<p>Your daughter needs to make the choice about applying ED. It sounds like she has made that choice. If she were 100% sure about this school, she would be applying ED (it seems). However, she has decided not to do so. Let her make that decision.</p>
<p>My son didn't want to commit to a school that might not love him back. He applied RD to 10 schools knowing he'd get into some. Then he picked his first choice. You can't fail to get your first choice that way.</p>
<p>"Oh, OK honey. Whatever you think is best."</p>
<p>Marathon, there IS a message here but what it is may just be one of those mysteries of the teenage universe. Because ED worked so well for my son I'm a great supporter of the system (as long as finance isn't at issue); however, I acknowledge the inherent and lingering question "I wonder what other schools would have accepted me?" When the other kids were discussing their multiple acceptances there was a twinge of jealously, but in context, this was minor.</p>
<p>I see an ED application as risk management. Most people are risk adverse and a highschool student may be excessively hesitant to make a BIG life decision. This risk is multifaceted depending on how you view it -- there's risk in acting, there's risk in not acting.</p>
<p>If there is a clear first choice, I think the risk of NOT applying ED is greater than the risk actually applying ED, but sometimes people feel more comfortable with risks that result from no action than they do with action related risks. </p>
<p>My advice to students on the fence is to try to visualize come April and you get a rejection: Will you always wish you had applied ED? </p>
<p>Bottom line, it's up to her. There are still 2.5 months for her to change and change again. Maybe another visit or an overnight would push her off the fence in one direction or another.</p>
<p>I'd say if she was absolutely sure this was the best school for her, then apply ED.</p>
<p>But for most kids, they don't feel that way about ANY school. Also, if FA is a big question, absolutely, don't apply ED!</p>
<p>Anecdotes: My nephew applied ED to his Legacy college and was admitted. Then came time for FA: zero, zippo, nada, nothing. If he had applied to the legacy school as well has others, he probably would have had several offers to choose from. Unfortunately, my brother and his wife went along with their son's choice. Since he applied ED, he was required to go there, and my brother and his wife are stuck without financial aid for 4 years. My nephew ended up having to take a year off between his sophomore and junior years to work and save up for tuition. He's now back at school for his Junior year but he will not graduate with the class he started his freshman year with.</p>
<p>My D on the other hand applied to her legacy school, as well as 8 others, one of which she was sure back last fall was the perfect fit for her. Unfortuantely, it was well known for bad FA. We warned her of that, so she did not have her hopes up. Come April, she was admitted to every school she applied to, with some terrific scholarship and aid packages. The sure bet school? Second worst offer. The legacy school? The best FA offer on the table. Where did she end up matriculating? Our flagship State U, one of her safeties (financial and academic) which had been her last campus visit, and was a darkhorse candidate all along. It ended up up being the frontrunner in the end. She's been there a week now, and she absolutely loves it. Go figure.</p>
<p>Her expressed reason for being hesitant to apply ED is indeed silly an flawed logic, but also typical of how some kids see things. We've had this discussion in different forms when we want to call a friend to see if they'll interview one of our kids for a summer job. "Oh, NO! I just want to get it on my own!" At which point my H says, "Don't worry. We can't get you a job, just an interview. We can help open a door for you but only you can walk through it. All they're doing is agreeing to interview you as a courtesy to our friendship. They won't hire you if you aren't right for the job."</p>
<p>But even if it's an immature reason, her conclusion might be correct. ED's make sense when someone is absolutely sure it's their first choice. Your argument to her might sound like you're trying to improve her odds for what might not be, heart-of-hearts, her first choice. </p>
<p>A different way to see this, as a parent, is to realize that if it's destined that the college will want her in ED, they'll see just as much shining glory in the RD round and take her then.</p>
<p>One difference that your D may or may not understand is how much more work it will be during Sr. year to work on multiple applications.</p>
<p>Or how heartbreaking it might be to get rejected ED and then have to work on applications--oh no--it's the parents who might not be thinking of this.</p>
<p>Bethievt, true that! </p>
<p>One of the harder motivational bumps to overcome is picking up the ED rejected or deferred kid off the floor on Dec.1 to work upon all the half-considered RD apps (with file dates from Jan 1-15) that were sidelined all fall, hoping and praying they'd not be necessary.</p>
<p>My d was going to apply ED to her first choice school until it came down to the point of signing the application as ED. She couldn't do it. She just wasn't ready to commit in November to where she would go for the following September.</p>
<p>Also, everyone is talking about how great it is when the kid gets in ED. What they haven't mentioned is how hard it can be when the kid doesn't get in ED. My d had several friends who were rejected outright. A couple of them never really recovered, are going to their last choice college because they never worked hard on other applications, and still harbor resentment about it. She had others who were deferred and ultimately rejected. When d saw that, she was very happy that she hadn't applied ED. (OOPS, just saw I cross-posted this with bethievt.)</p>
<p>And for what it's worth, d was waitlisted and ultimately rejected by her potential ED school, and is very happy where she is.</p>
<p>People make decisions based on gut feelings or emotions, and then typically provide rationalizations to justify their decision. This is human nature and is true of almost all decisions, except possibly those decisions that are made in a context where the person truly cannot make up their mind -- such as simply choosing the least expensive of an array of products. Sometimes the rationalizations people give for their decisions make a lot of sense, sometimes they sound kind of lame. </p>
<p>Teenagers often give rather lame-sounding rationalizations to parents when it comes to college choices, partly because they don't have any other way to explain what is essentially a gut level decision, and partly because teenagers often are reluctant to confide their true feelings. That's why a parent will drive 300 miles to see a college and then have their kid inexplicably refuse to get out of the car when they got there -- its a gut sense that the kid can't articulate, but the kid really, truly, already has decided that she hates the place. </p>
<p>ED is a bad deal for the student because it locks a 17 year old into a single choice, with no way out, at the beginning of a year that typically involves a tremendous amount of growth and change. But the bottom line is that in this case, the kids gut feeling says "no" to ED, dad wants a reason, so daughter offers up something that she thinks is plausible. </p>
<p>When my d. was applying to colleges she added a safety to her list that was in no way like any of the other colleges. It was, however, located half a mile from the college that her boyfriend attends. I puzzled over what she saw in that college until I checked a map. Once I figured out the obvious, I ignored her professed reasons for adding that college, and suggested more safeties within shouting distance of bf. (I didn't want her choosing a college based on the bf, but at the same time I understood that she simply wanted to keep options open -- which is probably the case with OP's daughter).</p>
<p>At this point in the application process, you have to be SO careful. You DO NOT want to get blamed for outcome! </p>
<p>It's nice to take credit (even if it's secretly) - but it would not be good at all to hear, "Why did you encourage me to apply to ED to a school I hate?!" or "Why did you discourage me from applying ED when I might have been admitted if I'd gone that route?!"</p>
<p>Both my kids had that scenario: deferred (not rejected) from their ED schools. One was ultimately accepted; one rejected. Both are very happy with the schools they are at.</p>
<p>Both were grateful for the ED process because they finished early and had the GC's fully attention. D also thinks it helps you decide what you want. School S attends is closest to his Ed school and his original first choice.</p>
<p>Perhaps EA would be a good solution for this family. There are many wonderful schools that accept EA applications. Having the EA acceptance in his pocket made the ED deferral okay (school was of equal caliber). </p>
<p>Readying application for EA may satisfy daughter and father.</p>
<p>I reiterate my earlier position that no one should apply ED who isn't eager to.</p>
<p>BTW: I don't really think it's as helpful as people think. To wit: I know several stories of people rejected at ED schools and accepted at even more prestigious schools RD: Columbia and Harvard, Brown and Yale, in two cases. Furthermore, I know many kids rejected SCEA at Harvard who are now ecstatic that they are at Yale. Their thought is: "What was I thinking?"</p>
<p>Hmmm...I like mythmom's suggestion of just doing the application now and maybe applying EA instead of ED. I wonder if the daughter is just feeling overwhelmed by the reality of getting this first application completely done right away and she's just procrastinating. If she has to get the application done now either way, maybe it will be a relief.</p>
<p>People have thrown out a lot of explanations as to why DD's stated reason isn't the "real" reason. And they might be right. But you know, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar ;)</p>
<p>I have seen several times where kids are quite reluctant to feel like they've "pulled strings" to get something. Call it misplaced pride, a yearning to feel like they're standing on their own, etc. Just like the example 3tuitions gave of the kid who wouldn't let the parents call to arrange an interview, I know a situation where an alum knew a kid quite well and was on the alumni scholarship committee. As soon as kid found that out he refused to apply for the scholarship (for which he would have been a solid candidate) for fear it would somehow be tainted by the association. Even though said member promised to recuse herself and not pull any favors for the kid.</p>
<p>So me, I believe the DD means exactly what she said.</p>
<p>My nephew told my sister a year ago in July that he didn't want to go to the college where he'd applied and been accepted ED. It had been the only school he'd ever even talked about (Dad had gone there; parents divorced. Seems he wanted to be like "dear old dad" ). He wound up going one semester, took the second semester off & worked - completely miserable. Joined ROTC at State U the next year and is the happiest we have ever seen him. </p>
<p>I really like the EA idea in this situation. Doesn't obligate the student or the parents, but the ball is certainly rolling earlier than RD. </p>
<p>Good luck.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the insights and suggestions! I'm not sure that I can do any better than anyone else at deconstructing D's statement. If I had to guess, I think it might be a grain of the type of sincerity that mikemac describes; one part garden variety uncertainty and reluctance to close off any options; and maybe one part insecurity (if I need the ED boost, maybe everyone else will be smarter than me--she doesn't know much about grade inflation :) )</p>
<p>Decision time is still a good 6-8 weeks off, so I think I may suggest a return campus visit. Otherwise, my gut feeling is that it's best to listen, offer input only if invited, and otherwise keep quiet for now and let her wrestle to resolve her conflicted feelings. Some of the suggestions for addressing the concrete issues and concerns will probably come in handy later, so again, many thanks!</p>
<p>I agree that no one should apply E.D. if they're not totally comfortable with the idea, and your D clearly is not. I won't rehash all the pros and cons of E.D. which have already been discussed but I would like to comment on the issue of other applications. A few people here have mentioned how difficult it is to motivate kids who are rejected in the E.D. round to complete their applications in a timely manner by the early January due dates. Do not make this mistake! If your child is applying E.D., be sure that all those other apps are completed and ready to go before decision time in December. Never count on the E.D. acceptance to the extent that all other apps are ignored until the decision comes in. If the E.D. news is good, then great, celebrate! However, if the news is bad, those other apps are finished and ready to be sent out.</p>
<p>I completely agree with alwaysamom. </p>
<p>Several of my son's friends went the ED route and were rejected. It completely burst their bubbles. They had convienced themselves that their ED choice was the ONLY school for them and to regain the momentum was very very difficult. </p>
<p>Another friend applied ED to a top-notch school because she heard that was her best chance for acceptance. She got in, but had a change of heart. She is taking a gap year to decide if she wants to go there at all.</p>
<p>My son applied ED to his #1 school. He was accepted and (after a little more than a week, now) seems very happy there. FA was also not an issue for us. He also applied EA at a few schools (thanks to excellent advice from parents on this forum). The EA schools offered much more in the way of merit scholarships and had students and staff calling to woo him. The ED school gave him a very modest merit scholarship and no wooing -- they knew he was already coming. He was very concerned he wouldn't get in during the RD round, but in retrospect, I think he would have, and he would have had more choices. If my child had any doubts (even 5%) I wouldn't have encouraged ED.</p>