Is anyone else running up against this with their child?
My son was accepted to the Honors College at one of our state universities. It was his safety school and he has also applied to some highly-ranked private universities as well. The state school is still ranked in the top 100 nationally while the others are in the top third. For quite some time he only wanted to go to the private schools due to the level of prestige often associated with attending them. Part of his issue with the state school is many less than serious students (his perception) from last year’s graduating class were accepted and attend there now. I reminded him a few members of the top 10% from the 2017 class are among those attending. However, he is afraid people will think he is only as good as “average student Joe” rather than the same as “High Achiever Sam” because he is going to attend the state school. Being accepted into the Honors college helps because his guidance counselor thinks he might be the first one to be accepted there after applying to it. It also helps that the state school is throwing merit scholarships at him and comes at a third of the cost. It’s a great research university that has it’s own med school (he’s pre-med) and in conjunction with the Honors college, offers a lot of opportunity. He’s also starting to see the wisdom of saving his debt load for med school. However, I think a small part of him would still like to be able to say he was accepted to prestigious university “x.” Has anyone else seen this? If so, have you tried to talk them down from it? His views are gradually changing but still…
There is certainly value in the higher ranked schools, the question we need to examine is how much are we paying and what exactly we are getting for any extra costs. I got traction with my oldest son by pointing out how differences in education spending could be translated into a nice car he could drive around and/or a condo he could live in. He grew to like the idea of having an extra $50,000 to spend on other things
Sure, I don’t think it’s an “uncommon” thing among high schoolers - they either want to be “the one” that goes away, or they are comparing themselves to someone else and think they are “better” and deserve “better”, or they want to be perceived as the exotic one for going somewhere others aren’t or don’t know about. I think it’s a fairly common self image, esteem thing. I think as the parent you can help by pointing out the pros and the cons. Pre-med can be any major, anywhere and if the idea IS to go to graduate school then why pay more for a degree that isn’t terminal would be my perspective. His reality is peer perceptions. Your reality is what happens 4 -8 years down the road.
In my many years of working, I’ve worked with graduates of public schools, small private schools, prestigious schools. We all had the same job. My two hs friends who are now doctors attended the flagship.
Does your son expect you to pay for med school? Do you expect to pay for med school? If he selects the cheaper school, will he have the saved money available for med school?
How does cost compare between the various options, and did you and your son have the college money talk (including discussion about the cost of medical school) before application season?
YES! Our youngest, now a sophomore in college, was very wrapped up in the prestige factor during application season in HS.
Can you blame her for wanting people to absolutely LIGHT UP & gush how amazing she is at that moment when she tells them she is going to attend --Top 20 elite private–?!
Instead, she felt ashamed to tell people she would be attending --University of OOS flagship–. She was NOT greeted with enthusiastic gushing, but the response was generally tight polite smiles, sometimes quizzical looks. She felt that people were thinking “she could’ve done better”, and “but she’s SO smart!”, and “too bad”.
This was HER reality. In our case, it made it worse to try to reason with her and try get her to “agree” that she was being given an amazing opportunity (huge scholarship).
This is all in the rearview mirror now. Application season was rough. Freshman year was very bumpy with lots of salty comments about the school, the quality of the other students and classes, and pleas to transfer. We were kind and firm about the choices on the table, and we bit our tongues a LOT.
Sophomore year has been a 180. She is blooming where she was planted. She refers to school as “home” and she might even stay over next summer if she gets the job she has applied for.
It’s unfortunate that self-worth gets wrapped up in where you attend school. But, it’s a strong cultural narrative.
Assuming he is serious about med school, this is your lever to pry his eyes off those prestigious schools. Med school is expensive. If he can attend the state university for a low price in the honors college, and it is a respectable school, that saves a TON of money for med school. Were you planning to help him pay for med school? Can you offer more if he takes the in-state offer? Put some money on the table.
This helps you. Can you find a way to make it help him?
For example, will you be able to contribute to his medical school costs if he chooses the less expensive state school instead of a more expensive private school? Don’t promise to do this if you can’t be sure you can follow through (for example, if your family’s financial situation is unstable). But if you can make this commitment, it could give him a good reason to choose the state school.
Did you tell him you would pay the cost at any school to which he got accepted? Or did you tell him he had to at least consider the bottom line? Or did you tell him he had to choose the bottom line price.?
Did you have this money talk BEFORE applications were sent?
We had the money talk with both of our kids. We were in a good financial position so really, their options were wide open. We did tell them that we were only paying for undergrad school…and only for the equivalent of four years. Nothing else. We also told them that if they chose a more expensive private option and had merit aid…if they lost that aid, we would be asking them to come back to our home state.
We had this chat well before applications were sent. We had it before we visited colleges.
Well…both kids got merit offers to the schools they attended…one substantial and one just a small amount. But it was fine.
BUT…here is the rest of the story. One of our kids got a HUGE…and I mean HUGE merit award at an OOS public. It was a school she liked, and boy did they show her the love…not just money but little things like when she couldn’t come to the scholarship weekend, they held on to all of her stuff…and created an individual scholarship weekend visit the following week. Really…this school would,have cost us under $1000 a month…and her award was tied to tuition so if it increased so did the award.
She knew the financial implications…but like i said…we had given the OK to EVERY school on her list. She chose a different school…and for good reasons…and had a fabulous four years there. But it was 4 times the cost for us out of Pocket. BUT like I said…we had the money talk before applications were sent.
I know two doctors in their late 40’s who have medical school loans. Have him talk to someone similar. Find someone who is 35 or so, a doctor and who took out loans. How did it impact their life? Would they have done things differently?
S started slow in college, had to go OOS to a med school, not considered a “prestigious school.” His W went to tippy top “prestigious” med school. Now, all patients, staff… address them both as Doctor…
I’ve always thought pre-med has one of the strongest arguments for saving money on undergrad, since all my anecdata favor the view med schools care much more about GPA and MCAT than the USNWR ranking of the undergrad institution.
@turtle17, this is only true if the family is willing to contribute to the student’s medical school expenses if the student chooses a less expensive undergraduate school. If @thumper1 had a kid who wanted to go to medical school, that kid would not benefit financially from choosing a less expensive school because that family does not contribute to educational expenses beyond the undergraduate level.
My family had a philosophy similar to that of @thumper1, primarily because my husband believes that it hampers a young person’s developing independence if the parents provide financial support beyond college graduation. One of our kids knew at the time when she applied to undergrad that she would eventually want an MBA. She chose an expensive undergraduate school simply because she liked it. She had no motivation to do otherwise.
Well…we did offer to by our kid a car and a condo if she chose the less expensive option… it the kid declined. We would still have come out ahead of the more costly school!
TBH, I would not choose a college based on whether one is planning to attend medical school…or not. I don’t have the statistics…but really…lots of premeds never get to the application process, and lots of others don’t get accepted to medical school even after applying.
“and comes at a third of the cost. It’s a great research university that has it’s own med school (he’s pre-med)…”
I also know doctors, including a top specialist at a well known top facility near Boston, who are still paying off medical school debt when then appear to be at least in their 40’s (if not in their 50’s).
To the limited extent that I still work (part time), I work with folks with degrees from MIT, Stanford, UNH, UMass Amherst, UMass Lowell, IIT (India), and many other schools. No one cares where each co-worker went to school. When I was in graduate school at a well known top school, there were students there who had done their undergrad all over the place, including many very good in-state public universities.
Clearly it is a better bet to save your money for medical school. Convincing a teenager of that might not be so easy.
Here’s a suggestion: Point out to your son that if he gets accepted to one or more of these highly ranked private colleges, there will be prestige in turning THEM down. Choosing State U’s Honors College over those others can be a powerful statement that speaks to his self-assurance, values, and goal setting ability.
The point about “If he is really serious about med school” is important because many many students change away from pre med. I believe I’ve heard that about 40% of pre-meds complete the program, and about 45% of those get admitted to a medical school. If so, then roughly 15-20% of premeds are successful in getting into medical school.
It is true that the benefit to a brand name undergrad is very limited if he stays with premed. However, the brand could be a lot more valuable if he changes majors.
If he is the kid who is 100% committed to this, I would stay in state. If this is the major of the day, then I would consider it more carefully.
It also depends which BSU it is. If it is Michigan, Berkeley, Virginia, UNC, Wisconsin, Florida, or Illinois the difference between that education and a top 20 private is a lot less than if it were, say, South Dakota State (sorry, Jackrabbit fans).
Where you go matters a lot more for certain majors. If you are in business, consulting or even CS, a very rigorous top program may well make a significant difference.
If you are an engineering major in anything besides CS, I think that the school matters very little as it is an ABET program.
It’s certainly a tough pill to swallow to attend the less prestigious university that’s a better fit. But oftentimes, attending a less fancy school pays off in the long run due to the “big fish in a small pond” effect. So far, that has worked in my favor. If you can learn to stop caring about what your friends’ parents and the PTA parents think, then the cheaper, less prestigious school is usually a good calculated risk to take.