Consider College Outside the US?

My DD (just started junior year in high school) yesterday asked if we would allow her to go to college outside the United States. Specifically, she is interested in looking at programs in Germany. She said that there are many German programs who instruct in English only but that she would be able to pick up German by living there for three years.

At this point, I’m not sure how serious she nor do I have enough facts to form any type of opinion.

Any thoughts?

1 Like

Quick & dirty, and obviously madly generalizing:

For Germany:

Pros: super inexpensive / nearly free, international experience

Cons: 1) courses are super-structured- few choices/electives, and classes are all in your major (so it is important to be 100% sure of what you want to study); 2) very hands-off- not a lot of support, and while classes may be in English, the system itself operates in German, so being able to navigate the college bureaucracy can be a challenge for somebody with no German; 3) in general, not campus centric- clubs by interests, but not much in the way of college spirit in the US sense. Most now have housing for international students, but most domestic students live at home or live out; 4) tendency towards large, old-school lectures and assessment by a few big exams.

For international: all the cons (except the German- substitute for the local language) apply (to varying degrees). The Netherlands have a couple of English language programs that they are trying to craft in an LAC-type model which might be interesting.

If the cons don’t put her (or you!) off, maybe try a challenge: if she can get to (say) B1* fluency by the start of senior year (that is, in a year) she can apply :slight_smile:

*B1:
Can understand the main points of clear standard input on familiar matters regularly encountered in work, school, leisure, etc.
Can deal with most situations likely to arise while travelling in an area where the language is spoken.
Can produce simple connected text on topics that are familiar or of personal interest.
Can describe experiences and events, dreams, hopes and ambitions and briefly give reasons and explanations for opinions and plans.

The Scottish model is closest to the US, with an initial year that allows some choice (4 year course, not 3). Glasgow, Edinburgh & St Andrews are all strong options.

1 Like

Here’s an article from a few years back about US students attending college in Germany. Definitely is something that will make your bank account happy: https://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-32821678

I think the video that accompanies the article does a good job of highlighting some of the limitations as well as benefits.

1 Like

Nice link, @calmom!

1 Like

It may be cheaper, but not that much cheaper than Florida schools when you add in travel, housing, etc. Is it the experience she wants, since it won’t be an American college experience with sports and a ton of activities on campus all the time?

My sister lived her junior year in Germany and really enjoyed it and was fairly fluent in German (and French, double major). She traveled all over Europe and North Africa. She loved it, but I don’t think she would have wanted to do it for 3 years and not have the American college experience too.

1 Like

Just make sure she really look into the qualifications. We’ve known a few kids go international. Two actually had to take additional AP courses over summer and winter semester before starting in Spring due to requirement differences. Not a huge deal but something she should keep an eye on if she’s serious.

1 Like

Is your daughter resilient, adventurous, independent, thrives on adversity? And does she know exactly that what she wants to do and why?

These qualities would be needed for her to not just get a free education, but to enjoy herself and thrive.
The article linked is a start, but a bit misleading in the students portrayed. Grad students are considered grown ups on both side of the Atlantic, and grad school is only for a year or two.

Moving to Germany, at the age of 18, just after high school, is different.

German students don’t “go to college”. They aim to get an education or training in a very specific subject, and before they think they know what that is, they don’t go. If they change their minds and aim for an unrelated subjects they have to start over.

University students in Germany are not considered “kids” - not only because they may be somewhat older in fact, bit they are not expected to need support, handholding, tutoring. Most of them live on their own, they have been drinking legally for years.

“Very little support” means so little it wouldn’t even register for a US student. If you are having trouble in a subject seek out a professor in their office, chances are high that at the professor won’t be there at all, b) the professor is there but the secretary won’t let you speak to him (very occasionally her) or c) you manage to meet them and state your problem and they will tell you, more or less politely, to pick another subject.

Few universities will have a campus to speak of, and housing will be spread all over town. German students are used to seek out their extracurricular activities in the community, specifically sports.
If you rely on “picking up the language”, your social life will be very limited and every interaction outside the English speaking classroom fraught with difficulties.

If your daughter Is someone who loves a challenge, who has a clear path in life comparable to a grad school student, this might work for her.

I’d also add, though this advice may be somewhat outdated, that I would recommend Germany only for STEM subjects or fina arts and music, and would look very. Carefully at the school.

1 Like

Probably the most popular – and easiest – place for Americans to go to college outside the U.S. is Canada. The tuition savings are not as sensational as they are in Germany, of course, and the cities where the top-reputation universities are located are expensive places to live. Some of the drawbacks are similar.

1 Like

^ The UK as well.

Farther away, but they are almost Canada. :wink:

1 Like

When I want to gauge interest in something, i see how much effort they will make.

First look for a local german language school so she can start learning German. See if she does this.
Maybe tehn have her do a student exchange program through YFU or AFS or the like.

Check https://www.daad.de/en/ to see if she has the qualifications. They do seem to expect some level of German before you get there.

And like others…how does your daughter do in an unstructured environment? I know personally I am terrible with that.

1 Like

but that she would be able to pick up German by living there for three years.<<<<<<<<<<

This cracks me up, really, is this even a real consideration?

My nephew is attending college in Den Haag with classes in English. It has been a great experience. Many Dutch speak English and several other languages.

His younger sister is at the international U in Madrid and it is much more difficult. Everything besides actual class time is in Spanish only and that includes emails from the professors regarding the coursework. She went in with basic Spanish skills and it has been difficult.

Like others have said, a “high-intermediate” or better level of the local language would allow basic functioning on her own.

1 Like

My son attends one of those Canada schools (McGill) and it has been a great experience for him. He’s picked up enough French for his journeys deeper into Montreal; it’s not really that necessary in Downtown Montreal (though polite). He’s grown up tremendously in his first year as the culture of the school is all about students stepping up. Are there frustrations at times? Yes. But for him the pros far outweigh the cons.

Our Boston area high school sends about two dozen kids to international schools each year…typically Canada, UK, German, and France. For the right kid, it’s a great experience.

1 Like

“cities where the top-reputation universities are located are expensive places to live”

Toronto and Vancouver are very expensive cities. Montreal is not expensive.

I don’t know how expensive the cities in Germany are to live in, but my guess is that most of the major cities in Europe are not cheap.

1 Like

What does she want to study, specifically? Budget (not all the free-tuition German universities offer English language tuition in every subject, if that’s one of OP’s D’s drivers)? Has she studied any German at all so far? Is Germany the only choice?

1 Like

@DadTwoGirls Montreal anywhere near McGill is very expensive. Perhaps not as expensive as anywhere near the University of Toronto, but my Montreal relatives pay a lot more for a lot less than my Chicago relatives, in very similar neighborhoods (and Chicago isn’t exactly cheap).

The German universities discussed in the BBC article are not in expensive locations – small university towns, and East Berlin.

1 Like

German cities in general are pretty inexpensive compared to major European cities outside Germany.

1 Like

Montreal is inexpensive compared to most large U.S. cities. Yes, if you insist on being in the McGill ghetto or a fancy high rise downtown you will be gouged. Cross Parc into the Plateau and rents drop significantly.

Eastern Germany is incredibly cheap, though even harder to navigate for someone without the language, since the older generation (well, down to people in their late thirties really) may not speak or understand English very well or at all. Caveat: parts of eastern Germany may be very hostile, even scandalously dangerous, for people of colour.

Most parts of the country, including large cities at night, are very safe, one of the big benefits of living as a young woman in Germany. Munich, one of the cities mentioned (which is incidentally one of the most expensive cities in the country, though still cheaper than the most expensive places in the US) is perfectly safe to navigate on a bike or public transport.

It appears that the OP has been scared away for good, though…

1 Like

Kids from my D’s international school go all over the world. This year the most popular locations for university were Amsterdam, the UK, Canada and Australia. The processes vary widely from US college applications so I would recommend working with a counselor who has extensive experience in helping students apply abroad. If you are counting on federal aid you also need to make sure the college abroad will allow you to qualify for US federal aid (there is a list available online).

1 Like