<p>.“I think it is possible that he is still able to change his #1 university choice with PSAT”
A students school choice on the PSAT form is meaningless to colleges. All NMF’s have until May of their senior year to designate their final #1 choice- which is after students have received acceptances. All that listing choices on the PSAT form does is let the a college know that they MAY be receiving an application. What colleges DO care about is 1] actually receiving an application [applying ED is a strong way of showing preference, but is fraught with peril if one needs to compare FA offers among various schools before deciding where to go] and 2], if colleges are actually trying to attract NMF’s, then a student can let the college admissions officers in their essays AND inform their college counselors that a particular college is the students #1 choice.
But remember- colleges that don’t give merit scholarships based on NMF status- which is most of the Ivys- could not care less how if their school is a students first choice. This also is true of most highly selective colleges. i.e.- those with acceptance rates below 20%.</p>
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<p>It seems to me that merit aid is the connection.</p>
<p>“Should he at least apply to an Ivy, Stanford, etc. just to see if he can get in and what kind of financial package he would get.”
Sure, why not? Stanford has a well deserved reputation for loving Scholar-Athletes- even if they are not recruited to play for Stanford. I would also recommend he take the SAT again- if he can get his total score above the 2300 range they will definitely give his application a serious look- . Has he taken SAT subject tests that correspond to his AP classes?- I.e.- If he’s taken APUSH then he should take the US History SAT subject test,- AP foreign language- take the SAT language test, etc, etc. He’ll need 4 SAT subject tests to apply to S or any of the IVY’s.</p>
<p>^
You can’t be serious.</p>
<p>I don’t think merit aid should be the first cut - at least not for most kids. There’s not too much for example that Carnegie Mellon and American have in common in terms of the types of kids that are likely to be happy there.</p>
<p>“You can’t be serious.”
about what pray tell? I didn’t declare he would get accepted there…</p>
<p>I think maybe your statement that “he will need 4 SAT II’s to be accepted there”… almost all schools that require SAT II’s only require 2… Georgetown is the only school that requires 3… I’ve never heard of a school requiring 4.</p>
<p>I believe that a couple of the Ivies require three SATIIs. Yale required 2, so our son applied there…he never got around to the third SATII. </p>
<p>Both of our sons took their foreign language SATIIs in June of senior year. Bummer re senioritis, but placing well on the SATII can place you out of foreign language depending on your final college selection’s specific policies. One son started a new language in college out of true devotion and the second son took the opportunity to place out since he has sort of a tin ear and not a lot of potential as a fluent speaker. If you didn’t get the AP of 4 or 5 you likely need in foreign language…consider the SATII cutoff score at your college and go for it before you graduate high school.</p>
<p>well, I was speaking about Stanford and if one looks at the stats of their admitted students over the years, many have taken 4 subject tests. " Recommended" should be taken to mean minimum “required” at colleges like Stanford. And although they may “recommend” 3 SAT subject tests, if a student CAN take 4 tests in 4 different subjects- like math, science, English , History or foreign language, and achieve scores the mid 750’s+, they will have a stronger chance at the “golden ring” at colleges like Stanford than if they chose not to .
Stanford expects students to take the most challenging course load offered by their HS ,and to excel in them . Someone who has had the opportunity to take 4 AP classes by the time they are a junior, like the OP’s son, most probably has the ability to take 4 SAT subject tests somewhere in their area.</p>
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Do they publish this data somewhere, about how many tests their admitted students take? Or are you just getting this from what kids report on here?</p>
<p>I’m not doubting you, I suspect you may be right. I’m just always interested in seeing actual data like this. Most admissions offices are pretty stingy with it.</p>
<p>I agree with those who say he should try for a couple of Ivy’s if there are ones he’s interested in. What appears to be high level participation in a couple of EC’s along with strong academics will be very positive. Would help to get the writing score over 700…especially since he seems to be willing to take the test again…but…wouldn’t spend a lot of time on multiple retakes. </p>
<p>Emory, mentioned by a few, has a merit scholarship that needs school “nomination.” If Emory is of interest, have GC check this out now…rather than waiting until the fall.</p>
<p>Didn’t see a response on whether or not he wants to swim in college.</p>
<p>If an academic All American, should qualify to swim at many D3 schools. Even though D3 schools don’t offer athletic scholarships, they could be more inclined to offer a merit scholarship to a high stats student that is well liked by a coach…</p>
<p>Look at Carlton and Macalister in MN…although I’m not sure if all of the scholarship dollars are need based. Macalister is right in St. Paul, and Carlton isn’t that far from the Twin Cities. </p>
<p>A couple of regular CC posters have kids who have received merit from Rhodes in Memphis. Probably less boondocks than Denison…but also, primarily, an LAC.</p>
<p>Stanford asked for 2 subject tests. They will take 2 top scores from whatever number of tests you took. Taking more than 2 will not help if your first 2scores are high enough.</p>
<p>When a student gets merit aid, then the need-based financial aid is usually decreased by the same amount. At least that is what we ran into. So I don’t understand the focus on merit aid, since it looks like he is getting about $25K in need-based aid. Are you thinking of merit aid for full costs?</p>
<p>I would look at schools that have generous financial aid.</p>
<p>And Ivies would be a good gamble, with his profile. Harvard gives aid to families making up to $180K, who only pay 10% of that for the year.</p>
<p>(Harvard required 3 SAT II’s a couple of years ago, but since then, only require two. I believe they were the only one to require 3 at the time.)</p>
<p>EFC would only apply at a FAFSA school. Frequently the expected contribution is higher at Profile schools which the Ivies are (or are equivalent to for those that use their own forms).</p>
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<p>Many schools that award NMF scholarships follow this, but not all. OP, be sure to keep a careful eye on the deadlines for any schools that your S is considering that offer NM money.</p>
<p>Macalester, in St. Paul, does indeed award merit money, though I don’t know what their largest award is. Mac and Rhodes are two of that rare breed of LAC in a city.</p>
<p>Georgetown still is asking for 3 SAT IIs, but they’re possibly the last. Stanford might be seeing students taking 4 or more because many students with AP-heavy schedules end up taking whatever SAT IIs fall into their path.</p>
<p>Just to clarify: expected family contribution is often much lower at Ivies than the FAFSA EFC. You do FAFSA, Profile and IDOC for those schools. There is information on the Profile that is not on the FAFSA, which can change things either way, up or down, but the Ivies are more generous with FA than most privates, and their aid is generally better than the publics, which use the FAFSA.</p>
<p>When a student gets merit aid, then the need-based financial aid is usually decreased by the same amount. At least that is what we ran into. So I don’t understand the focus on merit aid, since it looks like he is getting about $25K in need-based aid. Are you thinking of merit aid for full costs?</p>
<p>I didn’t get it either comp mom.
If the FAFSA EFC is about $25,000 to $30,000 , a 100% need met school will leave that- however- as generally those schools also use the PROFILE, it is likely that more funds may be identified that are available for college tuition.</p>
<p>The family needs to identify what # is reasonable taking savings, loans & current income into consideration. That will give a better idea of schools- because merit aid even at schools that offer it, don’t necessarily reduce EFC, instead it usually reduces loans.</p>
<p>Unless you are a homeschooler there is absolutely no reason to take extra SAT subject tests. They will not make a difference. (I’ve heard plenty of admissions officers say so.) Taking a language subject test in order to place out of it, might be worth it, but should wait until the end of senior year. (Assuming you are still taking the language as a senior.)</p>
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<p>If the OP’s son is going to be NMF, then he very well may be looking at having his full tuition, or even tuition/room/board, paid for without regard to the EFC. </p>
<p>I have a theory that most bright kids would do well at virtually any university, so I can understand using merit aid during first round cuts. It certainly worked well for our family.</p>
<p>This thread began a while ago- but there are some recent posts that may be helpful
<a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/national-merit-scholarships/136920-full-rides-national-merit-finalists-scholars-17.html[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/national-merit-scholarships/136920-full-rides-national-merit-finalists-scholars-17.html</a></p>