There are some on this site who may well view CPA exam passage rates as more akin to good trade schools and thus something of the opposite of prestige (at least when it comes to higher education).
@Data10 Using GT in your example is disingenuous. GT is a very prestigious school for engineering. If your definition of prestigious is HYPS, you might want to broaden it.
@saillakeerie “There are some on this site who may well view CPA exam passage rates as more akin to good trade schools and thus something of the opposite of prestige (at least when it comes to higher education)”
There was a saying at the Big 4 firm I worked at that they hired “the best and brightest”. While I don’t necessarily agree this was the case, I do know that the coveted internships were taken up by mostly Top 25 college undergrads from schools that were more than just “good trade schools”.
My understanding is that at the Top 4 accounting firms and probably at the top financial firms, only grads of top schools are likely to get employed in the NY office. However, I know kids from “lesser” (ranked in the 30 to 60s) that got jobs at satellite offices (in Virginia for example). Also one who knew a partner and got an internship that way and then got a job.
My #1 started his career post-college at a Big 4 firm. He had majored in economics. Top in math and stats. Excellent writer. MBA’s he worked for (as opposed to those who hired him in the first place) didn’t seem to realize his skill-set. The work was boring. He did stay for a few years (while moonlighting on his hobbies) and eventually bailed completely and went on to make a great career in the real world. His Big 4 experience made clear to him the type of career he did NOT want.
Out here in flyover country, it is possible to get a job at a Big 4 firm with a degree from a non-prestigious university. Much depends on the local connections between the college and the firms located in nearby cities. Chicago, Cleveland, Minneapolis…you get my drift.
I’m willing to bet many East Coasters never heard of my D’s university (rated 100-ish by USNews), but she had internship offers from 2 Big 4 firms, chose one, and is still working there, almost six years later. (Many of her friends from college landed similar internships/jobs.) Granted, she’s “just” a lowly, trade-school CPA, so YMMV. And actually, @mackinaw, she has a great career in the real world, too!
@CU123 Your post is disingenuous. My posted stated, " If a student chooses to attend GeogriaTech over a more prestigious HYPSM… school…, he/she likely has an increased chance of having strong work experience due to such programs. " I expect you know writing “HYPSM…” is not equivalent to only including HYPS in my definition of prestigious. Furthermore saying x > y does not give any indication that y is low. For example, if I wrote Harvard is more prestigious than Yale, that does mean my definition of prestigious is limited to just Harvard and not Yale.
Ignoring all of that, the point was, the primary reason why GeorgiaTech grads have a better chance of strong, relevant work experience is they have largest voluntary co-op program in the United States and encourage students to pursue such programs. Students who choose GeorgiaTech over other colleges with a similar or greater level of prestige are likely to have increased chance of strong work experience during college, due to such programs.
The recent annual CIRP surveys of freshmen college students across the nation have showed record-high percentages of students naming “making a lot of money” as their reason for going to college. Right now it’s about 3 out of 4 students. Kind of sad when you think about it.
I wonder how they compare to less prestigious but mandatory co-op programs like those at U Cincinnati (it started co-op education and currently has the largest co-op program in the country), Northeastern, Drexel, Clarkson or Kettering.
@socaldad2002 My point about trade schools was really in jest. By post count, you are new here. Stay long enough and you will see certain people who respond (any time a parent or student talks about getting a job after college) that college isn’t a trade school.
I interned back when they were the Big 8. Remember hearing people from California at the time say that they were upset because top kids from top California schools only interviewed with 7 of the firms (Touche Ross was the not on their list). Then Deloitte merged with TR and kids in California were getting calls from kids who they viewed as “flunkies” in college saying they were now working at the same firm. Never followed it enough to see how that all played out.
People I talk with who are still at Big 4 firms tell me they are not limited to Top 25 schools in terms of recruiting. Limited to the Midwest. Ultimately I suspect it depends on the definition of “coveted internships” in terms of how important it is. Big 4 firms have something like 75-100 offices across the US and worldwide offices as well. They recruit from a number of colleges. Certain offices no doubt are more popular than others though in the end, vast majority of people will not finish their career at a Big 4 firm. They typically get spun off to clients. Their client lists are impressive. And not all of them are served out of a small number of offices.
“I wonder how they compare to less prestigious but mandatory co-op programs like those at U Cincinnati (it started co-op education and currently has the largest co-op program in the country), Northeastern, Drexel, Clarkson or Kettering.”
This is merely speculation but my guess is that they may be recruited more regionally than a school like GT. Regardless I think a coop position gives an advantage in the hiring process.
@saillakeerie I agree with you that depending on the various offices in the US, some of the Big 4 will recruit out of many less “prestigious” colleges. When I started out there were the Big 5 (mid-90’s) and I worked our of SF and then LA offices in Tax. IME in the large cities, the Big 4 can afford to be choosy as there are more than enough qualified applicants for the few positions being offered each year. With that said, I do know of several tax partners that went to undergrad at state schools and are doing just fine, especially if they went to a good graduate college to get their Masters in Tax (MST) or LLM.
The bottom line is that if someone is smart, passionate and driven about a certain career path, they will likely be successful no matter what college they go to; however some colleges will make that journey a little smoother and reliable than others.
^^^good post. It’s about the kid AND the resources at the school. A truly motivated kid will find a way regardless of school. However, that same kid is going to find that way a lot easier at a school with better resources. S/he will have more opportunities due to resources (including better recruiting, better alumni, better pipeline to certain jobs / industries, better professors, better quality of peers).
however, a less than motivated kid will probably not excel regardless of school.
When I told my mother I wanted to apply to Wesleyan, she laughed it off because she had never heard of the school and it was “only” 21 on the pointless US rankings in liberal arts colleges. Looking at the acceptance rate, I don’t think I’m getting in at all. Any school I end up at ranked lower than Tufts will be “an embarrassment” and will not be shared with anyone by my mother unless specifically asked. That’s what I get for having an older brother who got into HP and M…
I don’t think I need the boost of a big name to be successful in life- I’m ready to flourish at UVM or Northeastern if they end up taking me in March. I just wish my mom trusted me to do the same. -HS class of 2018
This is my perspective as someone who graduated within the last decade. The thought process i followed consisted of trying to maximize a composite of three different aspects: 1. strength in my top 2-3 areas of interest (wasn’t 100% sure about my major before college), 2. overall prestige and strength and 3. fit. I was lucky enough not to have to worry about FA so that didn’t go into my decision process.
For me the priority were the first two metrics above, and then I chose based on which was the best fit amongst choices that were of comparable strength in my areas of interest and in terms of overall prestige.
Bump.
One big problem I keep seeing here (but to be fair also everywhere else I look) is that STEM education concerns are not being addressed by people familiar with it.
@nrtlax33 seems to be an exception:
“We graduated from a top school in this list (https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/engineering-doctorate) and have a PhD, two master degrees in our family, all from three different majors.”
I can relate to the above as I went to a state flagship for engineering many years ago and that coincided with brothers and close friends going to other schools of higher and lower ranking. I have seen exceptions but I tend to strongly agree with this:
@nrtlax33 wrote: “I wouldn’t recommend going to any state flagship to do pre-med.”
The difference in rigor at the undergraduate level is very rarely properly assessed. STEM undergraduate education at public flagships tends to be more brutal than at higher ranked private peer schools. I am obviously generalizing and my evidence is anecdotal for sure but I am often dismayed at the amount of misinformation floating around.
the argument for state school is more financial but pre-med is brutal everywhere, even privates where you can get a B if you fail the class, there is a weed out where a small percentage of students get admitted to the pre-med prep program if you will, where you get assistance on mcat, application, interview etc… It is not offered to everybody that’s a pre-med at a private university.