<p>All,</p>
<p>In looking at top schools w/ BFA programs and surfing around these threads, I've not been able to find the answer to my probably obvious question. That is, what is the difference between attending a conservatory (BoCo) and a University with a strong MT/BFA program (NYU)? Do potential employers consider one more prestigious than the other when looking at resumes/transcripts?</p>
<p>There are about ten billion different opinions about this, but here's mine. Potential employers WILL consider prestige, but this is only relevant in applying for office-type jobs, not for auditioning. If you're auditioning for a show, they don't care what your education background is, as long as you're talented/fit the role/all the other factors that go into casting. Essentially, it comes down to your preferences and perhaps your certainty of your future profession. If academics are important to you, or if you think you may want a career shift in the future, get a BFA at a university (especially a prestigious university like U of M or CMU). If you're absolutely sure that the only thing you will ever do is perform, get a BFA at a place like BoCo. Of course, you can always change your path in life, but it would be a lot easier to apply for grad school (other than MFAs) or a normal job with a degree from a well-known university, BFA or not, than with a degree from a straight conservatory. I know of a woman who got her bachelor's degree in voice performance from U of M, then once she graduated ended up going to U of M law school, instead (mind you, one of the top ten law schools in the nation). Anything's possible. But if you're worried about getting a job, chances are you should look at a BA, not a BFA, or consider a dual degree BA/BFA program. A BFA doesn't do much for employability in the workforce, no matter where you get it, and it is never a guarantee that you will be cast in shows.</p>
<p>I personally think that a going to a certain school or certain type of school will not affect if you get work as an actor or not. I think it entirely depends on the training you get (except the rare occasion where the person on the other side of the table is an alum of your alma mater and is choosing between you and someone from a different school and you're completely and entirely on level playing ground otherwise - a rare situation). I think it's most important to go to the school that gives you what you want and need in order to be prepared amply for working in the field. If you are not an academic person and just want to sing/act/dance for the rest of your life, certain schools will be more appealing than others. On the other hand, if you want to take academic classes and think that an education is important in a person's identity as an actor, you'll be looking at a completely different set of schools.</p>
<p>don't be fooled by "Universities". A lot of "Universities" have a conservatory curriculum, like NYU. You actually have to research the program by looking into how many credits are required outside of your major and how many in your major. I go by this outline:
3/4-all credits in major: Conservatory
1/2-3/4 credits in major: Conservatory-style</p>
<br>
<p>1/2 credits in major: Liberal Arts style</p>
<br>
<p>But just because "Conservatory" isn't in the name, doesn't mean that the program isn't a conservatory or conservatory-style program. For instance, Webster University, I consider, is conservatory-style and Elon is more of a Liberal Arts- style program, whereas Ithaca College is a conservatory.</p>
<p>Just wanted to clear that up :D</p>
<p>NYU may have a conservatory-style curriculum in acting and musical theater. But kids there take a lot of academic classes, as well. In fact, at my D's recent audition for NYU, the teachers giving the info session stressed that if ALL one wants to do is perform and study performing, do NOT come to NYU or you will be disappointed. Kids studying musical theater and/or acting at NYU take (as I understand it) three days a week of studio classes and two days a week of academics, so it is like a double major.</p>
<p>At our daughter's recent audition at Webster, I thought that the head of the Fine Arts College was unusually honest and direct when asked this question at the info. session. His answer was that a conservatory should be viewed as a "trade school" for theater. he was speaking specifically about Webster Conservatory at. Webster U., but this might be a good way of viewing any of the true conservatory programs.</p>
<p>I don't know whether having a BFA from a conservatory vs. a non-conservatory BFA has implications for the ability to pursue an advanced degree. That's a really good question that I hope someone can comment on.</p>
<p>The comments and questions on this thread underscore the critical importance of taking a close look at the curriculum of ech school under consideration. There is a great deal of variance between different BFA programs. As pointed out, at NYU students take 3 days of studio and 2 days of L.A. per week. In contrast, for example, at CMU (a school with a very fine academic reputation), MT BFA students have virtually no room in the curriculum to take classes outside of the department. Then there are schools like Syracuse (and many other well regarded schools) where the curriculum permits only about 8 classes outside of the department. In many respects, as a general observation, in practical terms most BFA programs (with noted exceptions) permit little in the way of L.A. exposure regardless of whether it is at a "university" or a "conservatory".</p>
<p>As to advanced degrees, my impression is that a well developed resume of work experience is more important for purposes of an MFA than where you went to school. As to other types of advanced degrees, I know, for example that when it comes to a J.D. degree, GPA and LSAT scores are what count (admissions to law school are metrics driven).</p>
<p>Agh, the ongoing dilemma...</p>
<p>I have to say that my D had a most eclectic mix of conservatory, semi conservatory, and liberal arts schools on her final list. </p>
<p>Whenever she would speak to either current students, alumnae or people in the industry, she would get as many opinions as the number of people she asked opinions from.</p>
<p>At the end of the day, the choice is personal. Conservatory may be viewed by some as a way out for those who "are not interested in academics", or by others, for the "ultra dedicated to their craft" types.</p>
<p>As far as the Liberal Arts option, some will say "what liberal arts?", as all classes may be geared towards the drama major. </p>
<p>At the end of the day, it is really all about the individual, where you get in, where will you be happy, and where do you see yourself getting the most out of your training :). </p>
<p>Remember, whatever is meant to be, is going to be, no matter what :).</p>
<p>yea I see what you're all saying about it being a personal choice... an interesting dilemma...</p>
<p>This is not a question of how your auditions will go after you graduate. The truth on that is, your eventual employment will rely most heavily on how well you audioned, how right you are for the parts available, and, to a lesser extent, what kind of professional connections you've made either yourself or through your representation. What training program you completed has a very limited shelf life. After you make a few productions, your work ethic, and abilitly to be a reasonable member of the team will also begin to enter into your future casting.</p>
<p>What matters with the program you attend is that you get the training you need to be an effective auditioner and that you are nutured in an enviroment that will give you an effective set of life skiils to deal with the "real' world.</p>
<p>The question of conservatory vs. university setting is a choice you make along the way. If you get into a quality program with good mentoring, and you put personal effort into your training - you will be fine in any case.</p>
<p>Some might argue that the university setting might do a better job at the over all "life skills" part of your preparation - but it is still, largely, a matter of you visiting programs and figuring out where you fit in. The only other parameter might be if you can academically qualify to be admitted, then succeed, in some universty based programs.</p>
<p>Good luck to you on this journey.</p>
<p>when i started looking last year i was so frustrated because every school had its own intricacies-- just because it was a "conservatory" within a big unversity didn't mean it had the same pattern of lib. arts/major courses that all the other conservatories-in-universities has. you become very educated about the particulars of every school, and figure out what's a deal breaker and what's not-- and CC is amazing for that too.</p>
<p>You say that Elon is not a Conservatory type. Can’t find on their website information that would clarify this. How many regular classes do you take outside the MT major? My daughter prefers to go to a regular school and get a Musical Theatre major. What would everyone recommend?</p>
<p>rainbowwoman…When my s applied and auditioned for Elon last year, it was encouraging to hear that the University at Elon strongly encourages a full well rounded education. I believe the MT BFA requires 68 credits of the approx. 120 needed for the degree. Here is a link that may be helpful.</p>
<p>[Elon</a> University - Department of Performing Arts](<a href=“http://www.elon.edu/e-web/academics/elon_college/performing_arts/music_maj.xhtml]Elon”>http://www.elon.edu/e-web/academics/elon_college/performing_arts/music_maj.xhtml)</p>
<p>My son is at Elon, and I can tell you that there is a strong academic core of 58-62 hours required of all majors, including statistics, a literature, a lab science, etc. However, many students will earn at least a little academic credit through AP and IB tests. The core also requires a year of foreign language, but you can earn those credits by scoring high enough on the Elon foreign language placement exams. This is my son’s second year, but he already has enough credit hours to be a junior. He now is taking more electives towards his major, and added a music tech minor.</p>
<p>As I’ve looked more closely, I think I’ve seen a school or two where a few of the liberal arts requirements are satisfied by what I’d consider “conservatory” type classes- such as music history for a history requirement. So look carefully. My D may prefer a conservatory approach, but if she gets into a great MT school with a math & science requirement, she’ll just have to deal with it. Not that many get to choose from various options, after the results are out.</p>
<p>The question was asked about grad school after conservatory- I went to a small, serious music conservatory, without math or science for four years. Then I went to a Big 10 university for an M.S. in Communications. My advisors required me to take a few undergrad classes in the major. Your experience may differ…</p>
<p>In Malcolm Gladstone’s interesting book, Outliers, he makes a case for “mastery” of a field requiring about 10,000 hours of practice/experience. He cites numerous examples of people who looked like “geniuses” but who, if you delved into their personal histories, turned out to be talented people who had the advantage of many, many hours of experience very early in their careers—some of those during high school.</p>
<p>If you’re in the camp that believes acting success is based more on practice and experience than luck or raw, native talent (which most of us would assume is a given), the conservatory approach gives students the opportunity to graduate from a program with —interestingly enough—about 10,000 hours of theater experience. Forty hours per week works out to about 2,000 hours per year. Many programs require weekend and evening rehearsals for shows, and most kids do projects on their own and during school vacations, which would more make up the time they are not in school. In terms of hours, the conservatory approach would SEEM to be a surer path to technical mastery of the craft.</p>
<p>However, there’s no way to account for the impact of personal experience and the insights gained from a more traditional education on the individual. The effect of one’s life experience, including the people one meets and the mentors who take an interest in one’s career, are of incalculable value that throws off any attempt to make a “one size fits all” rule about training for an acting career. JMHO :)</p>
<p>Skipsmom - please take this as a friendly inquiry. My understanding of most conservatory programs is that they still run pretty much along the lines on academic semesters - so about 15-17 weeks per semester, and run usually four years. My question is what do you base you 2000 per year on and why do you use 5 years for your analysis? Whether 10,000 is hours is a credible bench mark is also an interesting question - but I am interested in how you arrived at your numbers. Thanks in advance.</p>
<p>Nice to see you posting again, Skipsmom. 
It’s always good to have a range of opinions on the subjects discussed here. </p>
<p>That’s a fascinating point you make about the 10,000 hours. I think there are some kids who already have so much theatrical experience (through years of summer programs, wonderful high school theatre departments, and the like) that they are well on their way by the time college comes. And…depending partly on what their high school experience was like…they may be incredibly hungry for the intellectual growth offered by a BA program.</p>
<p>Other kids, who may have come to theatre relatively late, may instead want to plunge right into the intensity of a conservatory-type program. That’s what my son was pleased to have the opportunity to do, and he couldn’t be happier.</p>
<p>When I was an undergrad, I attended a college where students took only four classes per semester, but those classes were very intense and in-depth. I think part of the philosophy is that if you study <em>anything</em> with sufficient thoroughness, the enrichment spills over into other areas of your intellectual life.</p>
<p>This can apply, also, to the theatre-related liberal arts classes at BFA programs. My son is currently taking a course entitled “Introduction to Dramatic Literature,” and he has been learning about a lot more in the class than “just drama” or “just literature.”</p>
<p>mtdog, it’s just a “guesstimate” of my own based on what I have seen personally. First, I worked on the assumption that a full time job consists of about 2000 hours (40 hours a week, 50 weeks per year–that’s just two weeks of vacation). Kids in the conservatory programs we visited usually work between 10 and 6 or 9 and 5 every week day. Some programs stick to this schedule more than others, but we found that most kids in a true conservatory program are fully engaged in their craft for about 7 or 8 structured hours per day. Not all of that is actual performing; a lot of it is drama education, reading plays, learning the history of theater, etc., but I would consider that type of targeted education to be a part of the experience that directly contributes to an acting career. Other time is spent in costuming, learning to sew, work on sets, working the lights and being on a show crew. When a show is being rehearsed the kids are doing this at night, whether they are acting or on crew. Additional, out of class time is spent learning lines and rehearsing in small groups on their own. At one school we were told by students that their classes met on Saturdays for half a day and that they rehearsed at night from 7-11 almost half the year. In my opinion, this time—plus the summer shows that many of these kids participate in during vacations—more than makes up for the less-traditional work schedule of school breaks and days off. </p>
<p>Kids who have gone to performing arts high schools have a jump on this training and if they go the conservatory route they graduate with even more hours. We’ve seen some juniors in MT conservatory programs who also attended performing arts high schools and they are as “polished” and mature as performers many years older. It’s obviously an advantage to have this breadth and depth of experience behind you as you enter this field. </p>
<p>My estimates are just that—but they are based on questions I’ve asked students and at info sessions at a pretty wide range of conservatory programs. One thing is clear, and that is that these kids are kept VERY busy. This isn’t meant to denigrate a BA program in theater or performing arts in any way—both the BA and BFA are just two of many paths one can take to a theater career. In some ways I think that programs like NYU where academics are an important part of the experience, are the most difficult. The students there are leading parallel lives as traditional college students AND conservatory students… a combination that would seem to demand higher level organizational skills that would challenge any adult. </p>
<p>Anyway, after a few years of observation, that’s my take. It may be completely wrong! :)</p>
<p>In regard to the original question, do employers consider one more prestigious than the other (BFA vs. BA), I am not sure that employers care. Given that employers are hopefully directors/theater companies, they are going to primarily care about your audition. They will look at your resume, including your education (but not your transcripts) and your experience, but mostly at your audition. Of course if the director happens to have graduated from NYU or BoCo, and you happen to be from the same school, it may give you that initial “in.” But in the end, during an audition, you are on the same level as any BA or BFA graduate, or for that matter, your fellow actor who chose not to attend college at all.</p>