Difference b/w community college and state university?

Student Lounge College Life
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How do you differentiate between a community college and a university?

I just looked at last year’s common data set for a local school, surprisingly only 5% of the student are from other states and only 25% of total student body lives on campus and 70% applicants get accepted to college. This is not a small rural campus but a big suburban campus in a large metroplex. Class sizes are large, athletics is hardly existent, arts and humanities considered waste of time, most students have same majors. Their lack of diversity, intellectual challenge and luke warm college experience leaves a lot to be desired.

This college is despised by local youth but largely loved by their parents to keep them at home, big fish in small pond, away from non parental influences and paying little (easy scholarships) to get required credit done. Is this enough or does students need more than course credit from their education?

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Like many things in life “it depends” if this type of educational setting is enough or not. Some people don’t have much of a choice, this is what they can afford or get admitted to. For that individual this has to be enough. Take it and run with it and they can benefit from the education.

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Obviously it would be useless to see it from perspective of ones who lack choices. This is a general question.

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The actual difference between a community college and a university is that a community college is generally a school offering associates degree programs and other two year or less programs, as well as transfer preparation for those who want to transfer to universities. They are typically open admission, although some popular programs like nursing may be hard to get into. In contrast, a university offers at least bachelor’s degree programs, and is commonly selective.

While many see the college experience to be a residential one, it is likely the most college students commute to local schools from where they lived before college, whether they attend community colleges or universities.

The residential college experience is often a luxury for those with enough parental money, or who have high end academic credentials to get into colleges with good financial aid, or earn enough scholarships.

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The general situation is that most college students’ choices are limited in various ways.

  1. Money. Median household income in the US is around the Pell grant threshold, so it is not like many students and their families can afford the residential college experience (which most colleges will not give enough need-based financial aid to cover). Most students would gladly trade places in the college money aspect with the self-described "middle class" that will not get need-based financial aid anywhere (> $260,000 income) but can afford "only" state flagship costs for a residential student.
  2. Increasingly selective admissions at the more residential state flagships and private schools.
  3. Parental restrictions on traditional students, such as the common stories of requiring the student to live at home and commute (regardless of cost or academic fit).
  4. Work and family obligations for non-traditional students.
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State universities typically offer bachelor’s, master’s, and doctoral programs. A community college typically offers two years of college classes. It offers courses you can use for general education requirements. You can then transfer to a four-year university to finish your bachelor’s degree.

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How do you know the college considers the arts and humanities a “waste of time”? Is this a STEM focused school?

How can most students at a large city campus have the same majors? If it’s a tech school it might be possible to have similar types of degrees, but otherwise majors that don’t get many takers would have a difficult time justifying their budgets and wouldn’t exist for very long.

From the posts we get on CC I think that can be said of many state schools. The kids from Jersey want to to go west. The kids on the west coast want to head east. Local colleges are often considered “an extension of high school.” Generally, this attitude doesn’t have to do with any feature of the college except proximity to home.

Where in the Common Data Set does it say why parents send their children to school there? College choice is often driven by finances and residential college is a luxury most families can’t afford. In my opinion, you can’t have a meaningful conversation about why people are behaving a certain way if you ignore one of the major reasons that may drive their choices.

Without knowing the name of the college it’s difficult to judge the quality of the education it offers. Certainly things like clubs, networking opportunities, research, a rich program in the arts and humanities, etc. enrich students lives. But, like fit, these are luxuries lower income families don’t often get to choose. They need the credit that will lead to the degree.

There are public schools (secondary as well as college) that could stand an upgrade. The students would benefit from a broader, deeper curriculum, better equipment, updated books, and an opportunity to participate in the arts. These things take money. If you truly believe your local university is lacking I hope you’re advocating for them at the state level. But it’s a disservice to students and faculty at both types of schools to compare it to a community college. Our state community colleges are solid schools with dedicated faculty who offer an excellent education. I think most states have similar systems.

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Let me rephrase the question and expand it more. What do you call an ideal enriching college experience?

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That’s an interesting but loaded question. You can have an enriching ideal college experience anywhere.

I would think a safe environment that let’s the student be independent, free thinking and being able to mature at their own pace. Being challenged in educational curiosity and being involved with the campus in a way that speaks to them. All this with a central goal but that might change to gear towards a degree that will lead to meaningful employment.

How’s that?

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@Knowsstuff That is brief but brilliant. As important as it is for a educational institution to get you employed, education education can’t be reduced to just that.

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@CupCakeMuffins (your name is making me hungry… Lol…). It’s funny since I am just seeing what both my kids in college are going through. One is at a small LAC and the other is at a known Big Ten school. Both are happy as can be due to what I wrote and wouldn’t trade for the others experience. I “had” to go to community college my first year then worked my way through a 4 year college living at home. All while a lot of my friends went away to college. I had the “away at college” experience in medical school. Overall, I was happy with my overall college experience since that is what I knew. I did visit friends etc at other away 4 year colleges and their experience wasn’t that much different.

But saying that… If you have the resources, I would not want my child at home going to college . I see levels of independence and maturity in my kids that I think living on your own brings to the table. We joke with my son since he is so different in all the positive ways a parent would want and expect and he says “going away to college does that to you”.

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@Knowsstuff I was sitting at a bakery when I picked this name as sweet devils were still tempting me.

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Seems like that aspect would favor colleges where part time attendance is allowed with as little financial penalty as possible (e.g. the local community college and non-flagship state university), since some students may need more time than the four (or five) year college plan is set up for.

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@ucbalumnus. Not my intention for the comment. But I agree with what you are saying. Yes, some kids need that much time. I was just thinking about my two very different kids. It appears to us that my son needed time to grow and mature into the 20 year old that he is today. I am talking more mental maturity not that he was immature per se. These two years in college like transformed him into this go getter and not the introverted kid he was as an entering freshman. We told both our kids that they don’t have to be the same kids that they were in high school. They could sorta reinvent themsleves in college to whom they want to become. He took this to heart in a positive way. But I agree with your comments also.

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“How do you differentiate between a community college and a university?”

100% depends on the college. I went to a community college that was more urban, had more political movement and clubs, more student involvement and fewer people living at home than many, many universities. But there are no community colleges that would compare to my state’s flagship in terms of research opportunities.

“I just looked at last year’s common data set for a local school, surprisingly only 5% of the student are from other states and only 25% of total student body lives on campus and 70% applicants get accepted to college… Class sizes are large, athletics is hardly existent, arts and humanities considered waste of time, most students have same majors. Their lack of diversity, intellectual challenge and luke warm college experience leaves a lot to be desired.”

Yeah, sounds like some of the less competitive state Us in my area.

“Is this enough or does students need more than course credit from their education?”

I think you’re overlooking the quality of education. I personally didn’t have time to do a lot other than work and go to school, but the quality of the faculty mattered to me. The fact that you said “arts and humanities considered a waste of time” seems more telling than anything–I could recommend some CCs that have excellent, passionate and great faculty but if you want to research you’re more likely to find the level of academics you need at a university.

I have met people from private schools whose humanities education was pathetic–I have met people who went to Yale and Harvard who were shockingly unaware of current events, liberal democratic values, or how to work with people.

If you want to study with people who are enthusiastic about their education, find a school where that is happening. Doesn’t have to be a university.

If you want to research, you need to go to a university.

If you want to research with well-known people, that needs to be a top 5 in its field.

If you want to research with rich people, that needs to be someplace rich people go.

You might find that your goal is to study with very rich people who are not enthusiastic about education. Their English only sounds weak until you realize they are just as incoherent in their native language. In that case I recommend an art institute or community college with lots of rich kids with F1 visas. You want a 1:1 ratio of people at the bus stop at a given hour, and # of Maseratis in the parking lot.

There really is something for everyone.

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@CupCakeMuffins

This sounds like the university I went to (after community college). I went there because:

  1. It was closed to where I lived. Moving would be prohibitively costly.
  2. It allowed me to support myself and two younger brothers.
  3. It was the fastest way for me to get a college degree.
  4. It was the easiest way (but it was NOT easy) for me to get a college degree.

My main goal at the time was to get a college degree, and to get out of the odd jobs I was doing just to survive.

Did it leave “a lot to be desired”? Yes.

Did it help me to fulfill my goal? Absolutely yes.

Did it open many opportunities for me? Absolutely yes.

My first job after graduation was a chip designer. About a year later on the job, I was working with two customer engineers, both from the same “prestigious” university. They were very proud of that and were surprised (in disbelief) when I told them what university I was from. I guess they liked me, because we later booked many more designs from the same customer.

After my first job interview, I don’t think anyone cares about what university I went to.

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Forget prestige or jobs, my question is about wholesome experience and gaining more neurons and depth as a person.

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I think getting a “wholesome experience and gaining more neurons and depth as a person” can happen at most colleges and it comes down to the student putting in the initiative to challenge themselves, seek out opportunities to build relationships with faculty and do interesting projects. However, moving out of your parents’ home definitely helps in pushing students to mature more quickly. My husband went to a regional state U like you describe and lived at home and does regret that he didn’t move out until graduation. It did limit his experiences since he’s rather introverted and living at home didn’t give him the push he needed to really engage with the campus community. Still, he got a good engineering education and a good job.

Be careful about concluding that the stat “25% live on campus” means 74% live with parents. When I was applying to colleges my dad wanted me to apply to Cal Poly SLO and I was initially put off because the guide book description showed a low % living on campus, describing it as a “commuter school.” It’s definitely not a commuter school, it’s just that most students move off campus after freshman year to nearby apartments. I ended up loving it when we visited and did go there – and lived off campus for three years.

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More relevant to determining the commuter population would be the percentage of frosh living on campus, since it is common for non-commuter frosh to live on campus. The percentage living on campus overall is commonly much lower because many non-commuter students live nearby off campus. Note: for CPSLO, 91% of frosh live on campus.

Obviously, this is not a perfect measure, but it may be the best available, because the common data set numbers do not distinguish between various types of off-campus living (i.e. commuting from living with parents versus living off campus otherwise).

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People’s definitions of “wholesome experience” and “depth as a person” vary, and it is not a given that different college non-academic experiences automatically mean a more or less wholesome experience or depth as a person.