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He said this in response to a point that you brought up about finance, asking for clarification. You are the one that brought it up.
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<p>And why would he need clarification about the topic if he didn't care about it at all? I don't know about you, but I generally don't ask for details on a topic of which I don't care. </p>
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I just got a call from my friend who's been temping and graduated from Harvard K-School this year. I am totally serious. What did he want? He wanted help with his job search. I am being completely serious. I know I wouldn't believe it if I were you, Sakky, 'cause it's too perfect. Anyway, I asked him about his class. He said he thinks about 10% of his Harvard K-school class is still looking for work what is it 7-8 months after finishing; go to the list of top 15-20 b-schools and see how many, in a normal, year have what percentage of their classes employed by what times after graduation (these stats exist). He has a classmate who is working at a famous home supplies store (think orange and white signs with the word home in it).
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<p>You asked me for data regarding the top B-schools? Fine. Here is some. Here is the 2006 career data for HBS. Notice how 4% of the HBS class of that year secured their job after graduation. Now, granted, I can't find informati on about how much longer after graduation they got their jobs, but the bottom line is that they got their jobs sometime after graduation. </p>
<p>And HBS is (at least in my eyes) the best * of all the business schools. I freely admit that the OP is better off going to HBS than to KSG. But *even at HBS, a significant percentage of the class does not have a job at graduation. </p>
<p>Recruiting</a> at Harvard Business School</p>
<p>See, that is precisely the problem with your argument. Nobody is saying that KSG guarantees anything, and I never said that it did. But B-schools don't guarantee anything either. Like I said, there are plenty of MBA's who can't find the jobs they want, even if they come from elite schools. </p>
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Anyway, nothing I said proves your point because I said that an MBA provides 3 advantages <strong><em>when taken together</em></strong>: Some knowledge/language, branding, and perhaps most importantly an incredible platform from which to approach a really focused person-to-job matching system (the market for MBAs that are just graduating is incredible through the 2nd year recruiting process and because even companies that don't formally recruit on campuses will often be more open to "fresh" talent). I asked him if he thought Harvard K provided such person-to-job matching support. He said no way, and that for pretty much anybody intending to go into the private sector, getting an MBA at a "good" school was a better idea. He did say public-private or public opportunities could be better had at K-school he thought. (Finally, he said Harvard is re-establishing -- or has -- an MBA/MPP joint program that gives one both). So a Harvard degree may provide great branding, but absent the right knowledge/language and a great across-the-board recruiting process, going to Harvard just to get the right name on the resume is a silly idea, IMO.
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<p>Again, you are comparing 2 different things. Again, nobody is disputing that the career resources at HBS are better than at KSG (although, again, even some HBS grads can't find jobs they want by graduation). But that's not the question on the table. The question on the table is, does KSG provide better career resources than the MBA program at, say, Cornell (the #15 ranked program)? To that, I would say, yeah it probably does. Let's face it. I don't want to be overly harsh, but the Cornell Johnson School isn't exactly the most richly endowed of B-schools in the world, and Cornell University in general does not have the overall breadth of resources that Harvard does. Furthermore, recruiting at KSG is greatly eased by the fact that you are within a major metropolitan area, compared to being confined to a rural pocket like Ithaca. </p>
<p>The bottom line is that not all B-schools really provide the "top" person-to-job matching that you tout. The best ones like HBS do (although, like I said, even at HBS, a significant fraction of grads do not have jobs by graduation), and the rest of the M7 do. But a strong drop-off occurs as you start going down the rankings. At some crossover point, you are probably better off just going to KSG and taking advantage of the branding opportunity and the better Harvard alumni network available there. </p>
<p>Let's not romanticize B-schools. They aren't the perfect paradises that you are portraying them to be. Not every MBA student gets what they want. I know a lot of MBA students from elite schools who not only did not get the jobs for the companies that they wanted, they didn't even get jobs in the industry that they wanted, and had to go back to their old industry that they don't really want, just to pay the bills. </p>
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. Also, where you really lost me is suggesting that going for any Harvard degree is worth it no matter what you study or almost no matter what you study.
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<p>You didn't read carefully enough. What I said is that if prestige is what you really care about, then, frankly, any Harvard degree will do. Is that really a controversial point? Whether we like it or not, Harvard has the most prestigious brand name in the world. The real question you then have to ask yourself is how much do you really value prestige? If prestige is all you care about, then going to Harvard (for any degree) probably is the way to go. </p>
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It's not only that it's prestige whorish, it's that it's simply wrong. People aren't that stupid in the real world; a hedge fund manager or a tech product manager going to the market is not going to pick up a Harvard MPA expecting the same level of expertise as a Cornell MBA.
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<p>Oh, I think you massively overestimate the integrity and quality of the hiring/HR process. It's not so much about having some manager 'pick' you, it's really about just getting into the interview room in the first place, which often times tends to boil down to impressing somebody in HR to even let you in the door. You can't get the offer if you can't even get in the door. </p>
<p>Secondly, and probably more importantly, as I think you know, a lot (probably most) of hiring is done through social networks, of which alumni networks is certainly one important feature. Hiring managers often times don't "pick" a Cornell MBA or a Harvard MPA. What they are really doing is "picking" somebody that their friend recommended. Let's be perfectly honest. At almost any company, you will find employees who got hired into the company because they knew people on the inside. </p>
<p>By going to KSG, you are giving yourself access to the best alumni network in the world. That is a tremendously valuable resource to leverage. So much so that B-school administrators themselves will point to the alumni network as one of their core offerings they are providing. Why do they do that if the alumni network does not hold value? In fact, I recall that one of the core offerings that a representative of the Oxford Said MBA program was touting that, while the program was very new, they can still offer networking access to the general Oxford alumni network. </p>
<p>But be honest, who has a better alumni network than Harvard? Now, granted, HBS specifically has a tighter alumni network than any other part of Harvard. Hence, if the OP can get into HBS, then of course he should pick that over KSG or any other part of Harvard. But what if he can't? Again, what if the best he can do is get into the #15 B-school? Is it really so insane to prefer the Harvard alumni network? </p>
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Well, I would have thought you'd brought it up and said, "you know, I am from the Philippines too -- or at least I am of P. descent -- and when I visit that country it's always my distinct impression that...."blah blah blah.
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<p>Why would I have to do that? I think you know full well that I rarely, if ever, talk about my personal biography publicly. </p>
<p>However, you shouldn't presume that you know anything about me or anybody else on this discussion group. </p>
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I don't know that you don't have this background. What I do know is that many, many times on CC you have called people wrong and asserted things as if they were arguable facts which are actually matters of perception, experience, or simple opinion
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<p>I am simply expressing my opinions as I see them, and when they differ from others, I am asking for clarification and supporting evidence. If they provide it, then that may compel me to change my mind. I have changed my mind when somebody presents to me new evidence of which I had not previously been aware. </p>
<p>But my stance is that if people have opinions, they should be based on the best verifiable facts and data that I can then examine, or if that is lacking, then at least they should be able to present a cogent argument as to why they believe what they do. If they cannot, then I will probably be unconvinced. </p>
<p>Everybody is obviously free to have their own opinions. But I am also free to have my own opinion and to be able to express that opinion and to also express how mine differs from theirs. That is what a discussion board is all about. It's all about being able to read different opinions. Why even have a discussion board if people can't discuss their opinions? Those who don't like my opinions are free to not read them.</p>