<p>Cornell sent an email to alumni about the new fall 2006 freshman Class of 2010.</p>
<p>college, acceptance rate, percent in top 10% of HS class</p>
<p>Agric and Life Sci 27 75
Architecture 20 76
Arts and Sci 20 90
Engineering 37 94
Hotel 23 91
Human Ecology 35 57
Indust & Labor Rel 36 80</p>
<p>overall, the freshman class had 61% with over 700 on the math SAT</p>
<p>If you are considering Cornell, you might be interested in this.</p>
<p>Can anyone find the SAT scores 25/75 range by college? I've searched the website high and low.</p>
<p>I think there was some posting about SAT ranges in each of the Cornell schools on here recently. It's interesting that the Hotel school would have a higher % in the top 10% than A&S. I always thought the Hotel school, along with Ag & Life, was where Cornell hid a lot of its hockey, lacrosse and football players. Why would the % in top 10% of human ecology be so much lower than the other schools?</p>
<p>I strongly suspect that the values for percentage in the top 10% of the class for Hotel and Human Ecology have been accidentally switched.</p>
<p>Take a look at these statistics for 2006 and previous years: <a href="http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000154.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000154.pdf</a> There has been a clear increasing trend for Human Ecology, reaching the high 80s or low 90s in the years 2000-2005. Then suddenly it drops to 57 percent? That seems unlikely.</p>
<p>On the other hand, class ranks have never been particularly high in Hotel, which is quite understandable since the characteristics the hotel school looks for are not necessarily reflected by class rank. In all the previous years listed here, there have never even been 80 percent of hotel students from the top 10% of their classes. Now it's 91 percent? I doubt it.</p>
<p>SAT scores (one year out of date) for the endowed colleges are here: <a href="http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000176.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000176.pdf</a></p>
<p>Those for the contract colleges are here: <a href="http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000177.pdf%5B/url%5D">http://dpb.cornell.edu/documents/1000177.pdf</a></p>
<p>In the old days, college guide books listed the admissions information separately for each college; now one needs to be a detective to find it.</p>
<p>I think it's in the interest of potential applicants to have accurate information pertaining to the college they actually plan to apply to. So it's a good thing you posted this.</p>
<p>monydad-
Yes, the individual colleges differ in selectivity. A lot of people don't realize that Cornell Arts and Sciences is only slightly less selective than Brown and Dartmouth or that the math SATs in Cornell Engineering are only slightly below MIT and Caltech.</p>
<p>Marian-
I think you are probably correct.
should probably be:
percent in top 10% of HS class
Hotel=57%
Human Ecology=91%</p>
<p>It was not my error. The error is on the website.</p>
<p>SATs
Architecture, Art, and Planning 1230-1400
Arts and Science 1320-1510
Engineering 1340-1510 (math is 710-790)
Hotel 1250-1390</p>
<p>Cornell A & S and Engineering combined are <em>more</em> selective than Dartmouth or Brown or Penn or Columbia, I think.</p>
<p>I should have made it clear that I knew it was not your error, collegehelp. I apologize.</p>
<p>In what way are engineering and a&s even close to more selective than Brown and Dartmouth. Dartmouth's 75th percentile scores are about 30 points higher(which is pretty big, the difference between Dartmouth and Princeton is 10-20 points), the acceptance rate is much much lower (15.4% vs 24%), and the school is more self selective not to mention that in a Cornell report even cornell reveals it loses 80% or greater cross admits to Brown and Dartmouth.</p>
<p>There is an admissions consultants' site (which I probably should not cite here because it competes with the entity that sponsors this board) that gives 25th to 75th percentile ranges as follows:</p>
<p>Brown 1290-1490
Columbia 1370-1520
Dartmouth 1350-1530
Penn 1310-1490</p>
<p>Thus, using collegehelp's values of 1320-1510 for Cornell Arts and 1340-1510 for Cornell Engineering, it seems reasonable to say that, on the basis of SAT scores alone, these two Cornell schools are slightly more selective than Brown and Penn but slightly less selective than Dartmouth and Columbia.</p>
<p>How can you pick and choose Cornell schools to compare, but not do the same for the other colleges? What about the all the schools Penn has?</p>
<p>because arts and sciences and engineering are the only comparable schools to dartmouth, penn, etc. The rest are highly specialized schools that the other schools dont have and rely on other things besides test scores to admit students. </p>
<p>Cornell CAS students are on par with Dartmouth, Columbia, etc. A 20 point SAT difference isn't anything (each student could probably have easily studied a bit more and earned 10 extra points on each section to make up for the difference).</p>
<p>Actually, it would be of great interest to see SAT ranges for Penn's four separate schools (which include business and nursing as well as engineering and arts and sciences). </p>
<p>But at the other universities mentioned here -- Columbia, Dartmouth, and Brown -- there are no other schools to compare with. All of the students are in arts and sciences or engineering.</p>
<p>I think the arts/engineering comparisons are the most valid because specialty schools in other areas are likely to rely on other criteria more than they rely on SAT scores. For example, we know that Cornell's architecture school relies very heavily on portfolios. SAT score comparisons aren't very meaningful for specialty fields.</p>
<p>“SAT score comparisons aren't very meaningful for specialty fields.”</p>
<p>Excuses, excuses. :)</p>
<p>i know, excuses, but having worked in admissions to one of the 'specialty' schools, I can assure you that it's true. This doesn't mean that there aren't smart students (far from the case), but significantly more emphasis is put on work experience and/or internships. For arch. it's the portfolio which will easily throw out any bad SAT scores and for the ag schools, well having grown up on a farm is almost a pre-rec for studying agricultural science.</p>
<p>Most colleges say that. Most say that grades and ECs are more important than test scores. I don’t think it has to do with being a specialty school or not, nor is it just something that is done at Cornell. That’s my point. It’s impossible to say that one school cares about one thing any more or less than another when you are comparing them. Anything beyond looking at actual numbers is speculation.</p>
<p>ok, call them up then. Though there are many colleges that say stuff like that, Cornell is one of the few schools that acts upon it. </p>
<p>How on earth are SAT scores supposted to predict a creative and successful architect?? Do you have any idea how admissions picks the freshman class. No, and actually neither does admissions ... the portoflios of the prospectives students are reviewed by the professors and they pick the ones they want, not admissions. </p>
<p>If you apply to the hotel school, don't you think a little work in a hotel is slightly important? Or do you think it's "ok" to wake up and think "hmmm, hotel stuff is cool, i'll apply there" and Cornell will say "sure! come on in!" Do you think there is a correlation between SAT scores and the quality of food created by a future chef? Would you rather hire a chef with loads of prior experience or a high SAT math section? Cornell takes the same approach. </p>
<p>Nearly every single person in ILR has had significant work in law firms or corporate businesses before enrolling at the school ... but I guess it's funny how coincidences like this occurs. Essays are also highly valued, and although other colleges say this, how many other colleges do you know of have AT LEAST 6 people read each application (3 in admissions, and those that make the initial cut are sent to 3 to 4 professors in the school for further evaluation). </p>
<p>You say it is speculation since you are not familiar with the process ... I am. If you dont believe me, I welcome you to call any admissions office at Cornell, PM me if you want some phone numbers.</p>
<p>“Cornell is one of the few schools that acts upon it.” </p>
<p>-If that’s not speculation, I don’t know what is…</p>
<p>“How on earth are SAT scores supposted to predict a creative and successful architect?? Do you have any idea how admissions picks the freshman class. No, and actually neither does admissions ... the portoflios of the prospectives students are reviewed by the professors and they pick the ones they want, not admissions.”</p>
<p>-I’ll ignore your attacks on me. I never said that SAT scores predict anything about being an architect; I said that it is speculation to say that Cornell is the only school that takes a holistic approach to admitting students. I will say, however, that I did enjoy my interview, and subsequent admission into the A-school at Cornell…. :rolleyes:</p>
<p>“If you apply to the hotel school, don't you think a little work in a hotel is slightly important? Or do you think it's "ok" to wake up and think "hmmm, hotel stuff is cool, i'll apply there" and Cornell will say "sure! come on in!" Do you think there is a correlation between SAT scores and the quality of food created by a future chef? Would you rather hire a chef with loads of prior experience or a high SAT math section? Cornell takes the same approach.”</p>
<p>-I’m not impressed by your rant. You are arguing with things I never even said. I said many colleges weigh high school grades and ECs more heavily than test scores. I have asserted nothing more.</p>
<p>“Essays are also highly valued, and although other colleges say this, how many other colleges do you know of have AT LEAST 6 people read each application (3 in admissions, and those that make the initial cut are sent to 3 to 4 professors in the school for further evaluation).”</p>
<p>-I have no idea, but unlike you, I don’t speculate. Such an assertion is ludicrous. Just like you claim I don’t know what happens in Cornell admissions, I’m sure you have no idea how every other college in the United States accepts their students. </p>
<p>“You say it is speculation since you are not familiar with the process ... I am. If you dont believe me, I welcome you to call any admissions office at Cornell, PM me if you want some phone numbers.”</p>
<p>-I never said that. What I said is that you speculate that Cornell is the ONLY school to do this. Unless you can offer proof that Cornell is in fact the only school with these kinds of admissions processes, stop arguing with me.</p>
<p>you don't seem to get the point (still). Also, I never attacked you nor tried to in any way. I just would have called you stubborn in the first place. </p>
<p>"I will say, however, that I did enjoy my interview, and subsequent admission into the A-school at Cornell"</p>
<p>congratulations on being one of the 5 or 6 students that turns down the arch. program at Cornell each year. </p>
<p>i'm certian other colleges take ECs and stuff into account (obviously), but I would bet money on the fact that they don't take them into account nearly as serious as the specialty schools at Cornell does. I have also done some work with admissions to CAS at Cornell, and it was obvious that they don't put the type of focus on specific EC's that some of the other schools at Cornell do. CAS and most of the other colleges out there are very general - they're not looking for hotel specific internships or work in a labor union. Tell me what major-specific EC's you would expect a philosophy major to have (this applies to any school). </p>
<p>"Im sure you have no idea how every other college in the United States accepts their students."</p>
<p>no, but I bet I'm right. Go into your admissions office at Northwestern and ask what specific EC's they expect to see from an applicant who wants to major in history, political science, or economics. You see (or at least you havn't seen yet), certain colleges at Cornell almost certainly require certain EC's or work/internship experience. Without these, you won't get in! This is not the case for most other colleges (I say most with respect to other colleges with particular majors like Cornell). I've done the college application thing twice, and my EC's had ZERO relevance to my majors the first time through (unless ice hockey captain corresponds somehow to a triple major in history, econ, and english). Though when it came time to apply to Cornell, I got my butt into a law firm as fast as I could. It was a critical piece that was missing from my application (relevant experience, that is). </p>
<p>Sure, Cornell isn't the ONLY school to take ECs into consideration. But, you tell me another school that will reject people due to a lack of a specific EC. In fact, many state schools will offer you admission as long as you meet a specific GPA or SAT score (I forget which ones to be exact, I think Texas is one). </p>
<p>"stop arguing with me"</p>
<p>I made the initial statement, you made the rebuttal. You're up to bat now...</p>
<p>“I'm certian other colleges take ECs and stuff into account (obviously), but I would bet money on the fact that they don't take them into account nearly as serious as the specialty schools at Cornell does.” </p>
<p>-More unfounded speculation. Of all the schools in the country- not to mention the many specialty schools- you are really saying that Cornell is somehow the only one to take ECs very seriously? How can you be content with making such an outlandish statement? </p>
<p>“Sure, Cornell isn't the ONLY school to take ECs into consideration. But, you tell me another school that will reject people due to a lack of a specific EC.”</p>
<p>I have no idea of another school that will do this, nor am I sure that Cornell even does this, but shall I speculate that it doesn’t happen at other places? Nope. I shall not.</p>