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<p>However, would it be surprising if they did additional verification (not just of GPA) on the much smaller number of preliminary admits before finalizing the admission decisions?</p>
<p>"Yes. “Understanding the practices” of the schools in a given rep’s area means understanding that Happy Valley High has a bunch of tough grading teachers, whereas Sweet Valley High gives out A’s like candy. Or that Happy Valley High gives pluses and minuses and Sweet Valley High doesn’t. That doesn’t translate to “we stripped everything down to just math, science, English, history, and foreign language and recalculated.” "</p>
<p>Pizzagirl, </p>
<p>How do they eyeball bunch of stars for grades? Use their magic wand?</p>
<p>Since you have experience with NU, what is your understanding of the process used on their 31k applications to make them more meaningful across board? I am not arguing this point with you but I really would like to understand how the process might actually work instead of making guesses at it. I do agree that they may not process each one by putting them through a spreadsheet. They must be able to say somehow that some school that does nt want to provide a rank and the other school which gives out stars have a baseline to compare the students from both these place.</p>
<p>I am 100% with Pizzagirl on this issue and here’s why. Last month our private school had a mock admissions night. We were given transcripts of 5 ficticious students. All of us were broken up into separate rooms with 2 actual admissions officers in each room. In our room there were 2 ladies, one from Princeton, and one from the University of Chicago. They went over with us EXACTLY how they read applications from start to end. They looked at the dempgraphic page first and then went right to the transcript. </p>
<p>There were two things that surprised me. First, GPA was not even mentioned. They just looked at all grades and were looking for a steady or upward trend in grades, but also with that, that they were taking harder classes each year and challenging themselves. The 2nd thing that surprised me is that they really didn’t look at every class they took and eliminate based on kids who took different classes. Example; they didn’t look and say." oh, they didn’t take APUSH or AP LiT, so there out." It was basically a very quick glance and then they moved on. The kid who got worse grades in harder classes was pretty much eliminated. They then quickly looked at test scores to see if they were in the ballpark. They spent the most time on essays, EC’s and teacher rec’s.</p>
<p>Now I’m sure this is not what goes down at a state school, but at the private’s it looks pretty holistic.</p>
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<p>I heard it’s about a third of applicants at Stanford. When it comes to frivolous, I would think it’s elite universities that get lion’s share. I can’t imagine it happens frequently at State U. I think they can eyeball 3.90 and 3.95, too. They probably don’t care about the difference in 3.95 and 3.96. At my kid’s school, they list core courses at the top of the transcript. It’s really easy to look at grades and come up with a rough estimate of GPAs.</p>
<p>I am glad State Universities take time to recalculate GPAs since their admission is more number drven.</p>
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<p>Some of the college admissions books specifically mentioned the opposite. For example, there is mark for trio of science, calculus, etc…If the high school has 20 APs and the student only took 4 APs. Check out several of these books and find out what’s really going on behind closed doors.</p>
<p>Yes, I realize that there are probably things that they were leaving out, or not telling us, but this was the general feel of the program. I’m sure when they go through the applications initially, the mark on the folder if they had the science trio… etc… It was just that they really didn’t scrutinize it as much as I thought they did. Maybe it was all an act… No one really knows what goes on inside that room. It did seem a lot like this whe I watched the Amherst NPR thing though.</p>
<p>@45^ Our school offers 24 APs no one takes all of them. I think 8-10 APs is the most any elite college cares about and many many high schools limit the number of APs a student can take even if many are offered. MIT says the average number of AP tests their accepted students have taken is a measly 5.</p>
<p>We don’t even know my daughter’s GPA. SHe spent 9th and 10th grades in a school that graded on a 0-100% scale and 11th and 12th in an IB Program that grades from 1-7 with 7 being the best. The only time it was a concern was with Rutgers who seems to award scholarships automatically based on GPA (or percentile). My daughter also didn’t have a percentile as she was in very small schools. I wrote Rutgers and asked if the only reason she did not receive a scholarship was because of lack of info about her grades we would be happy to supply more. I suspected she would get one because she got partial scholarhips at other state colleges. I was right and she was awarded one.</p>
<p>5boys,
I just read your post about U of Chicago and I almost laughed. Nobody understand what U of Chicago is looking in applicants. I have only experience with my D. applying to Med. School there. Most people recieve rejection within few hours after paying application fee (close to $100). There was discussion on Med. threads about U of Chicago. I believe that only one person got an interview, not sure about acceptance. Others basically joke about experience and have no idea what Chicago is looking for. Again, one in the third group who is applying next cycle, pointed out that it was known to him since applying UG, and for that reason he is not going to bother applying there to Med. School. I am not surprised at all that U of Chicago does not even look at GPA, I expect them not to. If one has stats to apply to U of Chicago, he has stats to apply at many top places, including Harvard and such. Since unpredictable nature of Chacago admission become very well know, more and more people simply will not bother applying there. My D. did not care one way or another, she was very happy with her list of acceptances.</p>
<p>mathmom, I agree it’s impossible to take all APs, but not 4/5 APs out of 20 APs. My kid will have 9-10 APs without really trying hard out of a school that offers 16-20 APs. Senior year alone counts for 5-6 APs because AP Econ and AP Gov count as 2 APs.</p>
<p>DrGoogle… our school offers around 24 AP’s, but they do limit. 1 10th grade, no more than 2 11th and no more than 3 Senior year. This is a rigorous college prep school so AP’s are nortoriously tortureous.</p>
<p>^The same, D. could not have more than 6, 3 in each upper class. It did not matter too much, since her prep. school regular classes were harder than AP’s at some other schools, which has landed her a job as Chem. prof. Supplemental Instructor (was hand picked by prof) in college (AP Chem was NOT offerred at D’s HS, but she still was way ahead of others)</p>
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<p>Or maybe they don’t need to scrutinize closely to know who makes the first round. At top tier, it’s probably not more than 2-3 B’s. Easy to spot a few Bs. It’s tougher at State universities. If many combinations of Bs/Cs get you admitted, one has to do more than quick glance.</p>
<p>Igloo… but here we go again with different schools. At my S’s school, hardly anyone gets just a few B’s… they can get a lot of B’s and still get into top schools… Very few kids have over a 4.2 W GPA. Although they only compute GPA 10- first semester 12th, and academic classes only. I always wonder when people post GPA’s on this forum, if it includes P.E. and music, etc., or just academic classes. Our school keeps it real for the kids.</p>
<p>Real in our state includes a lot of college classes for many of the strong high school students. Adcoms sure have their work cut out for them!</p>
<p>5Boys - Are these fictitious students from a single school and graded on the same basis?</p>
<p>If so, that still does nt answer my question.</p>
<p>How do they compare a student who gets stars for grades vs someone who gets straight percentage as a grade vs someone who gets weighted grades all over the place. May be I should just post this question in the MIT forum where they seem to answer these questions.</p>
<p>"Real in our state includes a lot of college classes for many of the strong high school students. "</p>
<p>-D’s HS does not allow taking classes outside of school. It really does not matter for colleges. They just know some schools, period. Few tops from D’s HS have always gone to Ivy’s every single year. Although my D. had no aspiration to do so, few kids from her class (of 33) were accepted.</p>
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<p>Percentage numbers are pretty straightforward, actually easier to interpret than letters since some systems 90-100 is an A and in many systems 94-100 is an A or some derivative.</p>
<p>As far as “stars” in lieu of grades, I don’t remember where this came up, but if I was a parent with a student with P/F or stars in lieu of number or letter grades I would first want a copy of othe schools profile to see how the school gives guidance to the colleges. Secondly, if the profile was not clear I would contact the colleges on the application list and ask specific questions. If MIT is on your list you would be better off asking MIT the question rather than kids or parents (if you student does not have numerical or letter grades) YMMV.</p>
<p>At the very least, all college students have standardized tests either ACT or SAT that give colleges an indication of where they fall nationally so again, the admissions department is not working in a vacuum.</p>
<p>Miami, I believe you. As I say, adcoms have their work cut out for them, don’t they?</p>
<p>Another person might say,</p>
<p>Who cares if it works for ivies - will it meet the UC a-g requirements? ;)</p>
<p>Realistically this is the true question for many students – does it meet my state school requirements – a fact that is too often forgotten here on cc.</p>