that I shouldn’t just focus on calculus because it’s far from the most important, and I plan on doing other stuff as well (AMC prep and proofs!).
I’d appreciate your input on why or why not to do this, and how colleges would see this.
Also, I should add that there are two possible tracks I’m considering:
11th: Calc I and Calc II
12th: 2 more math classes, maybe Calc III and MVC?
or
11th: Calc AB
12th: Calc II and another class
Probably the biggest downside to this for me is that I would like to be in the BC class because until that point your accelerated math students are just with older kids, by BC you have just the accelerated kids.
Just one question: what’s the rush? What are you trying to accomplish, other than cramming in as much math as possible?
Whenever I hear of someone self studying, my concern is that they’ll learn enough to pass the test or the course, but miss all the nuances that will turn out to be important down the road.
I’m a junior in calc BC and in my opinion you don’t need to take AB for it.
I also don’t understand why you are rushing. Regardless of how much you study, I’m not sure if colleges will be super impressed by you taking a class at a community college vs your high school (assuming they are the same course).
It’s kind of like paying to take English 101 at a college when you could just take AP lang. It all looks the same.
If you take calc BC your junior year and then go on to take math at a community college, that may be beneficial (that’s what I’m doing).
@michaela52 at OPs school AP Calc BC only covers the material in Calc 2 and expects students to know Calc 1/AP Calc AB before taking the class so it is not possible to take BC without AB.
Bear in mind that I am home schooled, so my perspective is different, but I think the idea of taking math classes at the community college is great. I am guessing you plan to go into a field where those math courses are needed? In that case, getting 3-4 done WOULD be good. It would give you more transfer credit than taking the AP classes, and it would make your freshmen and sophomore years easier. I did Algebra in 8th grade, Geometry in 9th, Trig in 10th, Pre-Calc in the fall of my junior year (yes, in one semester), then took Calc I the spring of my senior year and Calc II the fall of my senior year. Had the Calc III class not gotten cancelled, I would have been through there by the time I graduated. As for English 101 - a good SAT reading score can place you out of that at many colleges.
Now, a lot of this is contingent on whether the classes would transfer to the colleges you’re thinking to go to. Check and see, even if you don’t know if you will go to that college.
Benefits? Well, for one thing, classes are probably only twice a week. (I like that.) Another thing is that there isn’t a standardized test at the end to get college credit for the class. If you get a passing grade in the class, and the class transfers, then you get the credit.
It will also give you a taste of what college is like. Yes, it will be different at a 4-year university, but it will still be similar in some ways. Also, at least at my community college, there are not +/- grades. It’s A, B, C, etc. So, that means that you could get a 90.5% average in the class and still get an A, whereas at a high school that might be an A-. (I think.) I have never been on a +/- grading system yet, so I’m only guessing.
To clarify, the only thing I’ll be self studying with the intent of gaining credit is Precalc, and I’ll be taking a summer course so it’s not just self study. Although it would be foolish to refuse to discuss my decision, I’m very set upon skipping Precalc. I do want to be in a real calculus class.
My reasoning is that if I’m beginning to self-study calculus then I could handle a faster paced class, and the AB->BC progression seems pretty slow to me. Also, I think it might be beneficial to start adjusting to college courses as soon as possible.
Really, I just want to extend my math knowledge further.
Most likely, my school wouldn’t approve the first option but I could try for the second, although it might not be worth it for only a semester more.
I’m not at all set on doing this, I just wanted to explore the option.
As for colleges, I’m not thinking that this will boost my application, I just want to be sure it can’t harm me (AP’s being favored over a cc?) As for credits transferring, I could take the AP test anyway for Calc I and II, I’d just have to be careful with the remaining credits.
halcyonheather has said that colleges tend to prefer APs to community college classes, just because they’re more standardized, but I don’t think this (slight?) preference should necessarily dictate your choice, especially if you study for and take the AP test as well.
You’re right-- taking AB and then BC can be pretty slow if you’re a mathy sort of person, and you might enjoy getting through Calc at a pace perhaps a little closer to your ideal. Again, a desire for extending one’s knowlege of mathematics IS a perfectly valid reason to want to take more math.
On the other hand, it seems like Calc BC is a nice class at your school becasue it’s just the accelerated kids. It seems like the class is only one semester at your school, with the second semester spent doing other math, so even if you take AB junior year, you only have one year of slowish math.
If I were you, I might consider taking AB and another non-Calculus math class (on AoPS or the like) junior year and then AP BC/ IB HL senior year to ensure a full plate of mathematical goodness all the time. You wouldn’t be able to take potentially transferable CC classes in this setup, but I think it would be a challenging and fun load.
To clarify, the typical track would be:
11th: AP calc AB
12th: AP calc BC/IB HL math (two semesters, not one)
I was looking into changing it to
11th: Calc I and Calc II
12th: Two more semesters of math
(which my school is unlikely to accept)
or
11th: Calc AB
12th: Calc II and another semester of math
(a little more likely to be accepted)
I didn’t really think about AoPS, maybe by then I’ll finally be able to get to the intermediate number theory course, lol. Thanks for the suggestion!
In that case, I would definitely try arguing with your school for the first option. Double check that your state doesn’t have a dual enrollment (or even flex credit, maybe) law that would require your school to let you do so. I’m not sure if you go to private or public school-- public schools tend to be willing/forced to offer you more options, whereas private schools like asserting that they run the show (but at the same time will bend for good opportunities)-- but schools /can/ be talked into things that they don’t want to do. I do think the Calc I/ĪI junior year is the strongest option.
If that doesn’t work out, there is plenty of non-Calculus-sequence math you could do junior year alongside AB as I mentioned, and it would probably be quite interesting, but that plan doesn’t seem ideal.
The reason I doubt they’d let me do the first option is because I’ll be doing precalc the summer before, so I’ll basically be going from Algebra 2 trig -> Calc I, which I’m not really concerned about doing because I’ll have already learned some basic calculus by then…
It is a public school, though. Guidance is probably kinda sick of me for now since I was pushing to skip algebra 2/trig for so long (ended up being given the option of precalc or nothing), haha, and I have time so I might not bring it up until next year. I guess I could’ve posted this then, but it’s been on my mind lately. I’ll look into what my district’s rules about it are.