<p>Hi! So I'm half black/white. Well, my white half is Russian and I used to live there and I speak Russian and everything. My Asian friend tells me I have a really good chance at getting into good schools like Cornell, maybe even Harvard because I get good grades (top 5%) and SAT scores and can identify as a minority. Say, for example, me and her have basically the same application except I identify as black and she, as Asian. Would our races make a difference? We are both juniors in Massachusetts by the way.</p>
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Yes…</p>
<p>It would in fact make a big difference.</p>
<p>It is my understanding that as an African American, you often just need to be a reasonably qualified candidate, while the Asian would have to be a super qualified candidate.</p>
<p>I am not in favor of this, because the Asian from a poor neighborhood might have had a harder life than the African American who grew up upper middle class, but such is our current system. </p>
<p>Given your stats, you will be a sought after candidate by almost any school.</p>
<p>If you counted as white or asian, you would just be one of thousands of candidates with similar stats----someone who is in the running for a spot, but not particularly sought after.</p>
<p>There is some downside to this, because people may presume you got in under lower standards, even if you in fact would have gotten in on your own merits. For example, my son just earned admission to a school in the UK called St Andrews. It is very hard for a UK citizen to get in, and especially a native of Scotland, because they go for free, but somewhat easier for an American to get in, because they know that Americans pay higher tuition. So people may assume if he goes there that he got in under lower standards, but in fact, he got a 2300 SAT. </p>
<p>But in life, if someone gives you a break, I would say take it.</p>
<p>Delete…</p>
<p>I will proceed to respond to OP’s post as if it was made in good faith. If it was not, then I apologize to the members of this forum for cluttering the feed with more posts.</p>
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<p>There are socioeconomic considerations made in the application process as well, so an individual from a poor neighborhood (let’s remember, admissions offices do have something of a profile of the neighborhood and school quality) does receive additional consideration. It’s in cases like these where I imagine the interview, personal essay, and school profile would come into play.</p>
<p>To answer your question, OP, it is an unfortunate truth that given the mess of categories that we, as a society, have constructed for easier assignments of identity results in your hypothetical situation (where one individual almost automatically receives a bit more consideration in the application process). However, I would urge you to step back and take a more nuanced view of this issue in its abstract form. Group psychology, as applied to African-Americans and other members of the African Diaspora, explains why admissions offices are loath not to give an applicant of African descent additional consideration.</p>
<p>@floridadad55
I don’t like what you’re implying. We earn our spots just like everyone else. I know it helps people from other races who feel superior to us to justify how they could get denied from an institution that accepted a black student instead of them by saying we’re getting special treatment. Race really doesn’t make that big a difference in admissions decisions.</p>
<p>@wannabe252
Though some applicants may very well earn their spots, it is a clear fact that the vast majority of underrepesented minority applicants have lower admissions requirements than their Caucasian and Asian counterparts. </p>
<p>At the University of Wisconsin:
"The odds ratio favoring African Americans and Hispanics over whites was 576-to-1 and 504-to-1, respectively, using the SAT and class rank while controlling for other factors. Thus, the median composite SAT score for black admittees was 150 points lower than for whites and Asians, and the Latino median SAT score was 100 points lower. Using the ACT, the odds ratios climbed to 1330-to-1 and 1494-to-1, respectively, for African Americans and Hispanics over whites.</p>
<p>For law school admissions, the racial discrimination found was also severe, with the weight given to ethnicity much greater than given to, for example, Wisconsin residency. Thus, an out-of-state black applicant with grades and LSAT scores at the median for that group would have had a 7 out 10 chance of admission and an out-of-state Hispanic a 1 out of 3 chance-but an in-state Asian with those grades and scores had a 1 out of 6 chance and an in-state white only a 1 out of 10 chance."</p>
<p>These trends, though not as severe, can be found at most major American institutes of higher learning.</p>
<p>I am an African student in the U.S with a green card, residing in VA. I worked my behind off in high school and have taken as many AP classes as possible (10)( all AP courses this year). Involved myself in many 6 extracurricular activities (key club, French club, student ambassador, newspaper, Leading ladies and model UN) , 3 honor societies (National Honor Society, National French Honor Society, Chemistry Honor Society), had my own foundation and mentoring minority students in an out reach program for girls . </p>
<p>All the while helped take care of my 4 younger brothers, dealt with my biological mothers death and emotional issues. I still found myself #61 out of 485+ students of my graduating class, thus being in the top 12% of my class with a 3.8 GPA ( working hard to be in the top 10). </p>
<p>However, my SAT scores were low at a 1640, but I still applied to UVA yesterday. If I get in it will not be due to my race but due to the fact that they see that I can add something of value to their school community. No matter where I end up, I know I worked my ass of to get there. I EARNED IT. </p>
<p>Btw I am of upper middle class standings but my parents won’t be paying for my schooling, I have to do it all by myself.</p>
<p>lurkbot, can you post a link to the original study? I can only find one to the "Center for Equal Opportunity, a libertarian think tank, "</p>
<p>I am thinking University of Wisconsin may not be typical in that they must be fairly desperate to develop a welcoming environment for those looking for racial diversity.</p>
<p>So for most schools, and most schools have a very high admit rate, this; "These trends, though not as severe, can be found at most major American institutes of higher learning. ", would not make race matter “a lot”. I believe the Espanade paper said that for most schools, race has no bearing. The Espanade paper also said that the benefit was most prominent for blacks scoring in the 1200 to 1300 range (its a very old paper), and that both above and below those numbers, blacks were actually DISADVANTAGED compared to whites. </p>
<p>And at least currently, that 1200-1300 range is a VERY small segment of the black population.</p>
<p>Ooops. Espanade=Thomas J. Espenshade</p>
<p>@ksarmand
Sorry but your last point is confusing.</p>
<p>If we eliminate the excuses/justifications and just answer the OP’s question:
Yes…</p>
<p>To purpledoodlez:</p>
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<p>There are a myriad of factors that apply to reasons why certain individuals are given additional consideration during the admissions process. I cited group psychology as one of those factors. </p>
<p>I hope this cleared things up for you! Happy New Year. :)</p>
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I think you can replace individuals with groups or races and still make your point.</p>
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<p>You mean you are a black Russian and she an Asian Russian attending the same school, with identical SAT, GPA, difficulty of coursework and ECs, attending the same community russian orthodox church with your white brethren from russia, with parents that moved to the USA at the same time, with the same education, working in the same company, making the same money? Wow that is amazing.</p>
<p>@perazziman
What…? I hope you’re being sarcastic. But no, she’s not Russian at all.</p>
<p>^ Then, you do not “have basically the same application.” Growing up you were the product of your parent’s experiences and the communities/ neighborhoods/ schools you grew up in. Admissions will try to determine how you did in light of those experiences.</p>
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<p>Yes, yes, yes, yes, and oh my goodness yes. Cosign to the nth degree. </p>
<p>That’s what much of this boils down to.</p>
<p>Well you kinda are more russian because you actually have been there and speak the language.maybe you should ask the admis office to see what you should say your race is.I say black american or other because my dad is from the states but my mom is afro south american and its non spanish speaking…I haven’t been there or speak the languages but I grew up with my mom not really with my dad…
maybe saying your black helps because they’ll see you’re not another sterotype and they’ll probably want you since not most of university students are black-well depending on the university and state\area but cali’s UC stats had them at like 5% </p>
<p>Sent from my SPH-M910 using CC App</p>