You have a child at Michigan. Great school, and both my children considered attending. But over the past few years it has had numerous issues related to sexual assault of women. Is that not important to consider?
Just to make it clear that I am not picking on you, my D attended UChicago. Now that she has graduated from there, I think it was nearly an ideal intellectual environment that showed her what she was capable of. She loves that place.
But if she were a high school senior applying there today, I would discourage her from applying there. Why? Because in the past year three UChicago students have been shot dead from violence that was completely unrelated to anything they did. And far more have been violently assaulted. The buses into the city are often dangerous. It’s just life, and death, in that city today.
This is a serious question we are currently grappling with. My S23 plans to study law eventually. Philosphy/poly sci in undergrad.
Many of the colleges on his list are southern flagships, for the merit (critically important to us). A couple are Jesuit schools. A couple others are in non-Southern states, but states that have now banned abortion or will soon.
Our dilemma: Do we remove the schools in those states from consideration? Do we decide that not one dollar of our money goes to support those states, including even application fees?
Or do we decide to keep the colleges on the list, reasoning that the kid could possibly make a difference down the line in one of these states? Southern Poverty Law Center, in Alabama, is a big draw to him. Social justice law is what he wants to practice.
As you are well aware, most of us here are parents. When it comes to our children, there is nothing that is “simplistic”. Getting shot can happen anywhere. The health of our kids has been squarely changed by Dobbs.
You get that, right? Dobbs has fragmented this country on a state by state basis. I am not willing to risk my kids’ health because of politics and the view of 5 people.
I would say…He should choose the school where he can get the best education he can afford. If merit money is important then choose the school that gives the best merit money that will keep expenses down.
I have long been affiliated with SPLC from all over the world. You don’t need to be in Montgomery, AL to volunteer with them.
You and DS have to make a choice: SCOTUS has clearly laid down a choice to fragment the US on a state-by-state basis. For some, no one cares. I am not in that boat. You have to decide for yourself and DS where you are at.
My issue is specifically related to the health of my children and the fragmentation Dobbs has caused (we are actually doing a college visit to a school that would have been wonderful but for the Dobbs’ implications). But for this thread and the events from Friday onwards, I had never thought of it. Others may have a conceptual or political issue with Dobbs (which I share), but my concerns are much simpler than that. It’s about health.
There are 1000s of colleges in the country in places that are hospitable to our kids’ views and their health. And there are now several others that are not and that are antithetical to this. It’s up to my kids, but I clearly will recommend that they stay away from certain schools solely because of the state that they are in.
I wouldn’t necessarily take the colleges off the list, especially if merit is involved and needed. I don’t blame colleges for this, they are not the ones who did this. Making the final decision, that won’t happen for several months. At that point you can evaluate things.
I have a D in FL that just graduated. When she first went to school there, FL was different. She is now working for her dream company. They are supportive and have stated that publicly. That is wonderful, but it doesn’t help her. She is old enough and financially stable enough to handle a pregnancy- it’s pregnancy itself and the possibility of a complication that will make her leave Florida. She isn’t leaving yet, but will seriously consider it as soon as her lease is up.
I felt Roe would fall 6 years ago, it was just a matter of time. D2 still applied to a few schools in the south,but ultimately decided she no longer wanted to be in the south. There were other factors, but she knew her rights were safer up north and it turns out she was right.
I think the immediate consequences Dobbs will affect the college considerations of certain segments of the population and not so much for others. However, I don’t think it will have a noticeable effect on overall application numbers but could affect applicant geographic and ideological diversity.
The discussion that I’ve heard about, in regards to this issue, is that parents and kids from CA, MA, NY, NJ, MD, WA, etc., will send less college apps to states where there are abortion bans or severe restrictions. That’ll make it easier on some applicants and more difficult for others.
Perhaps yours is the simplistic view. Colleges can do quite a lot to provide for the safety and well-being of their students, despite the crime statistics nearby. Yale and Chicago are good examples, and while Chicago has experienced some horrific high profile crimes recently, neither are significantly more dangerous for students than Rice according to crime statistics.
And unlike Chicago and Yale with regard to safety, Rice can next to nothing to provide adequate healthcare access to its female students. According to many interpretations its healthcare providers cannot even recommend an abortion provider for a student whose has serious medical issues related to pregnancy, or even if the student wants an abortion without a medical emergency.
You made a comment above about whether this thread should even apply to male students. In Texas, under S8, any overzealous citizen can sue anyone for “aiding and abetting” an abortion. So if a student (male or female) gives another student a ride to a clinic, they are potentially subject to a potential lawsuit. Rice cannot protect them from liability.
And then there are the related healthcare issues that will fall to the wayside as the those in favor of limiting personal freedom become ever more emboldened.
As for your theory that federal government should pass legislation, you are misreading the direction this current court is heading. Such a measure probably would not survive scrutiny with the current court.
We were warned in early 2000s how dangerous USoCal was. USC did what it could to help make it safer. Both our kids chose to attend it and get a good education and felt safe in their years there. S was able to secure good merit to make his education there more affordable.
UAz and ASU have given generous merit awards to students they like for many decades. I haven’t checked on Az’s abortion/reproductive rights laws but know CA is committed to being a sanctuary for reproductive rights.
These health and safety issues are not merely theoretical and are definitely worth considering by applicants and their families
If a state makes choices illegal, it doesn’t matter what a campus wants, they are illegal in that state.
My kids are prepared with Plans A (effective contraceptives), B, and C, which they can take anywhere with them. Frankly, that is a level of protection within their control that should make any further options moot.
I expect that is true for many college women. Getting more of Plans A, B, and C into the hands of women would hopefully moot this issue for most ( not all, obviously).
The knock-on effects for these universities could be nothing short of catastrophic, with potential for substantial talent exodus/brain drain of students and faculty. These institutions had been on the rise, but may now be set back decades through no fault of their own…
I have sons and a daughter. The difference is my girl now has fewer rights, and it absolutely makes a difference where she elects to be educated.
Attending a college in a state where she is less than equal and could suffer harm is untenable. For boys, it is not the same. That is what this court has unleashed on our country.
No amount of scholarship or prestige will be enough to make that right. Period.
Two moderators and one administrator have repeatedly instructed users to stay on topic, and we have still had to delete many off-topic posts. The last straw was receiving a report at 1 AM asking why we hadn’t deleted a post. Believe it or not moderators need to sleep occasionally. I’m closing the thread for now.