Engineering vs. Engineering Technology

<p>Sorry if this is a common topic on here, have some specific questions though.</p>

<p>First a quick introduction, I'm 25yrs old, no college experience at all, I'm in the Navy as a Electrician (Nuclear). I have 2.5yrs left on my contract, then I'm getting out. I'll spend the rest of my contract in the shipyard, where I should have time to finally start pursuing a degree. Stationed in Norfolk, VA.</p>

<p>So I went and talked to a college counselor for Old Dominion University on base today to see what my options are. My options are to either go for a BS in Engineering Technology (Electromechanical Systems) and I'd only need 39 (out of the total 120) credits or a BS in Engineering Technology (Nuclear Systems) and I'd need to take 61 credit hours (out of the 128 total). Any other Engineering program I'd be starting from scratch pretty much.</p>

<p>My biggest worry is being limited down the road, after I get out of the Navy. Either in school, or in the workplace, by not having a "real" engineering degree. While I'm in the Navy, everything (except books) are paid for with tuition assistance. I could take 3 classes a semester and get my BSET before I get out. After I get out I plan on using my GI Bill and taking advantage of the Texas Hazelwood Act to pay for more schooling, however far I decide to go. </p>

<p>Thing is, I know for a fact Nuclear Engineering is not what I want to do. Electrical Engineering I'm kind of iffy about. If it's anything like what I do in the Navy (large scale stuff, power generation, motor/generator theory, etc) I'm not gonna like it. I'd rather work on smaller scale stuff like hardware. There's a lot of engineering fields that interest me (Petroleum, Hardware, Software, Civil, Aerospace), but neither Nuclear nor Electrical are at the top of that list. </p>

<p>So if I want to be happy (that's everyone's end goal right?), should I just take basics while I'm in the Navy (paid for by tuition assistance), and then use the GI Bill to finish an engineering degree in something like Aerospace or Petroleum? Or should I take advantage of my shortcut and get a Engineering Tech degree before I get out, and then use the GI Bill afterward to get a masters or another bachelors?</p>

<p>Here is the difference, according to ABET:</p>

<p>[ABET</a> - Engineering vs. Engineering Technology](<a href=“http://www.abet.org/engineering-vs-engineering-technology/]ABET”>http://www.abet.org/engineering-vs-engineering-technology/)</p>

<p>Hey, thanks for the reply. Ive seen that link before. Doesnt really help me though. I understand that Engineering Technology = applied applications and Engineering = theory/math. As far as job outlook/salaries and future education though?</p>

<p>“Of course, there is much overlap between the fields. Engineers may pursue MBAs and open their own consulting firms, while technologists may spend their entire careers in design capacities.”</p>

<p>Does this mean I could never go for an MBA with a BS in Engineering Technology? At this point Im leaning toward getting a BSET (to take full advantage of tuition assistance and have a degree before I get out of the Navy),and then either get a BS in Engineering with my GI Bill (=> have 2 Bachelors) or get a masters in something completely unrelated (if thats even possible, once again, I’m new to this whole college thing)</p>

<p>The ODU degrees seem pretty specialized. You could get one of ET degrees and apply for jobs. ODU should be able to give you some good ideas about job placement. If you don’t land a suitable job with your ET degree, then you could go for the other degree.</p>

<p>You could definitely go for an MBA with an engineering technology degree, that’s what my mentor did and he now works for Goldman Sachs. </p>

<p>I personally find BSET’s unnecessary. You can more than likely just get an accredited associates version of the degree and that would likely open up the same doors. I’ve looked at job postings for engineering technicians, and none of them asked for a Bachelors. Most just wanted experience; only a few of the postings asked for 2 year degrees. You can just get the BSET, then just get a masters in your desired field I suppose.</p>

<p>I think you should do all your . Edswith the tuition assistance you get, then use your GI bill for the program you’re really interested inonce your contract resolves.</p>

<p>The credit the OP is getting for his navy experience is almost equal to an associate’s degree, so he can pick up a bachelor’s in about the same time as an associate’s.</p>

<p>That’s why I love the Navy. You have so many options to get to the same end result. </p>

<p>Let me get this str8…you talked to the guys on base and not the actual campus? </p>

<p>Instead of doing electromechanical…just get the tech degree in the field you want. ODU has a Electrical Engineering technology and a Computer Engineering technology BS that also gives you a minor in CS. You might not have as many credits transfer to it (I still suspect a lot) but that way you are getting a degree that you know you want. </p>

<p>[Department</a> of Engineering Technology](<a href=“http://ww2.eng.odu.edu/et/academics/eet/eet.shtml]Department”>http://ww2.eng.odu.edu/et/academics/eet/eet.shtml)</p>

<p>According to [Accredited</a> Program Search](<a href=“http://main.abet.org/aps/AccreditedProgramSearch.aspx/AccreditationSearch.aspx]Accredited”>http://main.abet.org/aps/AccreditedProgramSearch.aspx/AccreditationSearch.aspx) , there are some associates degree programs in engineering technology.</p>

<p>I’m not an engineer, but run an executive search firm. I usually recruit only executives; on rare occasions I’ve recruited engineers. I have recruited countless technical managers and executives (over half of my search assignments have been for technically-based companies). This means that I’ve reviewed the careers of perhaps 50,000 or 100,000 people in technical disciplines. Primarily, the positions I work on pay $100,000 to $300,000.</p>

<p>Here’s what I’ve seen in my 16-year career:</p>

<p>1) I have never seen someone with a BS in engineering technology who had the title of technologist. They carry the title of engineer at work.</p>

<p>2) I have seen people with BSET degrees managing people with BSE degrees.</p>

<p>3) Some companies will not hire BSET’s at all; some will not hire BSET’s for design engineering positions, but will hire them as test engineers, manufacturing engineers, applications engineers, sales engineers or production managers. Many companies don’t care at all which type of degree the candidate has. When recruiting at the management level, I’ve never had a client who cared whether the candidate had a BSE or BSET one whit; on the half dozen senior engineer searches I’ve conducted, the client didn’t care whether the person had a BSE or BSET degree, either. </p>

<p>4) I have asked numerous people with engineering degrees, 25 years past graduation, if they ever used differential equations in their work. Almost all have said they never used Diff EQ, and rarely used calculus when they were engineers. Now that they are managing other engineers, or managing a division or an international sales force (which is when I interview them), they never use calculus.</p>

<p>5) More companies seem to be interested in a knowledge of statistics than differential equations in my experience (yet it seems that stats are not required in most BSE or BSET programs). Most of the BSET programs require an applied version of differential equations, anyway, although the physics required is not calculus-based.</p>

<p>6) As a test, I checked a client of mine, a 300-employee architectural engineering firm that designs systems for buildings, such as HVAC systems for clean rooms. This is a field where a PE needs to sign off on everything. They have 12 managing directors, each who runs a business area, and oversees a group of engineers and engineering managers. 2 of their 12 managing directors have engineering technology degrees. This is a well-respected firm with a national reputation that pays their engineers very well and has engineers who are very good.</p>

<p>7) There are almost no grad degrees in BSET. You can often get into a masters in engineering program with a BSET if you have taken the BSE math sequence and the calculus-based physics. You can get into MBA programs with either BSE or BSMET degrees.</p>

<p>8) Companies are telling me that they can’t find engineers, despite the unemployment rate. I turned down work last year with a company desperate to find a hydraulics engineer and a welding engineer, both who would earn over $100K if they had 10 years or so of experience (and this was in a low, low cost of living area). They certainly would not have cared whether the person had a BSE or BSMET degree, as long as the person had the experience in hydraulics or welding required. One client told me that today’s unemployment rate doesn’t apply to engineers. Engineers who started their careers in the 1970’s and 1980’s are retiring, and there are not enough kids going into the field to replace them, amazingly enough. The shortage will continue, and I think that people with either BSE and BSMET degrees will have people begging for them, unless they have terrible academic records, or are jerks.</p>

<p>9) My research has indicated that BSET’s have starting salaries of usually about 10% less than BSE’s. RIT has both programs, and lists a starting salary of $50K for BSMET grads, and $55K for BSME grads.</p>

<p>10) I’ve recently been exploring the difference between BSE and BSET for my son. He’s been accepted now into both BSE and BSET programs. After discussing the curriculums at various colleges, he’s decided he’s going to take engineering technology, because he feels he’ll be bored with the abstract courses in engineering. Engineering technology courses start right away with hands-on courses, and he learns better that way. He’ll be better off working late in a lab than working late doing proofs, will have more fun in school, and be more likely to graduate if he goes BSET.</p>

<p>11) My brother-in-law has a BSME from an elite engineering school, and he reviewed the BSMET and BSME programs at RIT. He said that they would be more likely to hire the BSMET at his company, because the person would be more hands-on and more prepared to jump in right away and contrbute. He said that unless you’re designing rocket nose cones, the theoretical courses they offer in a BSME degree aren’t that helpful, and haven’t been helpful in his career. He said that he wished they had had a BSMET program at his college, because he would have enjoyed it more.</p>

<p>12) You can’t become a professional engineer in some states with a BSET degree. Most states do allow you to become a PE with a BSET degree, however, although usually you’ll need a couple more years of work experience before you can become a PE. Most engineering jobs don’t require that you have a PE, however, although some do, especially civil engineering jobs.</p>

<p>13) It doesn’t take long after graduation for your work experience to eclipse your degree. I can’t tell you how many times I’ve seen electrical engineers working as mechanical engineers or materials engineers. 10 and 20 years out, your work experience will have long since eclipsed what type of degree you have. </p>

<p>14) In sum, you will be limiting yourself a bit (and I’m not sure how much) if you have a BSET degree. You will not face unemployment because of it. You are also limiting yourself if you don’t have a law degree, an MD degree, or a Masters in Social Work, depending on your chosen field. I have a psychology degree, and that hasn’t stopped me from being successful professionally (and I earn more than the average engineer and the average engineering manager, despite my inferior degree).</p>

<p>If you can get an BS in electromechanical engineering technology by getting only 39 more credits, I would get that degree, rather than starting over. Companies love electromechanical expertise, because everything mechanical has an electronic connection or PLC or motion control unit somewhere. You’ll also have good hands-on experience from the Navy, and companies love that hands-on experience, and the Navy programs train people very well. I would get the degree from the best school you can, and avoid the for-profit schools that advertise on TV all the time. ODU should be fine.</p>

<p>Regarding education, the biggest thing I can tell anyone is how limiting not having a bachelors’ degree of some type can be when someone is trying to change companies or find a new job, even if they have worked their way into a solid management position. I’d get your BSET degree and start enjoying life.</p>

<p>Here’s a previous post that I made about the difference between engineering and engineering technology that will give you the perspective of someone who has worked in the equipment manufacturing, aerospace, automotive and petroleum industry as an engineer and a manager:</p>

<p>I’ve been trying to learn more about the differences between a BS in engineering degree and a BS in engineering technology degree for my son, so I sent the Mechanical Engineering Technology Degree curriculum from Rochester Institute of Technology (RIT) to my brother-in-law, who has a BS in mechanical engineering degree from an Ivy League school that also has one of the top engineering programs in the country. He’s 25 years out of school, and worked as an engineer earlier in his career. He has since been an engineering manager, and now is Director of New Business Development for his company.</p>

<p>By the way, the RIT engineering technology program includes applied differential equations; some engineering tech programs don’t require this course.</p>

<p>After reviewing it, this is what he said:</p>

<p>“I went through the RIT Mechanical Engineering Technology curriculum. After a while, I realized that is a much more rigorous, but less theoretical level curriculum than I had at (an Ivy League University). You actually learn some real world skills in this curriculum. For example, in this curriculum you learn about pneumatic & hydraulic systems. I had to learn this on my own, on the job, when I was making test equipment and aerospace equipment. Instead, while at school, I learned about Fluid Mechanics, taught by an incomprehensible professor. Everything I learned in that class was of no practical value unless I was going to develop rocket nose cones. Just theory. I probably learned essentially nothing of value in that class. This program emphasizes the practical, and touches on the theory, perhaps.”</p>

<p>“This still requires the ability to do calculations. For example, to be an electrician you need to know the rules about wire, and you better know about amp, volts, etc. You have to add up amps, etc. Your son will probably cover all the calculations and understandings that an electrician has in the one course on electrical, plus some. He will not have to present a mathematical model of the electromechanical field surrounding a torus. But he still has to work and think in a mathematical mode. You end up solving equations and coming up with numbers that represent what is going to happen in the real world. Some people I know at work simply cannot make the connections between mathematics and the real world. But they also may not have been trained at RIT, so who is to say what caused it. I like seeing that they are teaching Computational Methods for Engineering Technology, because that is the way that calculus is really done today.”</p>

<p>“The first year might be pretty easy, with Calculus being the weed out class, like Organic Chem is for premeds, but I am just speculating.”</p>

<p>“Overall, this will be a challenging course load. But if he has an interest in solving mechanical problems the interest will be there, and it looks like they allow the kids to make the connection between theory and the real world, which is easier to stay awake for.” </p>

<p>“I would hire someone with this background for every engineering position I have encountered so far in my career, probably over someone with a less hands-on education from a more selective college.”</p>

<p>In response to Boondocks:</p>

<p>1) I have never met a “technologist” either, but I have met a lot of people with BSEET’s titled as “field engineers” or as some variation of technician - the latter pays less and is almost never filled by BSEE’s.</p>

<p>2) Sure.</p>

<p>3) Degree type does not matter for management positions, but it can matter - while there is a lot of overlap between the degrees, there are some positions that will be only open to one or the other. My company hires both, but all the BSEET’s wind up in the same couple of departments.</p>

<p>4) At 25 years, many to most engineers are primarily managerial. At my company, I work mostly with senior engineers in that range of experience, and we all still use calculus regularly - if you want to do the cutting edge work, you need the math. Not saying that everyone needs it, but not everyone will be doing cutting edge work 25 years in, either.</p>

<p>5) Agreed - statistics is undertaught in most colleges, and while many engineers will eventually put aside calculus, most will at some point need to refresh their statistics knowledge.</p>

<p>6) No idea what goes on in architectural engineering.</p>

<p>7) Research-based grad programs are often quite reluctant to admit BSEET’s even if they have solid math. Grad programs are generally very theoretical, and there is a perception that the BSEET programs lack the rigor and motivation that grad school needs. No idea on the MBA.</p>

<p>8) I will trust this for now, as I am not currently in the market…</p>

<p>9) As I said before, the BSEE and BSEET have a lot of overlap in industry, but most of the better-paying jobs are mostly or entirely restricted to BSEE’s. At the end of the day, a lot of the hands-on work is better and more affordably gotten from senior technicians, and much of the design work requires theory that the BSEET’s skipped over.</p>

<p>10) Whatever makes you happier. At the end of the day, both routes provide a solid career and salary. This is all just splitting hairs.</p>

<p>11) Depends on the industry and field. My company has a number of departments (the best paying ones) where even a BSEE is not enough - the theory required for the design is beyond the scope of ANY BS degree.</p>

<p>12) The PE only impacts a small percentage of EE’s, so the fact that it is harder or unavailable to a BSEET is of comparably little consequence, unless you WANT those particular jobs!</p>

<p>13) Absolutely. However, your work experience is going to start and be heavily influenced by that first decade.</p>

<p>14) Like I said, this is all splitting hairs.</p>

<p>Cosmicfish – thanks for an additional perspective.</p>

<p>To: TwoMSixer: For perspective, you’re the equivalent of a second semester junior in the BSEMT program at Old Dominion – actually, with 39 credits to go, a bit beyond that, and you’re asking if you’ll be better of starting over to get a full-on BSE. Few people would recommend to a second semester junior that he start over unless there is some extremely pressing reason to do so. I would press you to get that BS degree in hand, which you will then have for life. After that, augment the degree as you see fit to or need to. </p>

<p>The research says that life has a tendency with people your age of getting in the way and preventing you from finishing – things like work and wives and family and kids and stuff. I kicked two candidates out on a project for a VP/Manufacturing last year because they had falsified their degrees – neither had ever finished their BS degrees, but felt they needed to show a BS degree to get considered. And that’s because in so many, many cases, you do need a bachelor’s degree in something to be considered for a job.</p>

<p>By the way, after graduation, you could be considered for positions that are not entry-level, because of all of our Navy experience. You will be way ahead of he other fresh graduates when you leave the Navy.</p>

<p>Awesome post Boondocks</p>

<p>thank you for your time for writing that boondocks.</p>

<p>Great advise. Is there an easy way to find list of BSET programs by region?</p>

<p>ANSWER - I found within the link in post #2
<a href=“http://main.abet.org/aps/Accreditedprogramsearch.aspx[/url]”>http://main.abet.org/aps/Accreditedprogramsearch.aspx&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>Bookmarked.</p>

<p>Does anybody have any experience with transferring or switching from a degree in engineering to one in engineering technology? Do any of the classes transfer?</p>

<p>Usually, the math and physics courses of engineering are a superset of those needed for engineering technology. For lower division engineering and engineering technology courses, it would depend on the schools as to what at one school is considered equivalent to what at the other school. Note that engineering technology is a relatively uncommon major, so switching to it may require transferring to a different school.</p>

<p>Yes; that link was helpful. And by going to the individual sites, it looks like the transferring guidelines can vary quite a bit. I’m trying to get a sense of when it gets too late, because you have too many credits, or is it more likely that few credits transfer.</p>

<p>Many of the more transfer-friendly schools prefer junior-level transfers (i.e. those who will take the last two years at the transferred-to school) and consider senior-level transfers (i.e. those who have only one year remaining) too late.</p>