Competitive admission college clubs other than those prepping for investment banking or management consulting

"Competitive clubs" in colleges seems to have become mostly a thread about investment banking and management consulting recruiting.

How commonly are college clubs other than those prepping for investment banking or management consulting competitive admission?

Obviously, some are typically competitive (e.g. fraternities, sororities, and similar organizations), and some are capacity limited (e.g. a club intercollegiate sports team can only be so large, and a performing arts show needs only so many people).

But what about the range of potential clubs that typically fall outside of these categories? Are there colleges where clubs like a hiking club, a charitable volunteering club, a cultural club, a club relating to a major, etc. have competitive admission (to the club, as opposed to a major or college)?

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We have been told UVA and Georgetown have competitive service clubs.

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My daughter is at UCLA and looking for her niche in their literary and journalism offerings.

The Daily Bruin is quite competitive and their application is intense. The radio station is similar. She’s attending a literary magazine meeting today and that seems less competitive, and just discovered a journal called FEM that is interesting. It requires an application but she hasn’t looked into how challenging it is yet.

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Thanks for starting this thread. The focus on IB and consulting on that other thread was taking the focus away from the larger question of how common competitive clubs are.

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The climbing club was open at my kid’s school. Everyone there seemed to have 10 years of experience, so she never returned, but it was open.

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So, not a competitive club (which is the focus of this thread).

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From tours and knowing students, I have heard this for BC definitely (even volunteer type clubs) and Barnard/Columbia. D20 is not at either of those schools so has not experienced it firsthand.

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My DD attended UGA. Many clubs were competitive though many were not. My DD tended to be interested in the competitive clubs and had to apply and interview for them. They ran the gamut in terms of type of club.

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I would think that many of the clubs that compete would be competitive with cuts. My DSs Mock Trial Team cuts students that tryout.

This has been a big discussion among my local parent group. Almost all of us were naive and thought the social and service clubs wouldn’t be so competitive. This year we have discovered that the best study abroad programs are competitive too. Everyone wants the cool location where you can earn the most useful credits, but there are only 24 spots.

My D was fortunate to get the competitive one and sure enough it led to 3 TA offers and some great internships.

From the same group there are 2 kids at Cal, and there are competitive groups within the engineering majors that according to the parents are the pathway to the best internships.

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Thank you for starting this thread!

I have two D’s at William & Mary where they have found the clubs and orgs very open and welcoming. Anyone can sign up for outdoor trips—all levels of experience welcome. A friend who started rock climbing at W&M now works at the climbing wall in the rec center. Archery takes beginners, as does the swing dance club and quiz bowl. For some activities, only the strongest or most experienced students compete, but no one is barred from joining and participating in meetings and practices.

Both my D’s are also in sororities and claim that it is extremely rare that a potential new member does not receive a bid (as long as she is open to considering multiple houses). They say there is a true Panhellenic spirit among the different houses, and a sense that they are more similar than different. They both have close friends outside of Greek life.

My S24 has a wide variety of interests he wants to explore in college. He’s social but not a partier. He wants a thriving intramural and club scene, with lots of open doors to things he hasn’t tried yet. I’m hoping that most schools are like this.

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In many cases its simply a matter of space and needs. Like any job.
My DD applied to be part of the student run EMS squad at her University. Was told 175 applied and given first interviews. Only 36 were given second interviews and finally only 10 were chosen. On the other hand she joined the running club at her school and anyone who wanted to join could.

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S23 has been trying to investigate Formula SAE and Baja SAE teams at the schools where he’s applying. These teams typically have multiple engineering subteams (a lot of mechanical engineers plus a sprinkling of other engineering majors), plus business and operations. The process for joining SAE teams seems to vary a lot by school. Some are open to anyone willing to put in time to learn, some have a more competitive process with applications, some only accept applications when there is an opening on one of the subteams. For schools that have an application process, it has not been very easy for him as a prospective student to find out exactly how competitive the application process is (how many apply, how many are accepted).

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Wow, that is stressful. I’m sure you have put in a lot of effort already to research which schools even have clubs in his activity, and now to have to gamble on which clubs will accept him!

This whole topic has been eye-opening for me. That competitive clubs would even exist never occurred to me. There was nothing like any of this at the LAC I attended. Even for groups limited by size for practical reasons (traveling teams for sports, acapella groups, theater casts etc.) there were still always ways to participate. I croak like a frog, but I still sang in a choir!

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If your LAC was small like most LACs, perhaps the small size meant that the number of students interested in these activities was small enough that going way over the capacity limits was uncommon.

If a club needs 20 people (but cannot go much over), and 1% of the students are interested in the activity, the club at a 2,000 student school can accept all of them. But a 20,000 student school will have 10 interested students for each slot.

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Your mention of competitive college-sponsored study abroad programs makes me think of the stereotypical high school service trip to do unskilled labor in impoverished Latin America. This inevitably leads to the essay with the theme of: “I never knew how lucky and privileged I was until I saw true poverty in Latin America. Even though it was only a ten day trip (five of which were spent touring the city where the plane landed), it changed my entire perspective on life and now I want to go into a life of service to the poor. Your college will give me the skills I need to do that!” Never mind that the 4K that the parents spent to send Buffy alone (let alone the other 19 US teens on the trip) to dig latrines in an impoverished rural village could probably have bought the materials to build a village school, with the villagers’ own labor, and paid one local carpenter to direct them. College admissions officers saw so many of these essays that they became inured to them, discounted them. They did more harm than help to applications.

The reality is that study abroad programs sponsored by US colleges are usually at rack tuition rate, the same cost as a semester at the US college. This can be a very good deal for the student on enormous fin aid, since their fin aid will be applied to the abroad semester’s cost, and may be the only way for them to have an abroad experience during college, but it’s often not a good deal for the self-pay student, since the actual cost of tuition and housing in the foreign country is usually a small fraction of even US public college tuition, let alone private. The other issue is that the students are usually grouped together, especially when going to a non-English speaking country, and wind up not becoming fluent in the language and culture of the country.

An alternative arrangement for a person who really wants to become fluent in the language and culture of the target country is to study the country’s language while in college, and then design one’s own year abroad during college as a gap year, living in the dorms of the college abroad with that country’s students, taking classes with them, and hopefully paying the much, much lower tuition for that country, even as a foreign student. This isn’t feasible for every part of the world, but it is feasible for many areas. One of my kids did this “sideways” route to study abroad. It was far, far cheaper, and the kid wound up acquiring a much higher level of skill than that obtained by the typical junior year abroad program student, because no time was spent with other Americans, or even English-speakers.

The same principle applies to other competitive admission clubs that students join in order to enhance grad school applications. Which means more? That the student made it into the school’s competitive admission medical service club for premeds, or that the student worked a summer job in a medical clinic for migrant workers in agricultural areas? Obviously, it’s possible for students to seek out and even create opportunities for themselves that are far more valuable than those found in a competitive admissions club, in any field. Can’t get into the engineering project club? Get together a few colleagues, approach a prof, get sponsored, and start your own project group. But I agree, it’s definitely worth considering whether the school has an atmosphere of tiered selection for career-related groups, vs an inclusive, open-admissions policy for career-related groups.

As for highly exclusive social groups, that’s just life. There always are going to be clubs like that, anywhere one goes, whether overtly or subtly. The skills learned by founding a new club, or doing an end-run around the club in order to achieve the same, or more likely a better, outcome will serve the person well throughout life.

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I recall that one of the reasons that my friend’s son chose RPI was that there were many openings in mech E clubs (specifically, car clubs), so that he’d be able to join one or more in his freshman year. Another school only took sophomores or juniors, since they didn’t have enough club spots open.

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Would you mind sharing which colleges you’ve found fall into which buckets of selectivity?

I’m not disputing this point, but it’s not a foregone conclusion. The college sponsoring the program means that your classes will transfer pretty cleanly back to your home institution, vs. any of the hassles of trying to get your gap year classes approved and transferred back to specific departments and any major requirements. The study abroad program I participated in had us in classes at the foreign universities, but students had the choice of where to live. The majority of students chose to get apartments with other Americans, spoke lots of English, and didn’t improve their foreign language as much as they could have. But there were others of us who lived in the university dorm and adapted much more to the culture. An American friend and I were living in the dorm, and we promised to only speak the foreign language to each other (except about 1 or 2 incidents during the year). The director of the program gave us about a quarter each time we had a program excursion visiting regional sites because she was so happy to always hear us speaking the foreign language. Of course, the value proposition of the university-sponsored study abroad also probably greatly depends on the cost of tuition. $60k full-pay at a private vs. $15k full-pay at one’s state flagship is a big difference.

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Students studying abroad need to verify the transfer credit policies of each and every course they take at another institution. It is NOT a “foregone conclusion” that just because you are on a college sponsored program, your credits will automatically be applied.

At most institutions, the department chair, the academic dean, even the provost have enormous latitude in deciding which courses taken elsewhere are reasonable substitutes for their own courses. I have seen dozens of students get tripped up by this. They assume the credits transfer- and they do- but they “count” towards a distribution requirement, they “count” as an elective, but do not “count” towards their major. Many kids I know who ended up as super-seniors did so because they naively thought “credits are credits”. At a certain point, one more general elective does you no good towards your graduation requirements, and you end up with an extra semester tacked on to the end.

Caveat emptor. Check, verify. And save everything from the overseas institution- reading list, papers, exams, professors notes and comments, lab reports. Paying an extra semester is very painful, even if you’ve saved some money by studying overseas…

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Very true. In my own experience, many classes had already been determined what they would transfer as prior to enrolling in them. And there was an issue with a program that I was getting a certificate in who did not want to grant as much credit toward the certificate because they wanted more classes taken on-campus in the U.S. So it’s not necessarily a seamless process, but I would suspect it’s easier than if the university has no formal relationship with the college and as to whether the U.S. school would even accept the foreign university’s credits.

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