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<p>Would you care to guarantee that?</p>
<p>I’ve had a lot of success with the non-traditional route but I wouldn’t assume that someone else could pull it off in the same way.</p>
<p>I’ve been wonder if we could come up with a CC scholarship fund for kids like this.</p>
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<p>I’m going by the OP’s initial post where he/she said the parental contribution and his/her contribution combined is somewhere in the neighborhood of $4-5 grand per year after the package is factored in. In absolute dollar terms…that’s slightly lower than what I was expected to pay after my near-full ride was factored in back when I was attending college in the mid-late ‘90s. If we factored in inflation…the OP’s/parents’ contribution is noticibly lower than what I was expected to pay after factoring in my scholarship. </p>
<p>I managed to work part-time/summer jobs, take course overloads, and took out a small loan in my senior year to cover all that. Within six months of graduation, I was debt-free.</p>
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<p>Overall his deal looks good on paper but things can go awry over four years. Does everyone in this program at top schools succeed? The four-year graduation rate at Dartmouth is 88% which is very, very high. But that still leaves 12% that don’t graduate.</p>
<p>My personal perspective if given this opportunity would be to take it and make it work to the best of my ability and do something else if I ran into problems or better opportunities (which is more or less what I did).</p>
<p>We don’t need to “come up with a CC scholarship fund for kids like this” - this student hit the jackpot that so many dream about. The offer is from a top flight school, and it requires only a token contribution on the part of the student and his family. It doesn’t get better than this. It can easily, *easily *be handled by the student alone; most students here have a much larger nut to crack. If he’s worried, he could take out the standard loan for a year or two just for savings, a buffer against a rainy day - it really shouldn’t be necessary to touch that money.</p>
<p>The university has removed all financial hurdles, and cleared the way for a wonderful educational experience. Assuming that the student has reached the age of majority, the situation is completely under his control. His only problem will be to get his parents on board, but the opportunity is so attractive, that this should be doable - others have contributed some very good ideas. In any case, they will come around sooner or later.</p>
<p>I’m really surprised by all the naysayers here. Is the glass 88% full or 12% empty?</p>
<p>This young man can make it happen, and I think that he will make it happen.</p>
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<p>I’d want to see the demographics of the 12% to answer that.</p>
<p>I guess that you would call me a “naysayer” but the truth is I’m not. I feel, quite strongly, that the full scenario is not in play. I find it offensive that parents egg a kid on to do something as life changing (and enhancing) without knowing the full picture. WE do NOT know, nor can we know, all the circumstances around this decision. Yes, this may be a case of parents who want to hold on…or it may be a case of parents who can’t come up with their contribution and are afraid to tell their child the truth.</p>
<p>I find it offensive when parents say that there should be an intervention to make the parents see the light. (the light of the poster that is). I find it absurd that some says, “Well, I paid off my loans in six months…so can you.” Are you willing to make bank on that? Are you willing to promise the OP (who really seems like a wonderful,thoughtful person) that all the dominos will fall into place? Are all of you so sure that the parents are self centered evil people who want to keep their child home because the parents are afraid of the big bad world?</p>
<p>I feel that we can listen, make suggestions that will enhance communication between all parties, help in a respectful discourse. But we do not have to revert to the 60s mantra, “never trust anyone over 30.” </p>
<p>Unless posters are PERSONALLY willing to provide a job for the OP, invite him or her for dinners and holidays, ready to accept the blame or glory for how everything works out We have NO business injecting our values into another family’s business, and/or assuming that “we know the truth.” We don’t know the whole truth…only parts of it.</p>
<p>I had a friend who injected her values and opinions into everyone else’s family. When it was car choosing time one of my daughters wanted a matching Porsche to her boyfriend’s Porsche. We said no, it was a BMW or a Lexus. My friend said that we were controlling (and yes, we were paying for it) and we must get her the Porsche. It was “fair”. I simply turned to her a gushed, “THANK YOU!!! Since you’re so involved in this decision…I want to thank you for paying for the Porsche…and the insurance.”</p>
<p>“I’m not paying for it.”</p>
<p>I smiled and said, “Then shut up and stay out of it.”</p>
<p>ellebud, I like your post. Good summary on some of the unease that I have over full speed ahead.</p>
<p>Thank you.</p>
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<p>Of course, that does not prevent many parents and students from posting their family business regarding college choices and the like here, trying to entice others to inject their values into their family business…</p>
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<p>First, we’re talking about an education…not a consumable product…especially one which drops steeply in value the moment it leaves the seller’s premises. </p>
<p>Secondly, there’s an old saying…“penny wise and pound foolish” which applies in the OP’s situation…especially considering the career paths he/she’s considering. </p>
<p>If working in finance…especially investment banking is a goal he/she’s considering…there’s practically no chance he/she’ll get it from going anywhere except a select handful of elite schools…much less a state university system that from what I heard from college classmates and colleagues from SC…is average at best. </p>
<p>IME, it isn’t enough to just look at a given product/service’s price tag. One also needs to check the actual value/benefit such a product/service would provide the buyer/user. </p>
<p>Considering what the OP posted about his/her goals…seems pretty clear-cut to me. </p>
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<p>Sometimes, that mantra does apply as parents are human like everyone else and have their own biases, prejudices, and their own versions of narrow-mindedness. </p>
<p>My experience and those of many classmates has been that many parents are more likely to severely underestimate the capabilities of their kids than to overestimate them. More importantly…life sometimes does require us to take risks and to put in the requisite effort in exchange for a chance at a greater subsequent payoff. </p>
<p>Those who take the risk have a chance at such success. Those who shy away/allow their parents to force them to shy away tend to regret this later in life…especially if the odds are so greatly stacked in their favor as is this case.</p>
<p>I don’t think anyone is suggesting that this student take on big debt for Dartmouth.</p>
<p>It sounds like he’d only need to borrow (at most) about $5k per year. $20k debt is not too much for an ivy grad. </p>
<p>That said, he might not even need to borrow that much if he works over the summer and saves a few thou for college. He might only need to borrow about $10k total for all four years.</p>
<p>I do think that the parents need to “see the light”. There are people who try to limit their kids unnecessarily out of their own insecurities and fears. This student won’t be a minor when he goes to college, so it’s not like we’re suggesting that a minor “disobey” his parents. Because he won’t be a minor, and his parents won’t be paying, he doesn’t need to do what they say.</p>
<p>CoBrat: You’re cute…and naive…and way overstepping the bounds of a appropriate behavior.</p>
<p>Disclaimer: My husband graduated in business/finance from an ivy ranked far better than Dartmouth. And he was at the top of his class. So…flash down the road of life. Some of his classmates at doing very well. And, wait for it, some started out gangbusters and fell flat on their faces.</p>
<p>Speaking from the arrogance of youth of course the inferior parents underestimate the “value” of a Dartmouth education. Or maybe they had doubts about the “risks versus success”. Again, none of us know the full story from all sides. And that is the point…again and again.</p>
<p>And my point about the car is that some people feel it is their right and obligation to stick their noses into other values, expenditures and rites of passage. Unless you are willing (and others who have posted in this vein)to promise the OP a cushioned free ride, act in loco parentis, AND after graduation be the mentor and family support (the minute you cut a family the kid is adrift) I feel you offer advice for communication not defiance.</p>
<p>Yes, it may be that the parents are fearful. It may be that the $5,000 per year may be insurmountable due to a different market place in four years. It may be a control issue. We can (and should) point out different approaches to get to the bottom of what is wrong…but in the end they are a family. And it is clear that in the end the OP loves his parents. That doesn’t preclude making a different decision than the parents feel is better. It means making an informed and respectful decision.</p>
<p>Until I became active here, I had no idea that many students return home for every single holiday and vacation even if that home is clear across the continent. That absolutely was not my experience in college or in grad school. Granted that was in a previous century when some things were relatively more expensive than now. My point in addressing the “what about the holidays/vacations” issue, was to let the OP know that in his/her specific case, the transportation budget may not need to be as large as the original estimate.</p>
<p>I have sisters on the other coast with kids studying or that will be studying in New England. Nephew returned home for the winter break and took other breaks with local relatives (they shut the dorms down for breaks). Niece will be starting this fall - I don’t know what her travel plans will be yet but money is no problem. We’re split across coasts so those on the East coast can provide support for those studying from the West coast.</p>
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<p>And IMHO…it is not appropriate behavior to ignore or downplay the information in OP’s post…such as the fact that perceptions of political/cultural differences are at play or that he/she is hoping to go into a career where pedigree from a few select elite universities does matter in getting one’s foot in the door…especially considering I’ve seen it from my own experiences in those types of companies and having older relatives and classmates who did/do hiring in those fields. To be quite blunt…they aren’t going to hire someone who graduated from U of SC unless there’s some sort of nepotism involved. </p>
<p>Also…one can idly speculate endlessly about what the OP did not mention in his/her initial post. IMHO…that’s not only misses the point here(helping the OP from our experiences)…but also fails to respect the OP by taking him/her at his/her word unless there’s a valid reason beyond idle speculation to believe otherwise.</p>
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What is that career? I couldn’t find it in this thread anywhere.</p>
<p>Investment banking, referenced in post #6.</p>
<p>ellebud I would point out that the kid asked for our opinion. Now I don’t know what the heck had gone down since my last post. He seemed to like the idea of talking to and having his parents talk to a SC resident who graduated from Dartmouth… That was several pages ago. But basically when someone asks for your opinion you should feel free to give it. Otherwise what is the point of the forum?</p>
<p>I agree 100% with having the parents talk with a Dartmouth grad/school counselor/professional advisor/teacher. I strongly agree with OP having a frank and open discussion about schools, what the parents may or may not be saying regarding finances, or their (possibly) irrational fears of having their child travel so far from home.</p>
<p>What I find offensive are adults who counsel interventions, flippant comments like "you don’t have to go home:, you won’t succeed unless you go to Dartmouth, don’t worry aboout the debt I got rid of mine in a few months, “we financial experts reviewed his offer” and/or do what you want because if you’re 18 you can (the OP will be 18 in Ausust)…what I said is that each situation is different: you cannot guarantee financial security after graduation, (and there are kids who don’t get their dream jobs, someone graduates at the bottom of the class) we do not know the whole family’s financial or emotional needs, and no one can guaranteed job placement and salary.</p>
<p>Positive suggestions of communication/visitng the campus/talking openly about all concerns are all valid. Parents and slightly older adults reliving their childhood rebellions are definitely not constructive.</p>
<p>I share my own family’s advice to think of money for higher education as an investment, not just an expenditure. OP might ask his parents not what each school costs but what it’s worth. Even when talking about the same price tag, it becomes a different conversation when framed that way.</p>
<p>I also think young people’s time has tremendous value, but not all adults agree so readily with that. </p>
<p>I count on the wisdom of young people to parse things that adult strangers tell them, and filter what makes sense for their own situation.</p>