<p>@ TheGFG – </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Is this what you think is going on with your daughter and her coach?</p>
<p>I rarely see students from Yale, Harvard or Princeton wearing a shirt from their college. I believe it is considered gauche.</p>
<p>Somehow, the taunt “You’re only going to Cornell, not to Harvard” doesn’t have QUITE the sting to it as, say, being picked on because you were the fat kid, or were nerdy, or had a big nose, or had a funny name, or whatever.</p>
<p>It’s like having class and decorum and play old common sense is missing in this generation of kids and parents.</p>
<p>When my kids where in 8th grade the application process for hs was not a great one. Many kids wanted to go to just a few schools and because of siblings, alumni, sports, etc the opportunities weren’t there for many deserving kids.</p>
<p>Anyway weekend after notification went out at a school volunteer program that parents rank one dad came in was all hey everyone, you get your kids hs decisions. Ben got in everywhere and now it’s time to pick!! Woot! He was oblivious to the fact many of the parents spent the weekend dealing with crying desolate upset kids and the parents were sad for their kids, figuring out plan b etc.</p>
<p>I pulled obnoxious dad to the side and told him to chill, that not everyone got good news, and while in a week or so, everyone will be in a better place emotionally that he was looking the horses behind.</p>
<p>If I could have thrown a bucket of cold water on him I would have.</p>
<p>No, Pea, in this case I don’t think that is what is going on. (But when the gym teacher referenced above was my older D’s coach, she did have some past wrongs she was trying to right by proxy.) Younger D’s coach appears to be a genuinely sweet person. He is simply misguided, in the same way as others in his profession are misguided, with regard to how to promote self-esteem in children. For this reason, I don’t think I’d accomplish anything by talking to him about the situation. He is representative of how many people think today and probably believes he is building self-esteem in the other girls. He is likely assuming that my D’s self-esteem is just fine because she has won some races. </p>
<p>Which brings me to another point. A mistake that school staff make is they don’'t consider that studies that have shown that high-achieving children actually tend to have lower than average self-esteem. Indeed, the desire to feel better about themselves and earn approval is sometimes what drives their push to succeed. These kids can feel they are only lovable if they are the best, the smartest, the fastest. So again, playing God and tryng to orchestrate self-esteem promotion is tricky.</p>
<p>GFG- I think you should talk to the coach even if it doesn’t do any good. I probably intervened in my kids relationships with teachers and coaches 5 times total during their entire school careers- but I’ve recently had two of them tell me how grateful they were for my comments. No, it didn’t change the situation with my own kid (and I wasn’t accusatory, I took a “Perhaps you don’t realize how this made my kid feel” approach.) But apparently long after I made my little speech, another parent showed up with the same comment-- and apparently, both teachers realized this was a pattern (however subconsciously they were doing it.)</p>
<p>I’ll bet this teacher has not thought through how the situation made your D feel. And if neither your D your you take him aside and tell him, he is never going to know. And then next year he’ll have a runner like your D and make the same mistake.</p>
<p>I kinda wish I were growing up now in the “finger on the scale” era of athletics. I was always uncoordinated, I was always a terrible athlete, nobody ever wanted me on their team. As I watched my own somewhat uncoordinated kids play, I was a little envious that in the current era, at least the not-so-terrific athletes get playing time. None of my kids ever thought they were better than they actually were, none of them confused their own enthusiasm for actual talent or ability. But they got to be outside and run around and wear the Tshirt and be part of the team and have the coach make a dopey speech about them on awards night.</p>
<p>So although the situation you describe is obnoxious, and I’m sad for your D, there is a flip side to the new attitude as well. Kids like me now get some running around time and don’t feel like total clods since the focus is on “everyone is a winner”.</p>
<p>Anti-bullying forces have their work cutout for them with girls. An eye roll?? Hmmmm Good luck with perfecting the human race.</p>
<p>[Bullying</a> in girls can be subtle, but still requires response | Daily Progress](<a href=“http://www2.dailyprogress.com/news/2012/apr/25/bullying-girls-can-be-subtle-still-requires-respon-ar-1869489/]Bullying”>http://www2.dailyprogress.com/news/2012/apr/25/bullying-girls-can-be-subtle-still-requires-respon-ar-1869489/)</p>
<p>Well, in our district the “everyone plays” policy is only for track. The other sports typically have 5 days of tryouts and two rounds of cuts, and thus the teams are composed of the best athletes of the group. Any kid who gets cut from other sports is accepted by the track team, in addition to the kids who came out for it from the start. So this system kind of sets track up to be a repository for kids the coaches may see as needing a self-esteem boost because they’re coming in already once-rejected. But the girls in question in our case are not in that category.</p>
<p>GFG–</p>
<p>Is there any way you can assist your daughter in self-advocating this situation? I know you mentioned she is special needs, but is this intellect or just output issues like dislexia? I have a dyslexic who learned to advocate for herself, with our assistance, and it has carried her through life, really well. She would tell your daughter that learning to tell people what she needed, why she needed it, and negotiating situations is the best thing that ever happened to her. </p>
<p>She has always had to work twice as hard at academics, but at certain things she was way more gifted… kind of like how the blind people hear better. And learning to tell people what the deficit GAVE her, what she could do MORE of than anyone else, etc… started in the places where she was talented.</p>
<p>So, just a thought. If you could coach her on that? </p>
<p>Again, good luck.</p>
<p>GFG- Its been a while and I’m so sad to hear that this has happened to D. For what its worth I don’t agree with the coach. But I’m not telling you anything you don’t know. What I find surprising is that the girls run in so few events. When my D ran jh track last year, “everyone” ran three events. Some kids ran four. The great thing about track is that they can accommodate so many heats, that everyone can run. D is running varsity now and the same still holds true. So I don’t get it. There’s really no excuse to exclude your D, there should be more than enough events. For example, why can’t D run two events and the ‘mean’ girls run two others? Or why can’t they run different heats? They are so young. This just doesn’t seem necessary. </p>
<p>As for the college shirt topic. I’m not sure how wearing the shirt after May 1st will make anyone feel better. Honestly, whats the difference? Also this rule presumes that the kids who get into the college of their choice are the same kids who have been recieving accolades all through high school. From my own personal experience with my S I can tell you just the opposite happened. S was a very hardworking student, well liked but flew under the radar. There were always several kids who would far outshine him academically. But senior year roles around and S was the only kid who was accepted into all 13 schools that he applied too. So for us, I reminded him that good things come to those who wait. For all those times that he was overlooked, he now was reaping his reward. Sorry, but everyone gets their time in the spot light and when its not your time to shine then learn to be gracious. As a whole, the year S graduated, S along with the appointed valedictorian and salutatorian were virtually unknowns. In our school, because its so large the GPA’s for the top 5 kids are literally 1/1000 of a point a part, so there is a committee that appoints the number one and number two spot. They look at the student holistically. And last year, kids who all flew under the radar were acknowledged. I think its fair and its teaches others to be humble. Everyone needs a little humility from time to time. </p>
<p>Also what about the kids who are accepted EA? They can’t celebrate their success because the majority of the student population hasn’t been notified yet? Nope. Time to grow up. </p>
<p>I will agree with one poster. I, too, know of a high school that had kids write and submit all their scholarships, and acceptances. I thought that was overkill. In addition, many of the scholarships that were listed were really finaid, not merit based. But families are ignorant on the differences. It caused a lot of friction amongst the students, which was totally unnecessary.</p>
<p>GFG- You have to speak to the coach. If he is a decent person he will want to rectify this. Your D shouldn’t have to deal with this. In addition, the behavior of the mean girls is unacceptable. That makes my blood boil!!!</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>You’re assuming we had cars to wash…a big assumption if one is from a family which either can’t afford one…or doesn’t need one because their region has good public transportation…like NYC…my hometown. </p>
<p>
</p>
<p>I can assure you it wasn’t trash-talking…far too vicious to be that. </p>
<p>As for your asking them to “ignore it”…sounds like the typical well-meaning…but useless in practice advice given by sheltered parents…especially mothers who don’t understand how bullying dynamics actually work with certain types of bullies. </p>
<p>IME, ignoring taunts/bullying tends to cause the bullies to escalate them…sometimes to the point of greater viciousness. The only effective ways in practice according to my childhood friends’ and my experiences was </p>
<ol>
<li><p>Hope/report the incident to a teacher/admin and hope he/she’s responsive. Since most weren’t in our experiences…we then have to resort to </p></li>
<li><p>Confront, taunt, and fight back to give the taunter/bully a bruised ego and/or bloody nose as necessary. </p></li>
</ol>
<p>I should have also added that the culture of the school I attended…along with some other local magnets/prep schools is such that it tends to reinforce and support the taunters within the top 25% of my graduating class. I should also mention that sometimes even a few teachers and parents of students joined in this form of bullying. </p>
<p>Keep in mind this was the '80s and early '90s…before the notion of “everyone’s a winner” and the seriousness of bullying was even conceivable to most school personnel and parents. </p>
<p>Heck, I still recalled several parents throughout my childhood who felt being subjecting to bullying taunts and even violent beatings by other classmates “built character”…especially in elementary/junior high. :(</p>
<p>What’s more sad was that as a result…what went on at my HS was laughable in comparison. However, it did have long-lasting serious and detrimental effects on many classmates.</p>
<p>GFG - your daughter has been robbed. Keep after the issue (but don’t let anger eat you away.) Maybe there are other running clubs you can seek out where her talent will be celebrated. Or she could mentor younger kids in the sport. Where one door closes…</p>
<p>She is very lucky to have you & what a portrait of beauty & strength she is!</p>
<p>
</p>
<p>Ohh this brings back a memory. I had an english professor who studied at yale, and he always used to say, “I went to college in New Haven,” instead of admitting he went to Yale, and everyone would stifle a little laugh because it seemed ridiculous to us. Now I don’t know what I think… I highly respect the fact that he didn’t want us to feel like he was bragging, but I also know none of us would have taken it that way if he’d just began his story with, “well, when I was at yale,” either.</p>
<p>Emah: I’ve noticed the same conversation over the years:</p>
<p>Q: Where did you go to college?</p>
<p>A: Up near Boston.</p>
<p>Q: Oh, where?</p>
<p>A: In Cambridge.</p>
<p>Q: Where?</p>
<p>A: … ah… Haarvaard</p>
<p>They don’t want to be gauche by going around telling people they went to Harvard, but they want people to ask.</p>
<p>I wish there were “Like” buttons! ^^^ Can’t say that for Notre Dame alum-- they will usually tell you within 10 minutes of meeting them ;)</p>
<p>^ It takes that long?:)</p>
<p>The conversation charlieschm recounts has the effect of making the “Harvard” answer even more salient because of the delay in letting it out. I wonder if the rule making kids hold off their public displays will make the results an even bigger deal. Without the rule, kids will wear their apparel in dribs and drabs when they feel the urge, once they find out their acceptances and obtain the appropriate shirts. Not everyone will be paying attention to this every day for two whole months, much less starting in Jan. with EA/ED. But if on May 1st half the school shows up wearing college logos, it will be much more noticeable, IMO.</p>
<p>Having worked in a high school, I know that the unofficial tradition was to wear the shirt of the school you will attend on 5/1. It was just sort of an easy way of everyone announcing their decision. Before that kids might wear all kinds of shirts - my kids got t-shirts at every college they visited that they liked. Plus kids had sweatshirts from colleges whose sports teams they liked, or where their older sibling attended… (my D had more clothes from her older brother’s college than he did!)</p>
<p>Also working in a high school I’d like to remind people that these are teenagers, not adults. They have plenty of tough life lessons ahead of them, and the not-getting-into-the-school-I’ve-dreamed-of-for-5-years may be the first of these tough lessons. Most of them will endure and even look back and laugh - but at the time it is quite painful. I also know people who work at competitive suburban high schools that have seen strings of suicides. In those cases, anything they can do to lower the stress level is more than a good idea - it’s a lifesaver.</p>
<p>OTOH - schools with uniforms don’t have to deal with these issues :p</p>
<p>I heard about a prof that worked at both USC and ucla. He had parking stickers for both schools. He felt the need to switch out the parking stickers when he went from one campus to the other.</p>
<p>
Oh yeah? and what makes you say that? Nothing in the little snippet of conversation you supplied says that. But actually what I really, really would like is for a conversation not to end up, “Harvard? You must be sooo smart.” What am I supposed to say to that. “Yeah, smarter than you.”? So we prevaricate… This board is almost the only place people know where I went to college. There’s a guy in our neighborhood I’ve known for ten years, I only learned last month he went to Yale. </p>
<p>But to address the OP. I agree you should address it with the coach. I agree that the “You may not realize this, but my daughter felt ___ when you ___.” is generally a pretty effective approach, at least in the long run. </p>
<p>The sweatshirt thing seems silly to me, but I think it would be sort of fun and festive to have a big coming out party on May 1.</p>