SE: I am following this part of the post very carefully. Are you saying that if DD pursues the IB Diploma in and of itself, she won’t have time for ECs? Or, instead, are you saying, that if she pursues the IB Diploma IN ADDITION TO APs, that would happen.
I appreciate this is being done in the vacuum, but at DD’s school, which is an excellent, one, the IB Dip students very much do both the Diploma and APs, and do very well in going to where they want to go.
Or so I thought. After reading all this, it might be time for a father-daughter chat soon!
I think the IB Diploma plus ECs is doable. My son commuted about 3 hours a day back and forth to school, did the Diploma program and was involved in a couple of pretty serious ECs, including varsity track, an outside drum troupe, the school’s scuba club. a couple of drama productions and a community service group - with the IB Diploma, it’s necessary to do community service and other activities in order to fulfill the CAS requirements. My son did not graduate with all 6s and he was really happy when it was over, but he did fine. I can’t imagine piling AP courses on top of what he did, however.
At my kids’ school most of the IB STEM courses are combos IB/AP. So the same course preps them for the AP test and the IB requirements. It may be the case at your school? I can’t picture your D taking IB Chem SL and AP Chem as two separate courses? I would think too much overlap. If you can get her schedule and share it here, we can have a better idea of what kind of workload it is.
IBDP plus AP plus ECs will be a challenge. But again, it depends on which IB courses and which AP courses. Not all IB courses are of equal rigor, particularly SL. Similarly, not all AP courses are of equal rigor.
Not that this is DD’s intention, but I will suggest against supplementing her course load with duplicative courses. I have, as an example, seen students take AP Calc plus IB Math HL. And shame on the high schools that allow that. In some instances, she may want to take the AP exam corresponding to the SL course, since few colleges give credit for SL. Finally, if she’s looking to take fluffier APs with the thought that AOs will be impressed, they won’t be.
Because they may have different needs, wants, and standards while filling out a class. For instance, it may be easier/harder for the same kid if the schools are all aiming for geographic diversity. And of course, it’s not an objective process. But even if admissions was completely objective at those schools, that still wouldn’t mean they all use the same objective process and criteria.
Very good point. IB is rigorous, more standardized than almost anything else in the US (probably only A-Levels/AICE is more standardized), and broad, but also pretty rigid (IMO). That may or may not be a problem given your point of view. Speaking as someone who despised taking foreign language classes during HS (but later and now became/am interested in one), I’m not a big fan of the rigidity of IB.
EXACTLY! And those needs and wants are not public facing. All any applicant can hope for is that they are close to what they think the school wants. From there, they hope for the best.
What a student does to get an IBD varies as well. While there are requirements (well explained on their website) and a student can pick a path based on their school’s offerings, students at other schools will have different options. There are less rigorous paths to the diploma but they are less likely to be an option in American schools who usually choose the IB program for the quality and rigor in core academic classes.
Remember too that the IB is offered globally and US schools tend to have less seat time than most of their foreign counterparts, so this is why it is so much work. There’s no way around that.
Personally, I like the IB. A lot. But as our school described it, if you do the IBD, you’ll be getting a degree from this high school and one from the IB. We both have requirements and ways of satisfying them. The “rigidity” represents what the IB thinks you need to have satisfied their requirements for a high school diploma. As a global organization, the FL requirements are generally greater, for example.
It’s worthwhile to think, before you do the program, how well fulfilling those dovetails with your own interests and plans. Colleges will be looking at the same thing.
what AP’s she’s thinking of taking - and is she thinking of taking the class or just the exam (since there’s a lot of overlap between SL and AP in several subjects, it’s common for students to take AP exams in SL subjects in order to get credit)
if she’s doing the full diploma, ie., with EE, CAS, etc.
what she’s thinking of majoring in
what colleges she’s thinking of
if she’s targeting colleges such as Florida publics, UNebraska, or SUNY Bing that offer a lot of credit for the full IB Diploma
Although some students from her school may have gone the full IB+AP route, it’s dubious it added much to college adcoms’ evaluation of curriculum rigor and thus may have needlessly deprived them of sleep.
If they took AP exams for SL courses it’s a different matter.
UIUC also seems to offer a ton of credit for IB scores (16 hours for a 7 in HL Chinese Mandarin B; up to 11/12 hours for Greek/Latin; up to 15 hours for SL Hebrew; 10 hours for SL Hindi; Japanese and Korean too; 14 hours for a 7 in HL Further Maths; up to 10 for HL Physics).
Then again, UIUC gives a lot of credit for AP too (up to 20 hours for AP Japanese and Chinese; up to 13 for AP French and up to 10 for others).
You’re absolutely right on your second bullet point: DD is taking the AP Exams in conjunction with the IB Class, not as a separate class. I hadn’t made that distinction. For example, she’s slated to take IB Math and will take the AP Calc BC exam (but not a separate class).
She’s doing the IB full Diploma course. She probably will want to do PPE as a major, but she’s not currently considering any of the schools you mentioned in her last bullet point.
I am encouraging her to go wherever she is happy. I’m pretty fed up with the admissions process to date. DD is a first-rate student and doing a lot of good work in sports and stuff outside of school. It’s going to be totally her choice as to schools. No doubt the Ivies and the HYPSM and T-20 (or whatever the acronyms are for admissions currently are), plus the UC system colleges are ones she’s considering. But we are encouraging to look long and wide, including international universities.
IB math A&A HL should include all of the AP calculus BC material. However, other IB math options may require some topping up of material to prepare for the AP calculus BC exam.
My kid did IBDP, a few APs and cross tested for several more APs, sports, ECs (national champion in one) and she was busy but not overloaded. I realize that some kids might be, but you have to know your kid. She went on to be a super high achiever in academics and ECs in college. She would have been bored any other way.
My kid took AP Calc and HL, they aren’t duplicative. I don’t think an HL student could pass the AP exam and vice versa. HL teaches more than Calc and the Calc it does teach it approaches from a different angle.
Editing to note that my kid took 1 year of HL and 1 year of APBC. Maybe students who take to 2 years of HL could pass, not familiar with that route.
I’d be pretty surprised if a kid who had done the second year of HL had trouble with BC. Not to say that preparation isn’t important, but I don’t think this would involve a lot of self-instruction.
Same for my D. She had originally started with the IB Dip, thinking she might go to the UK for university. But even after she decided not to apply to the UK universities, she went ahead and pursued the Diploma.
I know that the IBO has an older document that appears to clearly show that the IB program, and particularly doing well on the IB assessments, gave a leg up on college admissions. I don’t know if that’s still the case, but D did very well in admissions this year and is going to her favorite university.
Her IB teachers were WONDERFUL too. I worked with them on a variety of issues fora number of years as a parent volunteer.
Personally, I am mega-impressed with the IB program. I think D shares that, but who am I to speak for her.
May depend on which math HL. If it was the current A&I (instead of A&A) version, or the old version without the additional calculus option, then it may not cover everything in BC.
That is probably due to student self selection. The IB DP involves a lot of work, so (in high schools which offer it) it mainly gets the academically strongest students, who tend to do well in college admissions compared to the overall college bound high school population.
Numerous instances of feedback from AOs during the recruiting process proffered the view that IB Diploma is the hardest thing a kid can do in HS. Whether that’s true or not is I’m sure debatable (especially here), and I don’t care to debate it; but the point is that several AOs think it is and they influence admissions outcomes. So it seems those kids get a lot of rigor credit.
There can be more than one independent variable that influences something.