This thread is the very reason I restricted both my kids with a budget. I can afford to pay $80K if needed but I work in an industry where getting laid off at 50+ pretty much means one is done. Not to mention, we are a 1 income family.
OP and wife have done well by delaying gratification and being sensible. Why not impart the same lessons to your children?
Objectively, Purdue and RHIT are far better engineering schools anyway. Purdue will offer many major opportunities if she decides to not pursue engineering. And then there is always the option of transferring out.
Just another point to ponder. I too assumed my kids would get grad degrees; both parents have them. D1 is happy in her career and will avoid a grad degree like the plague. No possibility. D2 had offers from employers to pay for grad school by the time she was a college junior. So I am glad I didnt leave money on the 529s for that after all, though I guess it could be transferred to the grandchildren if I ever have any.
Good point! We might get lucky, tho D1 is an International Studies major, and 1st job likely in the Peace Corps. We’re trying to advise D2 a little more directly re majors that pay.
So hard to tell in advance what they might do. My college sophomore may end up as an English teacher. A very commendable profession that she’s be great at, but I’m seriously glad she has no student debt going into that line of work.
I’m a parent, so take that for what it’s worth, but I graduated from one of those big-name 80k/year today schools. I graduated without debt, but most of my classmates had debt from undergrad, went to grad school and took on more debt, and have been keeping their student loans around like accessories for two plus decades. They are almost all working alongside people who went to less expensive schools. Those who aren’t still talk about their debt all the time. Some of these people were the same people who bragged about spring break when we were in school.
What people say shouldn’t impact where you and your kid decide she should go. If she’s open to suggestion, that opportunity cost factor is a good consideration to bring up. Since you prepared, you have the luxury of letting her have more of a say than a family who couldn’t afford it might. You can always look at the US Education Department’s website on the economic value of certain degrees in helping guide her. Once she/you all decide, let the schools know and stop thinking about it. It’s so personal and subjective. It sounds like you and she will be fine either way.
We were full pay and never regretted it. Our kids took advantage of every academic and intellectual opportunity that came their way, and that gave us more pleasure than a fancy car or granite countertops. We were lucky… stable marriage, good health, two incomes. And we didn’t mind the lean years…
Not everyone can be full pay so we fully appreciate our good fortune. However, there were a lot of colleges we were not willing to pay full freight. We were willing to pay more for academic rigor, not for better weather, better social life, nicer dorms, close to beaches. Kids were told “8 semesters and done”. You need a 5th year because of poor planning or flunking a class or too many incompletes? Year 5 is on you.
And figure out a plan for adulthood before you graduate. We were not willing to subsidize a few years of “small salary large lifestyle” like we have seen with friends…even the ones who insisted on the cheapest college seem to have no trouble with a fancy apartment, nice car, etc.
For engineering especially though, students can do this almost anywhere. Engineering is engineering. The experience differs at the margins.
I have an acquaintance who taught at Caltech and managed a huge NASA project at JPL. When he found out our son wanted to be an engineer, he literally said, “Let me tell you a secret…it doesn’t matter where he goes to school. What matters is his curiosity and drive.”
We didn’t completely subscribe to that, feeling that we saved enough that we could, to a degree, help him find a good fit.
We then asked him after his first term if he thought his school was the “perfect fit.” He said, “I like it here a lot, but honestly, I would have been fine at every school I applied to.”
One of his good friends in HS went to our local flagship, because that’s all his family could afford. He’s a graduate student at MIT now.
In this specific case there may actually be less academic and intellectual opportunity than at the cheaper options.
We were not willing to pay for a second tier engineering program. And since our MIT kid ended up NOT majoring in engineering, being at a place with a tough and extensive core where it was easy to change majors turned out to be a good call. Freshman year was spent falling in and out of love with several disciplines until it all came together.
Rigor. Not willing to pay more for less or fewer challenges. YMMV.
I agree wholeheartedly. We are full pay too, but would not limit D23 based on $ especially after the applications are in and the kid was told could go anywhere. In fact, D23 has a full COA at a Wake Forest—huge surprise—and might pick it, because it is amazing for her and the scholars have so many added benefits. However , there has been and will not be any pressing her to take that from us.
The issue is: how much of a squeeze is for you? That is a very personal decision.
We both graduated debt free from undergrad (pell grant and/or financial aid plus parents could afford both EFCs though one set chose some loans). We were on our own for med school. No possibility of any parent help and we likely would have tried hard to turn it down given how tight it was for both . Graduated about 20 yrs ago, Paid it all off, both med schools, 12-14 yrs(staggered finishing one), well before friends who wanted bigger lifestyles after med school .
If ours want grad school they are likely on their own or mostly so. We paid for K-12 and are paying for college; it is their turn. We have way more means than our parents did, but we valued the lessons of driving old cars and living within our means and getting the loans done. Financial discipline is an important skill .
Every penny so far for D21 (Duke) has been absolutely worth it. The quality of education and the opportunities are fabulous, as it is at ND. A family member went to ND and they are definitely convinced it was worth full pay. I don’t hve any personal experience with RH or purdue but clearly folks on here are advocating strongly that they will be great too . Only your kid can figure out the fit factor.
Good luck! It really is a personal decision.
We are lucky enough to be able to comfortably afford any college for our kids. S22 chose his cheapest option (state flagship) because he didn’t like any of the other schools more than he liked the flagship and he didn’t feel the cost difference (substantial) was worth it. We will pay for grad school (wants to be a therapist) or give him the 529 money he didn’t spend. S24 has a more expensive list of selective schools - depending on acceptances we are looking at $80k+ per year for him. In that case, we are done after 4 years and he understands that (has expressed no interest in grad school thus far). I realize that being able to pay for college is a luxury and I feel fortunate we are in a position to do so.
There was a fascinating article in the WSJ (if I’m remembering correctly, it could have been Bloomberg or the Economist) a few years back about a flagship U which had moved towards a “modest merit” strategy and away from need based aid. Fast-forward- the place is crawling with affluent kids; low income families can no longer afford to send their kids there (hey, they are tax payers too) and mom and dad get to brag that Little Chip and Muffy are such great students that the U is PAYING them to attend (never mind that 5K off sticker while generous is not terribly substantial.)
The part of the article that I think is relevant for you, were the interviews with faculty who bristled with resentment that they had to walk past parking lot after parking lot of student cars- filled with BMW’s and expensive late model cars- to get to the faculty lot (now moved to the outer edge of campus) to get into their beat-up Nissan and Hyundais.
Kids can find obnoxious rich kids at state schools, private schools, religious schools, secular schools. They can also find rich kids who grew up with a modest lifestyle; low income kids who materialistic and status conscious; middle class kids who have an enormous sense of gratitude for what they have and middle class kids who resent the poor kids who have it so easy (as if) and the rich kids who flaunt their wealth.
I’d be spending a day at a soup kitchen or food pantry with any college kid of mine who started sounding entitled or resentful. And if that wasn’t enough to wipe the entitlement slate clean, we’d be distributing band-aids and clean socks at a homeless shelter the very next day.
So I wouldn’t use the experience of your older kid to color your financial decision-making with this kid. There are ways to nip the attitude in the bud!!!
I am surprised only one post above has mentioned fit so far, the most important factor cited on most CC threads.
My D is currently at ND for engineering and selected it over multiple amazing opportunities, including Georgia Tech with $85k merit (as oos). When we visited GT (on Gold Carpet Day) the tour guide mentioned that as a second semester sophomore the smallest class she’s had so far was 40+ students. That was a red flag for my D and ultimately the reason she ruled out GT.
In contrast, at the end of our ND visit (also on admitted students day), she knew that was where she wanted to go. She also received a merit scholarship from ND and some unexpected need based aid (ND is known to be generous). Still, the COA at ND was significantly higher than the other top options she had.
She is now very happy at ND, enjoying small classes and additional academic support she is getting from another program she got into, which we didn’t even know existed at the time of our visit. I know OP is weighing an a full pay option and we’re not in the same situation, but our obligation in proportion to our overall situation doesn’t make our choice any simpler and no debt is involved.
At the end of the day, we place high value on education and our decision is to help D get the best education she can at a place where she felt the fit was great.
The student may end up changing her major. The ND experience from a student happiness perspective is phenomenal. ND is exceptional in almost all aspects: small class size, research opportunities, post-college outcomes, network, classmates, etc. Everyone I know that has attended raves about it. If affordability is not an insurmountable issue, I would unequivocally choose ND.
It’s a personal call but they are clearly not comfortable.
There are compromise schools out there.
There’s a few days to apply to Dayton. 3/31 deadline. Little effort required. They have engineering. It will costs less and is. People seem to have a good experience. It’s catholic, Marianist vs Jesuit …not sure the significance there.
I would not consider RHIT. In the likelihood she’s not an engineer it won’t have enough.
Purdue and Cincy are both solid but they are big state schools.
But does a big state school at $40k make you feel better than a top choice at double ?
Only you can decide.
But a Dayton - probably a 10 min app - or others still taking apps might be a happy medium.
