<p>One boy at my school said that Harvard doesn't actually verify ECs, so he's going to devote all his time to schoolwork and just lie about his extracurricular activities on his application. I'm really frustrated by that. Does anyone know whether Harvard actually verifies the ECs of each applicant?</p>
<p>No, they don't verify them. It's called the honor's system.</p>
<p>", so he's going to devote all his time to schoolwork and just lie about his extracurricular activities on his application. "</p>
<p>That won't work because his recommendations won't support his lies. In addition, the ECs that most impress Harvard are things like national level achievements or extremely unusual achievements that would be noted in one's recommendations. Those are difficult to lie about because lies of such magnitude are very obvious.</p>
<p>i agree with northstarmom. though he might be able to get away with small political wordings of his activities, total fabrication of large activities that would actually get him considered should be near impossible. also, if he did do such a thing, it would be a complete shutout for him.</p>
<p>They'll also ask him about EC's in the interview, and not only will he need to know a lot (specific things) about the EC's, he'll also need to show or hint at how it has affected his life and character, show that he has a passion for certain EC's and related interests, and demonstrate that he has thought deeply about the meaning of the activity and that he does it for more than the sake of doing it, and certainly more than the sake of college admissions. Can he do all that with a fabricated lie?</p>
<p>Also, for major awards, like Siemens or Intel or math team or major sports awards, they could just look up the respective websites (heck, they could even google your name)</p>
<p>I love when they say it's a "friend" Look, just dont lie. It isnt worth it because sooner or later it will come out. Either they will check, it will show in your interview, and when you arrive on campus it will be quite obvious. I like to believe that there is a being helping our lives and when we try to cheat others in bad faith it will come back and bite you in the ***.</p>
<p>well sometimes they really are referring to a friend and they're ****ed off about it</p>
<p>Moreover, Harvard has long-term enforcement power. Even if you are admitted by mistake, you can still be booted out later, and even if you gain a Harvard degree before the mistake based on your lying is discovered, the degree can still be rescinded. And, yes, Harvard does make it easy for employers and other people to whom you might submit a resume to check who really has a Harvard degree. As you can imagine, that is a fairly common thing to lie about.</p>
<p>~laughs~ I can imagine someone trying to fabricate being, like, a Siemens or Intel finalist. The best is when someone says "Intel finalist" on their early deadline. Oh, those lies must be so fun to catch :)</p>
<p>i heard a case where a harvard grad got his diploma revoked b/c the school figured out that he lied 20 years ago.</p>
<p>That doesn't sound like the kind of person Harvard, or any college for that matter, wants.</p>
<p>If there is such a thing as justice, he won't get in, lying or not.</p>
<p>But there isnt... : (</p>
<p>There is justice. I have caught students lying in interviews, and have told Harvard in my interview reports. They didn't get in.</p>
<p>In addition, a couple of years ago, there was an infamous case of a girl who got into Harvard and then sued to become valedictorian even though she was allegedly too sick to go to school, so was homeschooled (yet managed to do an exhausting list of ECs that after her acceptance, many people suggested were bogus). A professional newspaper found that she had plagiarized an article that she had published and Harvard rescinded her admission.</p>
<p>"A professional newspaper found that she had plagiarized an article that she had published and Harvard rescinded her admission."</p>
<p>Yes, but it should be pointed out that Blair Hornstine's was first ACCEPTED and that her convoluted fabrication of EC passed the smell test and, obviously, fooled the interviewer. Had she and her father not been THAT greedy to sue the school, she would have been a happy student at H. </p>
<p>It is beyond doubt that students get accepted in spite of fabricating an entirely fictitious persona and are thus able to fool prestigious schools such as Princeton. Had P's adcoms read College Confidential and used google, they could have caught at least one perennial liar and cheater. Honor system require honor from the participants. The good news is that there is a day of reckoning and the later it arrives, the more it hurts.</p>
<p>A man's character is his fate.</p>
<p>Don't try it.</p>
<p>In theory, a very smart individual could lie about her/his ECs and cover their butt in all aspects. However, it would take great ability and intelligence to be able to create such a perfect application that would go unnoticed in the eyes of adcoms with decades of experience. Not to mention to fabricate such well-done ECs to merit admission. It has been done before (H student told me), so I guess the answer is yes. Someone could lie. Then question then becomes, how far are you willing to go to obtain what you really want?</p>
<p>It has been done. I know of at least one such case at Harvard, and several such cases at the other Ivies. All are recent.</p>
<p>It would help if admissions committees only consider SIGNIFICANT extra-curriculars, i.e. those accomplishments outstanding enough to come with independent verification. My impression is that such is the case with Harvard, but DEFINITELY not with some of the other top schools. In that sense, the injustice is mitigated, at least in the case of Harvard -- the applicant would have been admitted without the fabrication, which would be ignored.</p>
<p>There is still the residual injustice, however, that the applicant who forged the extra-curriculars escaped punishment.</p>
<p>I'll admit, when I was reading a book about the admissions process, and it said that they don't verify things in your app (except scores and grades) the thought of putting false things on there did cross my mind...</p>
<p>BUT, I decided not to. I'd feel like a fraud, and it would bother me for 4 years knowing that I got in on merits that I had not really done.</p>
<p>"Yes, but it should be pointed out that Blair Hornstine's was first ACCEPTED and that her convoluted fabrication of EC passed the smell test and, obviously, fooled the interviewer. Had she and her father not been THAT greedy to sue the school, she would have been a happy student at H. "</p>
<p>We don't know that. For all we know, her lies still would have caught up with her and she would have been kicked out of Harvard or could have had her Harvard degree rescinded.</p>
<p>I also doubt that she would have been that at Harvard because she would have known she lied her way in and always would have feared getting caught. The world is very small. There is a very good chance that at some point people who lie their way into an opportunity get found out.</p>
<p>In fact, there have been some infamous examples of this. One was the sports coach (football?) who a couple of years ago was offered a job at Notre Dame. The job offer was publicly rescinded when it was learned that he had lied about his credentials. The man had been a well known coach for many years and finally his lies caught up with him.</p>
<p>Another example that comes to my mind is Janet Cooke, who won a Pulitzer at The Washington Post for a story she fabricated about an 8-year-old heroin addict. It also ended up that she had lied her way into her Washington Post job. Those lies, too, ended in public embarrassment.</p>
<p>Meanwhile if all of the people simply let Harvard know about the liars who got admissions, that would end that problem. I don't know why people somehow think that it's a badge of honor to protect liars who steal opportunities for others by lying on their applications.</p>
<p>what ****es me off is that so many ppl at my school actually do BS ec's. GOd knows what they'll put on their apps, but here are some examples:</p>
<ol>
<li><p>This guy founded "Magic Club" and became "President". Basically, he and 6 other guys would play cards and do card tricks once a month.</p></li>
<li><p>This guy founded "Race Unity Through Films" and do nothing but watch movies. </p></li>
<li><p>And when all ideas run out, this girl simply decided to name herself the founder of the club I founded and got an award from a local newspaper using it. And it just so happened that my parents picked up that newspaper at a store. LOL!!!!</p></li>
</ol>
<p>When there's something like EC that greatly determines a person's chance to a selective school and is virtually unverified, how can we trust human nature not to lie????</p>