<p>Take a look at that. It correlates pretty highly to good schools. The lower the dropout rate, the better the school.</p>
<p>The only weird thing I noticed so far is Tulane's high drop-out rate but good education.</p>
<p>In my case, it was. My school is not really ranked at all, and after first semester freshman year, almost half my floor was gone (about 20 students). Some students simply flunked out or didn't like college; some were just unhappy and went home. Some came with a huge chip on their shoulder and never planned on staying longer than a semester before going elsewhere. </p>
<p>And one guy I knew took 5.5 years to get a history degree. So, I wouldn't say it's always the case, but when I went to York College of PA years and years ago, it was. But the cream, it always rises to the top. Yeah, it was weird to be acquainted with someone only to find out they simply left school in the middle of a semester never to be heard of again (and this happened a few times a year, it seemed), but I was able to get in and out in four years.</p>
<p>Obviously, the better/more prestigious the college the more people want to finish their degree. But it doesnt always apply- UChicago for example, which has a rather high dropout rate due to its tough curriculum.</p>
<p>There is a strong relationship between drop-out rate and the average SAT scores at a school. The real question is: How high is the graduation rate relative to the caliber of students? The US News Best Colleges issue lists an 'overperformance/underperformance" statistic that addresses this question.</p>
<p>Tech schools tend to have slightly lower graduation rates partly because of tough curriculum and partly because they lack warmth and friendliness and fun somewhat.</p>
<p>It's something of a misnomer to call this a "drop out" rate. Some of these non-returning students are not college drop-outs. They've elected to transfer elsewhere. It may still be a useful metric, but I think one should be careful about terminology.</p>
<p>If you click on the link, you will find that Chicago now has a 96% retention rate. In the past, it was 80%. To be fair, though, when I was an undergrad, about half of the attrition was due to financial problems, not academic problems. I wouldn't be influenced much by retention rates, especially if you feel that you rank fairly strongly within the group attending the school of your choice.</p>
<p>hoedown-
From the point of view of the college, a transfer is a drop-out. The more drop-outs, the worse it is for the college. Colleges are not consoled when students transfer to another school.</p>
<p>OneMom-
U Chicago graduation rate is 91%, the retention after freshman year to sophomore year is 96%. The reasons for dropping out are the same everywhere, just different proportions.</p>
<p>Collegehelp, thanks. At 91%, it's still far better than it was.</p>
<p>
[quote]
From the point of view of the college, a transfer is a drop-out.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I don't agree. First of all, we don't use that term as a blanket for disenrollment behavior. "Drop out" has a specific meaning. In fact, we even have a variation on the term (stop-outs) to denote people who have stopped attending but who return.</p>
<p>It's true that many colleges do not track transfers, so that in some ways there is little difference between dropouts and transfers when it comes to their final retention and graduation numbers. But in my experience as a researcher and administrator, colleges tend to be very interested in those differences, and some who have used tools like the National Student Clearinghouse have begun to track and report on transfers vs. dropouts. I believe the desire to track transfer is one of the arguments for the much-debated unit record data system.</p>
<p>As for being not being "consoled" by transfer, I disagree there, too. I have heard the chancellor of one of our branch campuses speak with considerable pride of the students who have transferred to some prestigous places. While he may rue the fact that numerically they are not counted as "success stories," it's not as if he (and other colleges) are neutral on outcomes for disenrolled students. Retention may be the top outcome, but failing that I believe educators are very much "consoled" when a student transfers instead of leaves higher ed altogether.</p>
<p>I'm suprised that NIU has a 79% retention rate.</p>
<p>That ranking is just for National Universities. When you include LAC's, it still seems to correlate well with the caliber of the school:</p>
<p>Average Freshman Retention Rate (USNWR four year data 2001-2004):</p>
<p>99% LAC - Pomona.
99% Univ - None.</p>
<p>98% LAC - Bowdoin.
98% Univ - Princeton, Yale, Stanford, MIT, Penn, Columbia, Notre Dame.</p>
<p>97% LAC - Williams, Amherst, Carleton.
97% Univ - Harvard, Duke, Dartmouth, WUStL, Northwestern, Brown, Berkeley, Georgetown, UVa, UCLA.</p>
<p>96% LAC - Swarthmore, Middlebury, Haverford, Davidson,Wesleyan, Harvey Mudd, Holy Cross.
96% Univ - Cal Tech, UChicago, Cornell, Rice, UMich, Tufts, UNC.</p>
<p>95% LAC - Wellesley, Vassar, Claremont McKenna, Washington and Lee, Bucknell.
95% Univ - Hopkins, Vandy, USC, Wm and Mary, BC</p>
<p><95% - Everyone else</p>
<p>hoedown-
The only schools who should be pleased by students who transfer to other schools are the community colleges who send students to 4-year colleges. A transfer is a drop-out from the college. They don't pay tuition or room and board any more. There is no positive way to spin this from the college's point of view. A high transfer-out rate reflects badly on the college.</p>
<p>it should be no surprise that the better the school, the better the retention rate. figure that most kids at top schools are smart enough not to fail out. most kids who go through the process of getting into a top school, have gone through enough to realize they really want to go there (you don't just get into Yale and Podunk U....so you said "welp i guess i'm going to yale").</p>
<p>I would figure people who transfer at very top schools are people who either couldn't handle school, or were extremely low income and got better FA at a different school.</p>
<p>Caltech also has a higher drop out rate due to it being the most difficult school in the country.</p>
<p>Most schools don't report their transfer out rate, but here are some of the top colleges that do report the percent of freshman that transfer out.</p>
<p>Roughly speaking, I think the better the school, the smaller the percent that transfer out....but other factors must play a role too.</p>
<p>school, percent</p>
<p>Bennington College 30
Willamette University 25
St Lawrence University 21
University of Connecticut 20
Tulane University of Louisiana 19
DePauw University 18
Michigan State University 18
Gustavus Adolphus College 18
Texas A & M University 17
Iowa State University 16
Wells College 16
Oberlin College 16
St Mary's College of Maryland 15
Virginia Military Institute 15
Rutgers University-New Brunswick/Piscataway 14
University of Georgia 13
Macalester College 12
Occidental College 10
Stevens Institute of Technology 10
Yeshiva University 10
The College of Wooster 10
University of Southern California 9
Connecticut College 9
Wabash College 9
Drew University 9
Colgate University 9
Juniata College 9
Clemson University 9
Virginia Polytechnic Institute and State University 9
Washington and Lee University 9
Hendrix College 8
Trinity College 8
Bates College 8
University of Maryland-College Park 8
Mount Holyoke College 8
Lafayette College 8
University of Florida 7
Scripps College 6
Colby College 6
SUNY at Binghamton 6
Haverford College 6
Boston College 5
College of the Holy Cross 5
Tufts University 5
Hamilton College 5
College of William and Mary 5
University of Iowa 3
Wellesley College 3
Wake Forest University 3
University of Richmond 3
Purdue University-Main Campus 3
Auburn University Main Campus 2
Johns Hopkins University 2
Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute 2
University of Virginia-Main Campus 2
Amherst College 1
University of Pennsylvania 1</p>
<p>People sometimes transfer for personal reasons: A parent is sick, a girlfriend or boyfriend is elsewhere, a former girlfriend or boyfriend is at the same university, homesickness, preference for a different region or different sort of school.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>No metric is perfect</p></li>
<li><p>These transfers are probably not statistically significant.</p></li>
</ol>
<p>At a small LAC they could be significant.</p>
<p>There seems to be a high drop out rate at all of the alternative schools. The reasons for this are pretty obvious. The alternative structure doesn't fit, is too difficult, etc. I don't think that correlates well with the quality of the education available at these schools. The fact is, the quality of the education at an alternative school is often only as good or bad as one makes it due to the amount of freedom allowed. We have a funny situation at Bennington that seems to be a regular occurrence. People leave after, or during, their freshman year, go to another school and then return to Bennington. I know several people who have done that. I wonder how that plays in to the statistics?</p>
<p>
[quote]
The only schools who should be pleased by students who transfer to other schools are the community colleges who send students to 4-year colleges. A transfer is a drop-out from the college. They don't pay tuition or room and board any more. There is no positive way to spin this from the college's point of view. A high transfer-out rate reflects badly on the college.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Fortunately for thousands of students who successfully transfer, not all personnel at colleges agree with you. </p>
<p>I've been in higher education a long time, and I have met few people who see it as a numbers-driven end game when it comes to students. Educators would much rather see a student find a good fit that will unsure his or her future success than have them stay and be miserable or fail. That includes a student at a regional campus who proves herself and moves to a flagship, or a student at a large university who feels lost but finds a niche at a smaller school. These students may not be good for "the bottom line" but this is a human business. Some colleges even have transfer resources for their students. </p>
<p>And I cannot emphasize more strongly than within higher education, these students are not called drop outs. Use whatever terminology you personally wish, but understand that you aren't speaking their language when you do it.</p>
<p>
[quote]
These transfers are probably not statistically significant.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>We might all be surprised. I'm too swamped to seek hard numbers on this but when I get the chance I'll see what I can find.</p>