Flunking precalculus

Parents Forum
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<p>Sorry, for some reason I missed an entire page of this thread. But I still think dropping the classes must be possible. And a good idea, even if it means summer classes or extra time until graduation.</p>

<p>Music and humanities seem to be what he likes. Can he do more of those?</p>

<p>There are some online classes that are asynchronous. Maybe he could substitute an online class, but clearing the deck of stressful classes seems to be a necessity.</p>

<p>It seems as if a full physical work up might be needed, as well as an appointment with a psychiatrist. Thyroid, Lyme, GI. I will warn you that for hard to diagnose problems, GI doctors often throw a problem into the IBS bin. Some people have a lot of success doing a diet that mainstream MD’s won’t suggest: eliminating potential allergens for a couple of weeks, then reintroducing foods one at a time to see if they cause trouble. Eliminating dairy and gluten can be especially helpful.</p>

<p>Antidepressants can cause nausea so if an MD wants to put him on one, he may have to try more than one. Zoloft seems to cause more nausea than some of the others.</p>

<p>I would take this depression seriously, allow your son to focus on things he likes and is good at, and avoid daily efforts to get him to perform at a level he cannot right now. treatment for the depression would be the most important thing.</p>

<p>One of my kids is a music major in college, so band doesn’t seem like a frill to me! What does he play? Does he have lessons outside of school? Play outside of school? Maybe a lesson in music could replace the tutor.</p>

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<p>Everybody learns differently. It’s worth a try to see if he likes Khan. (Maybe the tutor can help crossmap to helpful sections for this class)
[Trigonometry</a> and precalculus | Khan Academy](<a href=“http://www.khanacademy.org/math/trigonometry]Trigonometry”>Trigonometry | Khan Academy)</p>

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<p>The plot thickens.</p>

<p>Why do you think the band camp era sickness was psychosomatic? Is your son having problems with his peers? Does he just not want to do anything, which could be another symptom of depression? </p>

<p>Absolutely follow up on the idea that he has GI issues or depression. Even if he gets a clean bill of health, having someone to talk to about his school issues could be helpful, especially if he is not wanting to talk to you these days. </p>

<p>I also find it hard to believe that he will be stuck in preCal if he is failing. It would be so cruel. Surely the school can come up with some other option, even if it means study hall now and summer school for later. </p>

<p>Good luck. I feel for you.</p>

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<p>In our high school, the problem with the higher level math classes was this: the problems taught in class and done for homework were far simpler than what was on the test. (The kids were expected to be able to apply and extrapolate and go beyond to higher levels on the test, but my child was not able to do that. She is no dummy–near perfect SAT’s and now at Stanford. But not everyone can teach themselves advanced math.) It took us a while to figure out what was happening, because D would do all her homework and understand it, do extra problems she found online and understand them, and would do perfectly well whatever the tutor gave her. The class was making her feel stupid, and probably a little depressed.</p>

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<p>Almost similar here, but should be able to drop down (as teacher OKed honors). </p>

<p>Thank you GFG - same in our high school. The difference between the “advanced” and “honors” is a huge chasm. My son has no trouble with the higher level science (at least so far) and aces the “advanced” math with literally no effort. Steps into honors and is just overwhelmed. Same issue - the homework does not in any way reflect the tests. In face, when he tried to do the hardest problems in the book as a review (not assigned), the teacher told him not to worry about those problems. Unfortunately for him, he is very bright, but more of a STEM kid so dropping down in math will take a toll on his college prospects. </p>

<p>He also does not understand what to get help on - he understands the math so asking the teacher to explain it does no good. The books are often not very helpful because they don’t explain the steps involved for the harder problems - examples are generally easy. Even spent hours on Kahn academy but again these very hard tricky problems are not explained and he gets the “easier” ones.</p>

<p>I get that the truly gifted math students need something to keep them challenged. I just don’t get why the homework does not reflect what is required on the tests.</p>

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<p>I doubt that - but more importantly, where are the guidance counselor and school social worker in all of this? You need to enlist their advice and help immediately. The tutor does not replace these important school staff who are there to help your son. Believe me he is not the only high school student who feels overwhelmed and depressed.</p>

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<p>“Believe me he is not the only high school student who feels overwhelmed and depressed.” - Amen to that! The good news is parents are aware and perhaps can help. Trust me, learning of the disaster after semester end is travesty.</p>

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<p>Can the marching band be dropped or cut back? I remember one child falling asleep over the math book because of having spent so much time at marching band practice.</p>

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<p>Sounds like your son is focusing on getting an answer as opposed to understanding concepts. This is usually all that is required for algebra II and below. Being able to regurgitate problems done for hw is not an indication of conceptual understanding and usually not enough to earn more than a C</p>

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<p>I wonder if PreCalc teacher assume the kids will know how to do the homework without being taught or something. My son had no problems with algebra or geometry, even though he took Alg. II and Geometry at the same time–A’s in both. Last year he took PreCalc and would not have gotten through it if my husband (an EE prof) had not been available virtually every day to TEACH him the material, not just tutor him. </p>

<p>If you have not already taken your son to the family doc or a local psychologist, you really ought to get him in. It may be of more help to get him in to see a therapist so he can tell someone neutral what’s going on, rather than medicating right off the bat. There are some difficulties with using standard depression medications for teenagers. If the doc suggests medication it should go hand-in-hand with talk therapy–medication alone is probably not going to do much given that the depression sounds as if it’s situational.</p>

<p>Make sure you talk to guidance if you haven’t already. No high school wants to take the responsibility of having a teenager fall into a depression because the school has refused to review their course load and make allowances (the liability issue alone should make them willing to negotiate.)If band is stressing him out, you may need to insist that he drop it. My son resisted dropping band even though he hated it and it was stressful, given the out of class requirements, because he thought it would look bad on his college applications if he dropped band his senior year. When my husband and I firmly suggested he drop it, he finally decided to do so and now he’s really glad he did. </p>

<p>Good luck.</p>

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<p>Focus on the depression. Keeping your S alive is goal number one. Anything else is gravy. Depression is THAT serious. Read up on it and you will find that many depressed people attempt suicide and a large fraction of them are successful in that endeavor. Your son needs to know that you care about him and not his grades. </p>

<p>Seek help from an adolescent psychologist for therapy and a psychiatrist for an evaluation for medication. The team should work well together (like one referring the other). You need both. </p>

<p>Once you have a formal diagnosis, the school must make accommodations like dropping the class. The school is used to this and will probably want to help. </p>

<p>If your son and the psychologist agree, a tutor might be a good idea, but really, the grades are secondary until you know what you are dealing with.</p>

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<p>Crazy worried mom again. Tuesday Night my husband and I sat down with him and stated that we would be taking taking his cell phone, and restricting laptop access until he finished precalc hw and then chemistry hw in that order. Then he would be allowed the laptop. He usually needs the laptop for English hw. We stated that we knew it was hard, but believed he could be successful. I told him I would “grade” the chem hw myself and might copy and send precalc hw to his tutor. We told him to just do the hw and not worry about the grades.
he didn’t say much back to us. He only asked to drop AP lang which is scheduled for the spring and has the same teacher he has now for English. I said fine. Really I just want to do anything to take some pressure off of him.<br>
He seemed to work hard on precalc hw. He had a practice test to do. It was 25 problems. What struck me was that even though they had a substitute in class that day and had only worked on this practice test in class he still had only done 4 problems by the evening.<br>
I thought we worked really well thru the chemistry hw. He seemed to understand it pretty good.</p>

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<p>Last night he did not have precalc, because they had the test. He also did not have any chem hw. He did do a 2-3 page paper for English and turned it in online.
The precalc teacher called me to say he was failing. He told me he seems to work hard and just makes careless errors. He told me he spoke to another previous teacher of my son who told him he was a good hard worker. I told him my son had made an A in honors Algebra II. He seemed somewhat surprised by that and stated that he should be able to be successful in precalc then. I stated that I thought some small whiff of success would help my son tremendously. He wanted to see my son after school and we set a time for Friday. His only suggestions are work hard and tutoring. At that time he said he hadn’t graded that day’s test.</p>

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<p>Now today, my son has texted that he made a 63 on the precalc test. He is very down on himself. Told me he hasn’t passes a test or quiz in precalc yet. This is true. </p>

<p>Guidance counselor has not returned my call. </p>

<p>I do think he is letting the fact that the teacher doesn’t take hw become a reason for putting the hw off, not doing it, or just glancing at it. This precalc teacher only does quizes and tests, no classwork grades, hw grades, etc. No extra credit no curving of grades. Tutor also states she believes she could be more effective if attempted hw before he went to see her. So that is why my emphasis on hw. </p>

<p>As to the other suggestions. I have never heard of someone being allowed to drop a class past the 10th day of school. Precalc is not honors or AP. He completed (only B) prior last year “regular chemistry”. This is 2nd year chemistry. There is only one level, it is “honors” for the fall and AP for the spring. It is expected that students take both and it is following the AP curriculum yearlong. He has a high C in that class and I feel he is doing okay in it. </p>

<p>He loves marching band. His friends are all in band with him. It is his social circle. It is also a class. If he did not attend after school practice or the competitions, he would make a poor grade in the class. In addition I feel this would pull everything he likes/ and his best support group away from him. Finally, since marching band is a group effort to pull him from the group now would hurt the other 79 students. </p>

<p>As far as where he wants to go to college, fortunately he is a junior and although it would be nice to think about that right now, we do have time. We are just trying to get through the days. I am not stressing him by asking or mentioning anything about college right now. </p>

<p>Yes, obviously he is overloaded, but I truly do not see a way to lighten his load much. I believe if he was succeeding he would feel sooo much better that the workload would not seem nearly as hard. I have watched him not use the time he has. Watch tv, play on the computer, instead of doing hw/ or studying. He is very bright, and isn’t used to having to study much. As one poster said, we have clearly hit a wall and hit it hard. </p>

<p>Ironically enough we actually have to go to his Beta club induction ceremony tonight. None of us are in the mood for it and frankly we don’t have time.</p>

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<p>You are focusing on the wrong problem and potentially doing damage by tightening your grip on his every waking hour. You cannot let him experience your disappointment. He’s in a downward spiral and you’re not going to solve it by making him feel worse. He needs to know that you love him unconditionally, even if he fails. Please, stop punishing him and focus on his mental health. </p>

<p>Your child needs the help of a mental health professional, and he needs it ASAP. You and your H might need it too to understand how to deal with him. </p>

<p>I’m serious. Please wake up and see that. </p>

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<p>Walking in front of a freight train would lighten his load. I suspect that he sees that too. </p>

<p>Please lighten up.</p>

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<p>Also, you won’t be able to get accommodations from the school until you have a bona fide letter with a diagnosis from a mental health professional. That call needs to be made before the guidance counselor.</p>

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<p>I agree with CRD here - get an appt with a mental health professional, preferably specialized in adolescents, ASAP. At the minimum your son has been suffering for 7 weeks - that’s almost 50 days of increasing pain. We don’t know what came first (if his grades reflect his condition, or if his condition comes from his grades) but figuring it out should be a priority, along with making sure he feels better. That will take a while and the longer you wait, the longer it’ll take.
If he’s depressed and has a note from a professional, the school will let him drop precalc. They can’t take the risk of maintaining him in that class in case he came to harm (which is something real, even for boys, even over homework, even over a grade, even in a stable and loving family.)
He’ll take precalc next year. No biggie (it’s the norm, actually).</p>

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<p>He’ll take precalc when he takes it, which right now, is not nearly as important as him getting help from a qualified mental health professional which he needs ASAP.</p>

<p>Drop the tutor. It’s not helping, and it’s obfuscating the issue. The more math your son gets pushed to do, and the more stupid he feels about doing it, the worse he’s going to feel about his life in general.</p>

<p>You are his parents and it’s your job to protect him from even the bad decisions he makes for himself. So it’s time for triage- math can wait, chem can wait, it can all wait.</p>

<p>Get him help.</p>

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<p>Your son’s attitude about Precal homework is puzzling.
How does he know he understands of the concepts if he doesn’t do problem sets?</p>

<p>Schools will let parents over ride regular school policy if their student has a compelling reason.
Depression and a steep nosedive in grades should be enough for you, the parent, to ask that he be allowed to withdraw from the course.
You need to call and ask for an urgent meeting with a vice principal or any school official that can make changes to your son’s schedule.
The gc not returning your call today is unacceptable.</p>

<p>Your son’s disregard about doing his math homework is counter productive and is directly responsible for his poor test scores.</p>

<p>Why is he having such a hard time making the connection? </p>

<p>My sympathies to the parents, you must be baffled about what’s going on with your son.</p>

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<p>Some hs have on campus “Interventionist”. Check on Friday if your hs has one to offer advise.</p>

<p>Just a wild brainstorm idea … maybe he needs an eye exam? Early in college DD developed a need for reading glasses (weak prescription).</p>