His commitment out of West Point for Cyber+master’s is nine years. He’s only three years in, but will honor his full commitment even though the Army does allow buyouts. He does not plan to make the Army his career, though. He is working on classified stuff that he can’t tell us about other than it’s “pretty cool.”
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Is it fair to say that he is in more of an operational role in the army, but is more in a development role in the private sector?
No, he is in a pure development role (17D) in the Army though he also leads a development team. He slides between offensive and defensive work.
I had to laugh at the comment upthread, “Your son didn’t follow his passion, he realized that there is something more interesting and more useful than playing games.” He’s playing war games now with pretty high stakes. And loves it.
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@tarator, beyond rude.
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Back on topic, please. Random poster’s impressions of workers in any field is not relevant, nor is any impressions of him
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In case users want a moderator to say it, here you go: Get back to topic please
[quote=“aheltzel, post:572, topic:3612962”]
I think it’s more important for us as parents to help our children sort out many of these intangibles and to help guide them than it is to focus on super high paying jobs
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I really liked your post, and found it quite thought provoking. I think you keyed in on something very valuable in the above quote. I wish I had had someone to hone in on those sorts of questions when I was that age. My own path may have been less meandering to start…but then again, maybe not. Some of us are just late bloomers.
I also grew up in a low income family. It was hoped, even expected, that I and my siblings would go to college, and that in itself was considered a step up. (For the record, two of us did, one chose a military career.) The adults around me worked as secretaries, waitresses, cab drivers, factory workers and so on. Consequently I had limited exposure to possible college graduate type careers, and no guidance as to how to discern them. The upside (to me) is that I was never pressured to follow a particular path.
Regardless, I was expected to be self supporting, and there was no financial safety net (let alone an inheritance) waiting for me. My high school graduation present was a suitcase…hint hint 
Anyway, I completely understand the sentiments you’ve expressed in your post, even if I come to somewhat different conclusions. But I do think the sorts of questions and guidance you are giving your children is spot on. Best of luck to you and them.
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My daughter’s roommate got an MBA at very decent school, possibly top 20, but I don’t keep track off it, her employer paid for it, it took her 3 years part time. I got my MS from an expensive school, my employer paid for it, it took me 1 year part time. There are many ways.
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Sometimes. Some places. Some degrees. I spoke to one of my nephews last weekend. He’s in a grad program at Columbia ( roughly 85K per year). He needs to do two years for a Masters and all the internships which are really good are not paid. Eventually he’d like to get into a doctoral program and we spoke about that. The field is broad the opportunities are very narrow.
It’s not like it used to be. Many corporations used to pay for grad school. Many Universities did too. Free. And jobs paid too. Not like that anymore in many fields.
My nephew knows there’s a big payday in his field with a doctoral level degree. He’s deciding how to get there ( and which degree) partly based on the costs. He’ll be paying for grad school and beyond, has no debt from undergrad.
One person getting one paid grad degree doesn’t mean that’s the norm.
I also got a grad degree at an Ivy decades ago. At that time, most of my peers paid nothing and many of us were TA’s. I doubt that’s the case anymore.
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Thanks for his service. Sounds like a wonderful young man. Thank goodness that he played video games. What a benefit we’ve all received from that area of his interest. And thanks to you for letting him find his own path, degree and career. All part of a great story. Love this. And I bet he is working on amazing technology and will really succeed at GT.
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I am surprised. Are you sure? I thought all/most PhD track admissions pay something at most T50 or even lower schools.
I think a very small number of master track programs pay.
I was told that probably “all” masters track admissions at Princeton are effectively tuition free. That will get you part of the way to something painless.
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You are incorrect, maybe you are thinking of how it was many years ago. He was signing the loans at Xmas time and he spoke to me at length about the costs over the weekend. It’s going to be $160K+ We even spoke about types of loans.
I was helping him with the variations on his doctoral approach ( though he is not in my exact field). A large part of our discussion was about opportunity costs, breaking up the degrees (pause before starting doctorate for example), side jobs and what would an ultimate career look like.
We spoke at length also about pitfalls such as what would things look like if he didn’t receive a doctoral degree, what can one do with a masters in that field.
I think the idea that if you get into a great school like Columbia for graduate work that you won’t be taking on debt. That is false. I won’t say which field he is in but it’s not a soft humanities field. It’s a field with both research, medical and other applications. He also was accepted into many other programs only one was a no tuition thing ( but not a fit).
He knows he can go into a private corp and make lots of money. But he’s interested in the field at this point. The doctoral process has not changed. One needs to find a program that fits like a glove and then get accepted. Not that easy.
And I didn’t say Phd track, I said doctoral and his path is Masters first as he wanted to go to Columbia, figure out the exact path and either stay or go elsewhere. That’s typical for many Phd and doctoral students. He did apply to Phd/doctoral programs out of undergrad but there were no fits/matches.
That is interesting. I have not heard anyone do this even recently. The issues that I have heard are along the lines of “Berkeley is not paying enough to their grad students, and on the margin they are missing some of the best kids. And this is because grad stipends are set UC wide, and are not competitive given Berkeley’s stature” etc.
Is it sensitive to share the field? I am curious.
Maybe more economical to work for an year, and importantly do some research, and reapply as PhD track, if the field allows. Often the lack of research in undergrad is what hurts PhD track admission outcomes.
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I don’t think it’s the norm at all, but it’s also not uncommon.
One of my kids graduate programs gave her a grant that covered room and board.
The other (same school, different degree) is giving her financial aid and merit.
Last year I supervised a student who received a large merit award to grad school.
It exists, but certainly not for all degrees.
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I only know a few kids who made a ton of money right out of the college. I do know plenty of kids who made a decent, but not super high income right out of college. I live in a wealthy area and our kids have friends whose parents pay for vacations and other stuff, so it makes these 20 somethings look wealthier then they really are. Not anything wrong with that, just the way it is. I didn’t make a ton out of college, but I made enough to live a decent life and I did manage to save.
Again, I think you are trying to apply what happens in some programs to all programs. My nephew did a lot of research ( I think this is how he got into many programs including Columbia). His best choice was Columbia. And I would imagine that many kids applying to grad/phd/doctoral and other programs apply and chose their best outcome.
Another factor, my nephew after high school had some great options. One was a very large state U with a highly ranked program which he chose over T20 and an Ivy. Many thought he was crazy to go there v. other choices (better names). But he chose the program. As a result he had an excellent undergrad experience and some amazing internships and jobs while in college.
This is a very broad statement. I can imagine that it applies in some fields/programs and not in others.
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True. Admission to graduate programs is no walk in the park. You don’t just get to decide you want to do a graduate degree or attend a professional program. These admits even at lower ranked schools are highly selective and are generally based on much much more than just undergraduate GPA. If you want to see how many excellent students get shut out of grad school admissions take a browse through the grad admissions Reddit.
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What do you mean by “doctoral” program that’s distinct from a PhD program? Do you mean some professional programs like MD or JD?
For PhD programs, either they’re fully funded (by research or teaching assistantships or fellowships), or they aren’t worth going into. On the other hand, most Masters programs aren’t funded (there’re some exceptions). This is true decades ago and still true today.
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I think many people on CC are thinking of their experiences rather than updated info. It’s difficult to get into a great grad/Phd/doctoral program these days. There’s lots of competition and you aren’t going to get in if you don’t fit the profile.
When I went to grad school, very very few people had a graduate degree. In 2000, it was 8% in the late 1980’s it was surely a much lower number. So schools had incentives.
Naturally, it depends on a number of factors but it’s important to keep current stats in mind.