Hi… my son is trying to decide between Mechanical Engineering at USC vs. UC Berkeley. While USC seems to have smaller classes and more resources, Berkeley has higher rankings. We are wondering if it is easier getting jobs and internships going to one school over the other. Also, is the quality of teaching very different?
Kid is admitted by both too major in mechanical enginieering and already committed to USC. There is housing crisis going on at Berkeley. Plus, too liberal at this flagship UC campus. Also, it is much easier to change major later.
Thanks for your reply.
Is one significantly more than the other?
Cost wie… yes. USC is more expensive. However, they have smaller classes and more resources. Berkeley has higher ranking, larger classes and worse housing.
We have been so impressed by USC Viterbi and my student’s peers - what an outstanding group of young entrepreneurial type people will be his lifelong friends. They are seniors and all had fantastic internships (8 of them shared 2 apts in bay area last summer) all working at separate high tech companies. One is already well funded for a start-up, all employed after graduation with salaries that would blow your mind. I know, sounds to good to be true, but it is. (Part is putting yourself in a high achieving group of people at any school.) I don’t look at rankings as much as the type of education, social environment, flexibility to adjust/adapt to changing education plans, and connections made at any school. In those regards, USC has been stellar for us. So much that my third Trojan will attend this fall.
Thanks a lot for your thoughts and inputs. If you dont mind me asking, was your student’s major mechanical engineering? My son loved a lot of things about USC, particularly study abroad options, flexibility to include minors. But wasnt sure about the perception of USC in the industry with regards to jobs and internships.
My son was CS, his friends are various engineering majors including ME and BioMed. But I should add, I really don’t know anything about the reputation of ME out of UCB, I only hear about EECS. The advice I got (from a UCB EECS grad that had Phd from Stanford in engineering) was that I should consider the type of person my son was when we were comparing USC/UCLA and UCB. It is important to understand the personality you are working with going into college - will he fight his way to the front of the class, battle for research opportunities, will he make friends in a really competitive environment or be more on his own? Would he grow more in an environment where those things are more accessible and gain confidence (and get the experience he needs on his resume) because he can easily get those opportunities? Would a bigger struggle be good for them and can they handle it? They all grow tremendously in these four years, but what kind of environment suits their personal growth best? Where is success for him personally more likely?
I cannot stress how those of us on the inside of USC just shrug and shake our heads when people bring up industry perceptions - this is USC in 2017 (not the 80s) USC is very well regarded. Besides USC’s rise in the last decade and its progressive m.o., the alumni network is more incredible than you can ever know till you are part of it. It is private versus public education - they are soooo different.Both are amazing schools, but they operate differently.
So after sending four to college, I look more at fit than anything the outside world thinks or ranks (which are bought anyway). Regardless of the school, a student that excels and takes advantage of all a school offers will have great opportunities for internships and jobs. The key is finding the environment he will do his best in. So look at the schools, but look at him most.
Thanks … really appreciate your thoughts.
2017xxxx
One of my kids is at Viterbi for ME. Spent a few days with her over break. Here’s the story:
Very happy. Very challenged. Very busy.
Can’t speak for Cal, but here’s the things she likes about SC/Viterbi:
Student make-up. She has a couple of engineering girl-friends at other programs. They feel a bit of “gamer boy overwhelm.” USC/viterbi has a goal of 40% female engineering UG. Don’t know if they exactly hit it, but it’s close. For male students that can be a good thing or a big shrug. For my D, huge plus. Also, she feels like SC enrolls a more well-rounded engineering student than some of her friends report from their schools.
Also, for my kid, it was important to go to a school where she would hang with French Lit majors and ME students and start-up wannabes etc. (I’m sure you get to do that at Cal too btw) and she’s enjoyed SC for that. Suitemates 1st year include pre-med, Fine Arts major, Film editor major, Language major, Systems Eng major…
Resources: Very well supported. Not exactly hand-holding, you have to go out and ask, but she is navigating a semester abroad right now and it’s pretty tricky since she wants to do a very credit-intensive minor on top of ME (and maybe the progressive MS) and she reports they are helping her figure out ways she can do it. Overall, Viterbi in general seems to get outsized resources for its size within SC.
Internships: Don’t know yet as she has done summer school instead to free up enough courses to go abroad, but we asked around before she chose SC over a couple of other well ranked programs and all the friends we know in the eng. world said SC’s rep is good and getting better. Cal’s is better at the moment, but I would not be surprised if SC/Viterbi were considered on par in 5-10 years.
Too many clubs, activities, research opportunities for her to do all she is interesting in. Had to drop 2 clubs and only has time for 3 now really with any consistency. Wanted to do solar car and rocket club too, but something had to give.
The food seems to be pretty bad. And repetitive. The good news is, you get unlimited access to the repetitively mediocre meals. (might just be my kid. she’s got specific tastes.)
Housing is uneven. Some is awesome. Some is not so awesome. She also finds the academics challenging, but survivable. Getting good grades, but is earning them the hard way… but somehow seems to have time to take the metro to Santa Monica for lunch or uber up to the Broad every couple of weekends.
USC has a “GE” system that is kind of like a “core” but not as restrictive, except that you have to take GEs at USC, which is kind of a drag for engineering students as it would be better if they could grab their English Lit GE while doing a summer in London, rather than going to London to study a course they can get at SC, which is what some fo the engineering summer programs end up being.
She is not particularly Frat/Sor attracted, but her dorm floor seems to love to get crazy by playing board games til 3 am on weekend.
All in all it has been a great experience so far, but she has not dived into really trying to leverage the degree professionally yet. So I dunno how good the vaunted “trojan family” is at that point. She is involved in clubs with a lot of Jr.s and Srs and reports they are getting offers to do cool things, but I haven’t really paid that much attention yet.
Hope this helps.
Thanks so much for your observations of the program and the school. My son does not have a scholarship. Does that mean his freshman dorm will not be as good and getting like-minded roommates will be tougher? I am glad your children find the engineering program challenging. At some points in their presentation, they make it look like they are trying to make it less rigorous. And yes I agree, being able to take GE classes outside would make it easier to schedule study abroad. My son is also very interested in studying abroad. Can they do a semester abroad taking technical classes as well in universities like University of Edinburgh or Imperial College?
@2017xxxx my D got money but not one of the “fancy” scholarships, but her living situation was great. She’s in parkside and really likes it. Close to Viterbi classes. It’s a “arts and humanities” res college, but really, aside from a great mix of students and the offer of dinner with resident faculty once in a while, it’s suites, study rooms on each hall, small common areas, no kitchens semi-private baths. (she’s in a suite of 8 girls, 2 per room with 2 baths.) Good AC. Some other dorms. North, I think, maybe Pardee? are older and not all have AC. They, at least Near North, is more of the traditional hall and room structure (I think, have to admit this is second hand, I’ve not been in Pardee or North)
D found roomates on FB. Actual roommate is complete match. Best friends already, seems like the might be for life. Other suitemates were varying degrees of sympatico. One of them will be part of her 4-some living together this fall. All got along great tho. She really lucked out/worked hard at preparing for the living thing 100%
I imagine rigor differs for different kids. D is getting A/A- but she does claim she has to work hard for them. How hard, only she knows. She seems pretty stressed around midterms and finals though. But not flipping out stressed, just “got to get studying, bye!” stressed. Some of the kids from her HS agree with her that the math is a lot of work. Engineering courses seem not as difficult. One hint if your S does got to Viterbi as an ME major, there is a MAT SCI you can take instead of CHEM. FWIW my D LOVED the mat sci - esp her prof - (and she is pretty “meh” about Chem.) Also, since it is ME specific it’s small, not full of pre-meds scraping to get the A… she claims 100% the way to go.
The way they do a “real” semester abroad is by taking USC approved engineering courses. My D said her choices seemed to be some NZ/Aussie schools, Sussex (UK) Queen Mary (London) Edinburg or St. Andrews (can recall which, but a Scottish school.) I think Singapore was perhaps an option as well. (These are the schools that are “pre-approved” dunno if USC is open to studing outside of that list.) She will take mostly engineering courses if/when she goes. In fact, she has to load up some extra GEs to make room for that and her minor which is really credit-heavy.
Our S was a Viterbi EE grad. D was a cinema USC grad. Both had great experiences there. S had internship opportunities after sophomore year and JR year. He also did research on campus for engineering and geology profs and helped write published articles about the research.
They do have a high % of females in engineering and that made S happy. He worked with a female for the engineering prof and also had females in his study group. They gave LOTS of engineering career fairs that students are encouraged to and do participate as soon as they arrive on campus.
S had a choice of 3 full time job offers by Feb of his SR year. He is happily still working at the one he accepted.
There is a LOT of funding dedicated to the engineering school, donated by happy, successful engineering alums. About 15% of S’s SR class went to USCal with him, many majoring in engineering as well.
They do encourage the students to stretch themselves and take courses of interest. S took sailing, learned to weld and make a receiver, geology, and learned rock climbing.
There is flexibility to switch majors–one of his friends swapped from engineering to psychology and ended up going to law school.
@HImom thanks for your input. Just wondering what do you mean by " About 15% of S’s SR class went to USCal with him, many majoring in engineering as well."
S had about 200 kids in his HS SR class. About 30 went to USC, including S. Many were NMFs and got good merit awards. Many also majored in engineering, like S. Both our kids enjoyed their years at USC.
@2017xxxx Money has nothing to do with housing situation - what matters is that he submits the housing application as early as possible. They have a room mate matching survey that he should complete honestly. Mine relied on room mate matching (more than 50% still let USC match room mates, boys don’t use social media as much as girls) and four years later the kids he lived with in his suite/floor are still living together today and will be life long friends. They do a good job matching, it seems they take major into consideration as well, he was with all fellow STEM majors - good mix of engineering, math, physics - all kids had good work ethic like he does.
Yes, S did like the guy he was matched with at USC. They do a decent job for the fall. The one major issue was that roomies was an early riser and S doesn’t like to wake prior to noon most days, that’s how each of them is wired. Because of the differences in their internal clicks they didn’t bond as much as they might have otherwise.
D was a spring transfer admit so she was the new person in the suite. It worked ok but they had already estsblished some routines before she arrived.
I can imagine that being an issue. Is it a better choice to get a standard dorm room in freshman year rather than a suite just to increase the chance of socializing. My son is not the party type but loves hiking, birding and stuff like that. Could he request a floor or dorm with kids that have similar interests? If so, how does he know which dorm has such a group?
It is a personal preference. Everything is a trade-off in housing. Regular dorm (Residence Hall) is certainly way more social, but you give up creature comforts like AC that you get in the suites. There are a lot of kids that are not party types at USC, contrary to what some may think. The traditional style dorms are all on one part of campus so there is a lot of freshman consolidated in that area which is great for meeting people. One of mine enjoyed Parkside Suites but did say it is more isolated over there than being in the residential hall complex, and his friends in the residence halls met way more people faster. But if you prefer suites they are very nice. Marks Towers is the “Great Outdoors” Special Interest Community, but I am not sure how active those actually are (they just started those in last year or two), but certainly there will be some activities out of there. My new freshman only chose residence halls on her app because her goal is to meet as many people as possible. Some don’t like the group bathroom thing, she could care less. Most important thing yours can do is get that housing app filled out asap. Cost $55.
Check out the housing website it has everything.
http://housing.usc.edu/index.php/special-interest-communities/
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Thanks. We will check out these links.