<p>My D is a rising junior who has taken honors biology and honors chemistry. For her senior year her choices are AP biology, AP chemistry, or Honors physics. GC says take Honors physics as she is considering a pre-med or similiar health track for college. But, if she passes on the two "AP" sciences, opting instead for a mere "Honors" course will the Adcom think she wimped out? I mean she's already taken biology and chemistry albeit honors, not AP.
She really has no preference, but just wants the "rigorous" transcript which will boost her chances at acceptance ...possibly at a top 50 LAC.
What do you think?</p>
<p>between AP bio and AP chem: they are two very different courses (taken bio, am taking chem). if she decides to go with one of those, she should probably take the one in whose precursor she did better. </p>
<p>she could get college credit for taking an ap but not for taking an honors class. go to collegeboard.com and look at how many hours her potential schools (if she has any yet!) offer for each score on the ap exam. also know that the entire ap system is being audited this year so the material in the course at her school could change.</p>
<p>i also take adv physics and don't think it's as hard as ap bio or ap chem. i take both adv physics and ap chem and find that they complement each other quite well. </p>
<p>all in all, i would say go ap if she doesnt have many other ap classes next year. if she's going to be a junior, she will have plenty of time to add more ap's and performing well in high level classes is critical to gaining admission into top universities or LAC.</p>
<p>hope it works out!</p>
<p>They are all valid options. </p>
<ol>
<li><p>AP Chem is not an easy course. If she likes chemistry, AND the teacher is good, this course will stand her in good stead as a college freshman.</p></li>
<li><p>Honors physics would provide a well rounded base. Again, look at the teacher, and how strong her math is. You may also want to look at the specific recommendations at the LAC's at the top of her range: this may provide some guidance.</p></li>
<li><p>AP Bio - I would think this might be the more interesting for her, and possibly the most useful as far as determining whether something in the life sciences is in the future. </p></li>
</ol>
<p>What is the rest of her schedule like?</p>
<p>If she is looking for an easy A => chemistry. I spent half the year getting kicked out of the class and did nothing all year and got a 4 on the exam and an A in the class.</p>
<p>If she is looking for a hard, fast-paced class => biology. By far the most interesting but the most work. I am currently taking it and we do a chapter (including one day for the test) every three days and have essays and labs and workbook and lots of reading.</p>
<p>I don't recommend Physics.</p>
<p>Honors Physics is no joke and still a very good class to take. I feel like it is a shame to go through high school without taking a physics class. I feel like AP Biology is the easiest to self study for, so your daughter could try to take an online class or a distance learning class and cover much of the same material. </p>
<p>In the end, you should look at the teachers teaching the classes. In my experience, I got the most out of classes with good teachers regardless of the subject. Junior year I chose my classes based on the teachers teaching them and I had the time of my life in class. This year I chose the classes based on the material and not the teachers and have lost the spark I had last year. An inspiring teacher can create interest in a subject for any student while a bad teacher can kill any interest a student had.</p>
<p>Nightingale, if she wants to be a science major, I would strongly recommend taking a physics course in high school. My son was not able to fit one in his schedule and based on his results, even with the guidance counselor explaination, I can't help but wonder if that was a problem for him. He had taken Honors and AP Chem and Honors and AP Biology. Your guidance counselor should be able to let you know.</p>
<p>Is she not able to take both Physics and Bio? Our school allows that. In any case, I would be concerned about some colleges looking for a year each of bio, chem amd physics, which I have seen in their "Admissions Criteria"</p>
<p>When my S was filling out his college aps this year, one of the consistant questions to the guidance counselors was, "how does this applicant's schedule compare to the rigor of your high school's curriculum," or something such as that. From our freshman year on the GC's at his school talked to them like this, if you get all A's in standard, and you are not taking Honors and it's offered, admissions officers will wonder why. If you are getting all A's in honors and taking no AP's, and they are offered (our S's school offers something like 25 different AP classes), they'll wonder why. And they will look at the rigor of the senior year -- not as heavily as the junior year -- but they will look to see if you "sluff" off, at least that's what the admissions counselor at Wake Forest told us when we were at their open house. It's so nutty now ... less schools taking the AP credit (especially if it's "only" a 3 on the exam) and yet, because the high schools offer the classes, and they are considered more rigorous, you are penalized if you don't take them in terms of how your schedule holds up with the rest of your peers in the graduating class. </p>
<p>Zebes</p>
<p>BTW, my D took AP bio as a freshman. She got an A in the class and a 5 on the exam, but she can memorize a phone book in one sitting and I tutored her through the course. S took AP bio as a junior, having done well in frosh H bio. He got a B in the class, never cracking a book and got a 4 on the exam. But he likes Bio and remember that stuff. He's in AP physics now, as a senior. He hates math (although, he's got an A in calc now, but he can do math) and finds the physics easy, except Optics ... Lordy, he hates optics.</p>
<p>I would think that most schools would want to see balance---three sciences rather than just two fields of study with advanced work. Our state requires work in three disciplines-- choosing from Earth Science, Biology, Chemistry, or Physics. I would just comment that AP Chem is an extremely difficult class for most people -- I wouldn't think it's an easy A for most folks. I'd definitely encourage her to take Honors Physics and perhaps self-study for AP Bio if that is her interest.</p>
<p>From everything I've read and heard, I think it's important to take the complete "core" of science courses: bio, chem and physics. I'd hate to approach a college intro physics class without at least some exposure to it, particularly since most of her pre-med peers will have had physics. </p>
<p>I think having the "hole" in her transcript where physics should be is a worse scenario than not taking AP science.</p>
<p>Everyone has given good advice, especially the part about looking at where the best teachers are, and the desirability of physics in high school.</p>
<p>But I have one practical thing to add: If you're worried about how colleges will view her course selection, why not ask the GC directly: If she does what he recommends, will he be checking the "most challenging" box, or just the "challenging" box? What have other ambitious students at the school done? Figure out what you would need to do to get a "most challenging" designation, and THEN decide whether to do that or something else depending on how much you think the difference matters.</p>
<p>I lean towards physics. I had to take a lab physics course in college for architecture school (the same course all the pre-meds took) and it would have been less stressful if I'd had some exposure to physics. However if she loved either Chem or Bio that would be a reason to pursue one of them instead.</p>
<p>My son did the AP Chem and AP Bio route as his school only offered "regular" Physics (not honors or AP) and was taught by a questionable teacher. However, he is in a premed track in college and getting killed by college Physics--it may have been better for him to have had some (even if it was subpar) exposure to Physics before taking a class in college with mostly students who had good backgrounds.</p>
<p>i took ap bio as a junior. now i'm taking ap chem and general physics as a senior. ap bio was more time-consuming than ap chem and gen physics combined.</p>
<p>i think that anyone going into the sciences should take all three classes anyway. you can't really do bio without basic chem, and you can't really do chem without basic physics.</p>
<p>I took honors biology and honors chemistry my first two years, and now I'm taking honors physics as a junior. Physics is really just a math class with alot of hard story questions; it's unlike any other science class. It's the hardest class I've been in so far, and it's different from any other class because you can't get by with memorization. You really have to know what you're doing, and being a good problem solver is extremely important. </p>
<p>I'm glad that I picked physics though. It makes my pre-calc math class seem like a breeze, and now I have bio, physics, and chem on my transcript.</p>
<p>Nightingale said:
"My D is a rising junior who has taken honors biology and honors chemistry. For her senior year her choices are AP biology, AP chemistry, or Honors physics. GC says take Honors physics as she is considering a pre-med or similiar health track for college. But, if she passes on the two "AP" sciences, opting instead for a mere "Honors" course will the Adcom think she wimped out? I mean she's already taken biology and chemistry albeit honors, not AP.
She really has no preference, but just wants the "rigorous" transcript which will boost her chances at acceptance ...possibly at a top 50 LAC.
What do you think?"</p>
<p>As someone who is about to graduate UG as a Biochem major.
I would say that your D should take as many AP classes as possible. If you D ends up going to a school where her AP classes will allow to her to opt out of certain classes, it could be a major major timesaver and give her a head start. Taking AP Chem opted me out of 2 quarters of Chem. If I had taken AP bio and done well, I could have opted out of another 2 quarters of Bio as well. Imagine how less stresssful college will be if one were to drop 4 required classes out of a 4 year plan (if you cant imagine it, its a big deal).</p>
<p>From my experience premed phsyics is not as hard as engineering physics in UG. ANyone who is profecient at math will do fine in premed physics. Not taking a physics class in HS will not be too much of a detriment, if at all.</p>
<p>
[quote]
From my experience premed phsyics is not as hard as engineering physics in UG. ANyone who is profecient at math will do fine in premed physics. Not taking a physics class in HS will not be too much of a detriment, if at all.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Guess it depends on the student and the school. In my son's "premed" Physics I the class average was somewhere around 60. There were 40+ students in that class--only about 15 returned to take Physics II this semester. He was proficient in math--a 5 in AP Calc BC and A's in inorganic and orgo I--but Physics is a real chore.</p>
<p>only 40 students! thats a small class =).</p>
<p>I guess I would be more correct in agreeing with you that it may be more school/student dependant.</p>
<p>However, my original advice would still stand. The possibility of opting out of chem and bio would just give your S/D more time to focus on physics!</p>
<p>If your daughter is considering majoring in any subject in college for which she would have to take college physics, taking high school physics provides important background.</p>
<p>I knew some biology majors in college who had never taken high school physics. They had a very tough time with the required college physics course.</p>
<p>Thanks for all those responses. My D's GC did say colleges like to see physics even if you opt for it over another science AP. I guess since she had taken honors bio and honors chem in previous years, foregoing AP bio and AP chem in her senior year (in favor of honors physics) would not neccessarily be looked upon as a weak kneed move. Her courses next year will now be </p>
<p>Honors Physics (and lab)
AP Calculus
AP Literature
Wind Ensemble
Personal Finance- Mandated by the high school. GC tried to get her out of it.
Student Leader- During her Phys-Ed period
Spanish 5</p>
<p>I think I might be missing one... </p>
<p>She has already taken-
Honors Biology
Honors Chemistry
AP US History
AP US Government
Honors Math 4 (whatever that is) </p>
<p>I guess that's all good. My head would have exploded if I took this stuff.</p>