<p>I've been surprised by some highly selective admits from my public HS, some kids who appear to lack any moral compass, who have had fairly public incidents that earned them community service sentences and disciplinary histories in school. Oftentimes there are high-powered parents and the kids have athletic talent. The incidents and aftermath made headlines. But lots of legal strings were pulled by parents. And coaches pulled strings too, I am sure. Subsequently some of these kids did not make it through their first semester at their highly selective college. What I wonder is, don't colleges screen for/care about character? It wouldn't take much asking around to find out. Local alumini interviewers might have some idea, though I hear some colleges avoid using interviewers from the same community.</p>
<p>I wouldn't want my kid on the same campus as some of these kids, much less rooming with them. Which colleges do a good job, and how do they do it?</p>
<p>Frankly, I don’t think colleges and universities can make those kinds of distinctions …and there are legal implications regarding what high school counselors can and cannot reveal. It’s really no different than when one applies for a job. Impressions are made from the application, from the interview, from the recommendations and after that it’s just what it is…sink or swim for the individual in that particular environment. If you have concerns then there is probably a spectrum of colleges, where you might find a less diverse crowd of kids more closely aligned with your particular value/moral structure. This is just one of the components of the “fit” spectrum that is often discussed. Or you just need to trust that you’ve ingrained your particular value/moral code onto your offspring and they they will make good decisions regarding their friends and their lifestyle both inside a college environment and as they move through life.</p>
<p>“I wouldn’t want my kid on the same campus as some of these kids, much less rooming with them.”</p>
<p>If you insist that your kid only go to college with people exactly like you and themselves, maybe living at home and doing college online is the best choice.</p>
<p>You’ve raised your kid the way you want, and now s/he should be able to make appropriate choices, both in terms of their own behavior and in choosing friends. You can’t avoid spending time with people who have made bad choices in the past. Hopefully the vast majority of “these kids” have learned their lessons, and will make better choices in the future. College is a learning experience much broader than just what happens in the classrom. Your kid somehow survived high school with “these kids”, and likely will survive college too, and will have some interesting stories to tell when they come home!</p>
<p>The character screening typically is what the GC reports under the section asking whether the student has had suspensions or expulsions. Some high schools don’t report such info, though.</p>
<p>Colleges also ask applicants if they’ve had such problems and if they’ve had felony convictions. Some applicants lie.</p>
<p>Many colleges, though, particularly publics make their decisions based solely on applicants’ stats, and in the case of publics, applicants’ states of residence.</p>
<p>In general, if a student has the appropriate stats, they will be accepted to most colleges in the country. The exceptions are very top colleges and a relatively few private schools (some of which are church-based) that use character as part of their admissions process.</p>
<p>So there’s no way for a college to know if an applicant with good grades and excellent extracurricular activities is a bully or a jerk if he is never caught / reported?</p>
<p>Gardna, the bullies and jerks might not be bullies and jerks in an entirely different setting with entirely different people…and kids that were “good as gold” or “sweet as pie” in HS might “try on” a different personalities when they move into a different society of people. It’s difficult to “predict” how people will behave in group settings. Another good reason not to try and label people for life. But I tend to be a person who gives people the benefit of the doubt…</p>
<p>“so there’s no way for a college to know if an applicant with good grades and excellent extracurricular activities is a bully or a jerk if he is never caught / reported?”</p>
<p>Unless the applicant comes across that way on an interview (and this is why some elite colleges use interviews to assess people), of course’s there’s no way to know. </p>
<p>And I agree with momofthreeboys: People can change a great deal for the better or for the worse.</p>
<p>Sorry, I phrased that wrong. Let’s try again; is there a way for any college to really know for certain what kind of person the student will be while s/he is matriculating the college? I was trying to rephrase the OP’s question and I couldn’t think of a good way to phrase it. My initial belief based on what you guys said just now is that “no”, there’s no perfect system, but I’m not sure. It seems like a lot of the time, people on this website assume that the system is perfect until their kid doesn’t get in (at which point it becomes an evil conspiracy) and I was trying to get a straight answer.</p>
<p>Nope, if you take the broad view, the day the kids all step foot on campus they are all on “equal” ground with the same chances of success or failure academically and personally. Why do businesses select certain applicants? Why do coaches pick certain players in a draft? Colleges are simply assembling the best “team” given their institutional needs and objectives. There are “hits” and “misses” just like outside academica. Every “chosen” person brings their own personal and academic baggage - the good and the bad.</p>
<p>Screening for character? Here’s one of my favourite anecdotes from years as an alumna interviewer for Harvard. told me by the local committee when I was being recruited having just moved to this mid-sized American city. A few years back they’d had a candidate who while impressive academically set off all sorts of alarm bells. The student ended up being interviewed twice and apparently each interviewer expressed great reservations about his character - he was arrogant, unpleasant etc etc and one of the standard Harvard questions an interviewer should ask him/herself is ‘would anyone want to room with this person?" The student was admitted but before the acceptance went out, the Harvard desk officer for that region made a point of calling the Committee and saying that the interviewers’ personal impressions had tallied with the school/counsellor reports, ie. incredible student but very unpleasant character. The Admissions Officer explained that the powers that be in Cambridge had decided that this was a student who might well cure cancer one day and they wanted him to do it in their labs. “So unless you tell us he’s a mass murderer, we’re admitting him.”</p>
<p>What an interesting query. I agree with most of the above posts about colleges not really being able to judge character very accurately. My DD decided during her first year at a new high school that she would like a book on serial killers, which I told her I would not buy. She asked her best friend to get it for her for Christmas, which she did. She was so pleased to report to one of her teachers (and also her advisor) what she had received for Christmas. Her father and I got invited to a meeting with the advisor and the school counselor very soon after that where they blindsided me (hubby was off doing something else and the school said that it was just a meeting to discuss her progress at the new school) telling me everything they thought was wrong with DD. </p>
<p>Why do I share this? DD could have received a very unflattering report based on one teacher’s impression. She had the guy’s (advisor) number and was trying to shock him–which of couse she did. </p>
<p>The kids who are really stinkers are good at hiding that around adults–think Eddie Haskell.</p>
<p>I am impressed with ROTC students and service academy students. I know they let a few bad apples in but by and large they are of the highest caliber. If your don’t believe it watch an Army/Navy football game sometime.</p>
<p>Another viewpoint: Do we really want students with character flaws to be excluded from college?</p>
<p>If they are unable to get a college education and therefore have more difficulty finding good jobs, wouldn’t that make it more likely that they would engage in antisocial or illegal behavior (e.g., turning to crime to support themselves)?</p>
<p>Not really- otherwise severely depressed & aggressive students would not be admitted- think Virgina Tech, Seung-Hui Cho had had a long past of therapy, a large depressive disorder long before admission, and while in school, continued to write violent pieces. Obviously not everyone with depression is a threat to themselves or others; but it seems the ones who are still slip through the cracks: even with the typical warning signs. He even wrote about wanting to repeat Columbine long before College.</p>
<p>It’s probably impossible to really get an idea of the incoming students personalities. Someone who is just rude/stand-offish is much preferrable to the alternatives, but there’s no way to ensure your child will not be on a campus with a date-rapist, someone who is violently angry, or a petty thief.</p>
<p>Sounds like there are two separate things being discussed here. The OP is judging “character” and doesn’t want her kids on campus with a kid who might have made a mistake in high school and had to do community service or suffered other consequences. Then there is the issue of “jerks”. I hope you are able to screen the workplaces where your kid might be offered a job! I assure you there are plenty of jerks in corporate America!</p>
<p>As many on here know, I have a kid with a checkered past who was admitted to some highly selective schools and recruited as an athlete by many others. Barring some disaster, he is about to graduate at least cum laude from one of these schools. He isn’t regarded as a jerk (well, at least not outside the family ) but he is probably one of those kids you wouldn’t have wanted your kid around, OP. Every one of the schools knew his situation, as did his high school counselors. Did it ever occur to you that colleges sometimes like to see a kid who has made a mistake, learned and moved on? </p>
<p>Good luck with the jerk-free and “bad-kid”-free campus!</p>
<p>I think that people can occasionally develop an overly rosy view of admissions committees at first, especially ones at really prestigious universities. My point was that they are just people; they can do the best job in the world but a sociopathic date rapist can hoodwink them if no one brings this to their attention. Nobody solicits a letter of recommendation from someone who knows about a dark past that they intend to continue with, and college interviews aren’t like police interrogations. Parents who think that they can make sure that their child never works or goes to school in the same place as a bad person have no earthly way of doing this short of doing home-school from childhood to high school age, then doing online college, then trying to find their kid a job to work from home.</p>
) but he is probably one of those kids you wouldn’t have wanted your kid around, OP. Every one of the schools knew his situation, as did his high school counselors. Did it ever occur to you that colleges sometimes like to see a kid who has made a mistake, learned and moved on? </p>