Does kindness count?

Parent Cafe
1

<p>My youngest child a hs senior. She's completed and submitted her college applications. Today, I was thinking about her prospects for admissions. Realistically, the Ivies would be high reaches--and she didn't apply to that level of college. But she did apply to some flagship state universities, where the bar is set very high. She has the usual expected credentials and exceeds the 75% mark in most areas (ACTs etc.) for these schools. But what makes her unique, maybe, amongst those with similar credentials is her kindness and her character. </p>

<p>A couple of examples: My daughter played on a varsity sports team that had a real "Mean Girls" problem. For example, the players chose the girl they deemed ugliest on the opposing team to pick on, calling her demeaning sexual and racial slurs. And the girls picked on the three youngest members of their own team (8th and 9th graders, playing with jrs and seniors). They called them names and blamed them for any mistakes or loses.</p>

<p>A couple weeks into the season, it was clear my daughter wasn't enjoying her sport. Finally, she said that she couldn't stand her teammates and told me about their actions. I asked if she had talked to the coach, or if she would like me to talk to the coach. She decided she would talk to the coach. I suggested that if the older girls were picking on the younger girls, she might consider telling them that she didn't think they were being treated right. She said "I already did". </p>

<p>She talked to the coach, who called in the younger girls and asked them how they were being treated. They said only one girl of the 12 jrs and seniors was nice to them. It was my daughter. The coach sent me an email telling me this, praising my daughter. </p>

<p>Another time, my daughter came to me with a problem that she said she had promised not to tell anyone about. A neighbor girl, about 14 years old, told her that her mother had stopped taking her meds, and had been beating her. For example, when she caught her reading a novel, a typical teenage romance, she called her daughter a whore and whipped her with a chain, bruising her back and legs. She showed my daughter the bruises. I told her that we could not let this continue and had to report it. My daughter cried, and was worried about her promise--but understood that we had to do something. I called the authorities and they took immediate action. </p>

<p>Forgive me if this is a sort of "brag fest". That is not my intention. And I'm not asking for how my daughter's kindness and character could be conveyed to an admissions committee. What I'm asking for is discussion about the subject of kindness and character. Reading some of the thousands of comments on this site, I see a few threads about bullying, especially lately because it is in the news. But mostly what I see is discussions about credentials: Test Scores, GPAs, Class Ranks etc. What I don't see is any discussion about the character of the applicants. Does it matter? If so, how should it be conveyed to the admissions people?</p>

<p>Your thoughts?</p>

2

<p>My D wrote one of her college essays about being kind to a new boy in 9th grade who was picked on by a lot of the other kids in her class. The guy had some personality traits that didn’t help the situation… but D invited him to a party and hung out with him in spite of some of the unpleasant treatment by some of the other freshman (I would add that it was a small school, only ~75 kids per graduating class). Eventually he was accepted, and he ended up with more friends than she had by senior year.</p>

<p>Obviously it is tricky to get the right tone with this story, but I think she pulled it off. She said she couldn’t take credit for his eventual popularity, but it was an example of a time when she took a stand that was unpoplular with her peers, and she was proud of herself for doing so. I think your D taking on the team mean girls was especially brave (I think you did a lot of the heavy lifting in the second example, but it does say good things about your relationship with your D that she trusted you with this information!).</p>

<p>However, you said she has already turned in her applications… the only thing I can think of now would be for her to ask the coach from that team to write an additional recommendation letter and send it in. Not sure if they will consider it, but hopefully he will tell this story.</p>

3

<p>I think kindness and other personality traits are great for LORs. Does your school have you fill out a brag sheet? You could include that info there, and it might make its way into an LOR.</p>

4

<p>Yes kindness matters. Not for college - but for LIFE, which is much more important.</p>

<p>Some college ask for/allow Parent Recommendations. Sounds odd, but who knows your child better than you? One of them is Union College in Schenectady NY. When S applied there, I wrote a rec and sited his kindness as one of the traits I was most proud of in him.</p>

<p>I think asking the coach for a letter of rec, and sending it to your D’s colleges as “additional info” sounds like a great idea.</p>

5

<p>I so strongly think it should count, for a lot. I truly believe that colleges would want it to count significantly, if only they had adequate ways to know the truth. I don’t have a lot of insights into how you can help them recognize your daughter’s true character, but there are some good suggestions so far and maybe others will come too. </p>

<p>This is what saddens me about the whole process; the factors that can be scored with a number, gamed, coached, padded in a resume, counted with hours, or trophies, end up floating to the top and a lot of the factors that really matters (or should matter as much or more), like actual character, might get lost in the shuffle. </p>

<p>FWIW, I don’t think you are bragging at all, and I so hope your kid has a good shot because of her character.</p>

6

<p>Maybe your D’s recommendation letters do talk about this quality. I am assuming that you haven’t seen them, so maybe her teachers picked up on this trait as well.</p>

7

<p>Your D has character. Congatulations. I truly believe that is much more significant in life than if her college is ranked in the top 50 (or 100, 200 whatever). Maybe she will make a difference in the world. Our country would be on better footing if kindness and respect were valued and modeled by our political leaders. Often in the short run the phrase “no good deed goes unpunished” turns out to be true. Over the long run a life of kindness, empathy and respect for others is a large part of how I define “success”.</p>

<p>Sounds like she will do great wherever she goes.</p>

8

<p>Has your GC submitted a recommendation yet, or will they need to submit a mid-year report? At our school, the GC asks a parent to send their own description of aspects of their child’s upbringing, activities, and personality that are not generally known to people at school. Many parents would take advantage of this opportunity to talk about their child’s basic kindness (giving the types of examples you have mentioned), home responsibilities such as helping with chores or caring for siblings or a disabled relative, or overcoming an illness or disability.</p>

9

<p>I agree that recommendations are a good place to address this (assuming essays are already in). The tricky thing here, to me, is that you mention State Universities. I know many of the State Universities near me (NJ) are heavily driven by numbers. The sheer volume of applications they deal with and the turnaround time they maintain seemed to me to limit the consideration of “softer” aspects. I suspect your D.'s kindness may show to greater effect at small institutions.</p>

10

<p>Personality traits and character do count in admissions particularly at schools that use holistic admissions and are not solely numbers based. </p>

<p>There are lots of ways where this can be part of an application. My advisees brainstorm a list of attributes about themselves that they want colleges to know. This list drives their application process. For example, they share these attributes and examples/anecdotes that demonstrate them in a letter they provide to their rec writers and ask if they may speak to some of the points that they themselves are hoping to bring out on their own application. (in your D’s case,in a letter to her coach, she could have mentioned her attributes and reminded him of the anecdote you shared here with hopes eh would speak about it in his supplemental rec to her colleges)</p>

<p>Then, when choosing essays, we don’t start with “what’s a good TOPIC?” but rather, which ones of my points about myself do I hope to reveal in this essay and what is a good story I could tell that will demonstrate these traits? And when the reader is done my essay, will he/she be able to describe some of my attributes? (so in your D’s case, if her kindness was one attribute she wanted to bring out in an essay, she’d find a story to share that would reveal that attribute) Lastly, this list of attributes that the candidate hopes a college will learn about him/her, is also in mind when doing any interviews. Actually, one more way is in the annotations for the activity resume to try to demonstrate traits and not just facts.</p>

<p>Hope that helps.</p>

<p>(I cross posted with others who have shared similarly)</p>

11

<p>You cannot measure and reward kindness and character the way you can time a race or track stats in a sport like bball, vball, etc. But you can hope that the LOR writers recognise and report on that intangible, yet oh so very important characteristic</p>

12

<p>I think the buzzwords in college essays this year should be/will be kindness, character, and anti-bully. Not long ago, it was all about diversity. Other years, it was Katrina-related fundraisers, or building homes for Habitat communities.</p>

<p>With that in mind, I think colleges would be happy to see someone who is genuinely kind and considerate. Hopefully her recommenders will speak to this trait. She should make a point to explain her experiences in any college interview or essay.</p>

13

<p>Kindness doesn’t count. It should, but it’s too hard to measure. If you want to highlight your duaghter’s character, she should do an essay about a situation where it woudl have been easy to be mean/be a bully and how she found the strength to refrain. Simply being bullied is not a sign of kindness, but sticking up for someone who is being victimized is and also demonstrates other postiive traits such as strength and compassion.</p>

14

<p>Does kindness count? I don’t know-- but if you voluntarily give up your seat on an overbooked flight, you’ll find that kindness PAYS ;)</p>

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<p>In my book kindness counts in a lot of things far more important than college admissions. Good luck to your D.</p>

16

<p>Your daughter’s kindness and character will count far more than any college, it will count toward the rest of her life. Congratulations on raising a much needed member of our society!</p>

17

<p>

Unfortunately, the flagship U’s won’t care a wit. Smaller private schools will.</p>

18

<p>* I don’t see is any discussion about the character of the applicants. Does it matter? If so, how should it be conveyed to the admissions people?*</p>

<p>In our house, kindness is a given- it doesn’t need to be noted or commented on, however- my whole household, is less than socially skilled & some of that is because it takes a lot of practice & awareness to behave in a way that anticipates the response of others- we are not exactly neurotypical.</p>

<p>Altruism can be shown however in college admissions in essay topics, references &/or extracurriculars, and summer activities.
The benefits go far beyond college admissions.</p>

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<p>Kindness is far more important in life than anything else. People who are kind may not be able to say or use kindness on a college application but in the real world they are the true success stories. Kindness leads to wonderful relationships and bonds…the secret to a long happy life.</p>

20

<p>Your d sounds like a wonderful girl. I wouldn’t count on the coach writing her a letter of recommendation about the “mean girls” incident, though, because wouldn’t that then make him/her look bad for tolerating or at least being unaware of such behavior?</p>