Getting into Oxford/Cambridge

<p>Wanted to find out form the parents of kids who either applied or are currently attending.
What does it take to be admitted to those schools?
We know about the admission to selective schools in US - earning good grades in difficult courses, EC, leadership. Is it similar over there or totally different, only numbers driven admission? Do kids who apply there still submit their SAT/ACT scores ?
My kid is a freshman in an IB program (well - preIB at this time) and applying to Oxford/Cambridge is not so small possibility.</p>

<p>My impression:</p>

<ol>
<li>Score 5’s on lots of AP’s (5 or more by your junior year)</li>
<li>Ace your SAT and SAT II’s (760+ in all subjects)</li>
<li>Write an excellent Personal Statement that describes your academic interest and accomplishment beyond high school curriculum in your intended course of study</li>
<li>Outstanding recommendation</li>
<li>Interview well (You will be tested in field that you apply for)</li>
</ol>

<p>High school grades are of no concerns to Oxbridge. Btw, you can only apply to either Oxford or Cambridge, not both.</p>

<p>from what I’ve heard from someone who has been an interviewer at an Oxford college for admissions, high grades (or their equivalent for American students - shown in test scores) are essential (for English students, they expect top scores on the high school exams), but the interview is critical. And you interview in your major, with 2 or so professors asking questions - so you have to impress the interviewers that you are prepared and stand out in your field of specialty, which could be tough to do coming from the more generalized, broad-based but thinner curricula of American high schools - also the interviews are a complicated and tricky process - a particular college may only be choosing 3 students in a field, for example. American students, on the other hand, may be treated differently, in part because they pay a heftier tuition…</p>

<p>My kid didn’t apply, but I know others who have. It’s a very, very different process. It is test heavy. You apply for ONE subject. IB and AP scores are more important than classroom grades. Morover, interviews are usually required. They are MUCH more important in the admissions process than they are in the US. The most impressive interviewee I’ve ever had as an alumni interviewer for my own college did not get into my alma mater. That wasn’t surprising. She did get into Oxford, which wasn’t surprising either. </p>

<p>Oxford was impressed by her strength in ONE subject and her AP scores and SAT II scores in that area . I’m sure she hit the ball out of the park during the interview, because she did with me. </p>

<p>I’ve gotten flamed for saying this in the past, but…</p>

<p>Admission to Oxbridge is also different in that you can apply to individual colleges. These colleges vary in the difficulty of admission. You CAN apply saying you don’t care what college you are admitted to. If you do that, you’re unlikely to get into one of the top ones. </p>

<p>The colleges vary in their strengths in particular subjects. My understanding is that everyone takes the same exams, but the tutor you have is assigned by your college. There are tables. I know one is called the Norrington Table. It’s for Oxford. These show the results of each college within the university in rank order and heavily influence where Brits apply. </p>

<p>The colleges also vary in terms of how much $ they have, which affects such things as the quality of the food and the facilities each offers. </p>

<p>There are sites like this one for Oxbridge. You might want to take a look. </p>

<p>Keep in mind though that the student has to know what (s)he wants to major in. You apply for a particular subject. You don’t wait a year or two and then decide what to major in. It’s a very different model of education.</p>

<p>mamenyu, when they say high grades, they meant SAT I/II and AP’s. They don’t even see your high school transcript before making a decision.</p>

<p>Yes: Norrington Tables, for Oxford, and they take them very seriously. Merton, the oldest of the colleges, is at the top.
The colleges are different in terms of their wealth as well - some are old and rich; others less of both. There is pressure on for diversity - economic and otherwise. I don’t know how American students fit into that mix…but times are tough now economically in England too, so that might help.
I defer to paperchasepop on the way they evaluate American students for their academic ability; in England they use the final high school exams (formerly A levels) and expect 3 top grades - admission is tentative, based on getting those grades.
I assume you have visited because your student should be making an informed choice - the experience could vary considerably depending on the college!<br>
A 3 year course in one subject is VERY DIFFERENT from an American college experience. St Andrews in Scotland is a 4 year college, more like a US experience. But your student must have applied already, so you probably know this…
There’s a website like CC - look for: student rooms.</p>

<p>Can you link to that website?
Oh, and my kid has EU citizenship, so won’t be applying as american.</p>

<p>I don’t think we are supposed to link to websites! Do a search on google for “student room” and you will find it. It’s kind of fun to see how similar and different it is from CC. And there are some American students on there.</p>

<p>OP: for Oxbridge Your AP scores and SATII matter a lot.
For UK candidates the criteria is 3 A level, which means for any stream you need three APs.
e.g. for Sciences at least

  1. Take AP Calc BC, AP Physics C, AP Chemistry
  2. Take AP Biology instead of Physics or Calc. BC for a Bio major.
  3. Take AP English language and Literature.
  4. To maximize take AP Euro History.</p>

<p>Take corresponding three SATII.</p>

<p>In order to have any shot, a score of 5 is must on your APs.
A score of > 750 on all SATII and all parts of SAT1.</p>

<p>The addmision to Oxbridge is not holistic. Even though they do consider ECs which can put you in front of others but if you don’t have the minimum, you won’t be considered at all.</p>

<p>Found the website - thanks .
Hope it won’t turn into another addiction ;)</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>Yes they will. Or at least they will have to apply as an overseas students and pay the full tuition.</p>

<p>You can only apply as a UK/EU student if you (in other words, the parents of the students) have been paying taxes in an EU country for at least the last 3 consecutive years. It does not count if the student has been in the EU for the purposes of sducation only eg at borading school. In this case you pay the reduced (government subsidised) fees. Citizenship is irrelevant. Americans who are long term EU residents benefit from the reduced tuition. Brits who live abroad don’t. </p>

<p>An IB students would probably be given a “conditional offer” of admission based on an IB score. eg if you get 44, you’re in. Fail to meet this condition and the offer is usually withdrawn (happened to Tony Blair’s oldest son I believe).</p>

<p>IB is definitely preferred to APs, as IB is quite common in the UK and makes it easier to compare the student to UK applicants.</p>

<p>You need to understand the basics such as
-applying through UCAS
[UCAS</a> - Home](<a href=“http://www.ucas.com%5DUCAS”>http://www.ucas.com)
-application deadline is 15th October
-you can only apply to Oxford or Cambridge, not both for undergraduate in the same year
-ECs are irrelevant
-Have to choose subject (effectively major) when applying and cannot change
-depending on the subject applied for, there may be extra tests for the student eg HAT for history

  • after the application form and potential extra tests, there is an interview.</p>

<p>I advise you to read the Oxford and Cambridge websites
[University</a> of Cambridge](<a href=“http://www.cam.ac.uk%5DUniversity”>http://www.cam.ac.uk)
[Homepage</a> - University of Oxford](<a href=“http://www.ox.ac.uk%5DHomepage”>http://www.ox.ac.uk)
There are videos of interviews on these sites.</p>

<p>My kid has UK/EU passport but is treated as foreign student. This is actually a plus since no FA for foreign students and we have actually had recruitment letters from tier II British universities --also known as new universities-- (Bristol, Leeds) based on his IB math scores and SAT II. S is legacy two generations of Oxbridge but that makes NOOO difference. ECs are completely irrelevant. As a US high school graduate, you must score over 700 on all three parts of the SATI in one sitting to be considered for Oxford or get the full IB with a good score. There is a minimum number of AP or IB HL that you need to have with top scores (4,5 or 5,6). It is not true that if you apply for “whatever” college you will automatically get the lower colleges. However, some colleges do specialize and the faculty there are stronger or more well known in their field, but Oxford now has university departments so if you are admitted in Lincoln and study botany you will have lecturers from all of the colleges that have botany professors. That being said, your tutor will be from your college so the top students apply to the most well known colleges in their area of specialization. One NMF in our district was accepted to Merton with only APs and no IB. While you are going to get a good education if you are disciplined at Oxford or Cambridge (take it from a family with 4 oxbridge phds) it really is up to the student to stay focused. Like our Ivy league schools, there are lots of kids who are burned out after high school rat race and just cruise or worse counting on Daddy’s money to keep them later. While Oxford is much more a meritocracy than before, there are plenty of kids who get in for the wrong reasons (went to the well-known prep programs, father is a lord or a foreign potentate…) and definitely some foreign kids may be cut some slack because they will pay full freight. Sounds familiar doesn’t it…as an Oxford native (as natives of Princeton and Cambridge will tell you) the University is what you make of it…the town has its seedy, tough side but the soccer team has improved tremendously since my childhood in the 60’s. Also, I do love my homeland, but I wouldn’t wish that place on a foreign student of color for anything–not much better than the segregated south. I wish S would have considered it (he had the stats) so I could have eaten pork pies more often, but really, I know that local state U will provide him with a quality education (and with a free ride!) as well as more academic flexibility since he is still a little unsure of his “passion”.</p>

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<p>Bristol is more commonly called a ‘redbrick’ university, and the term ‘new’ university usually refers to “Post-1992 universities formerly designated Polytechnics”.</p>

<p>Bristol and Leeds are not Oxford and Cambridge, but ‘tier II’ may be a little mean.</p>

<p>My D applied and got in but decided to stay in the U.S. for undergrad for various reasons. The small charter school she attended for HS did not offer IB or AP, but she self-studied and got the multiple 5’s thing. I suspect that the SAT scores mattered quite a bit - she tests quite well - and I think it mattered that she sought out and took additional SAT’s in the subject area she was interested in, those tests went well too. She did quite a bit of research into what school she wanted to apply to, contacted people there (through friends of friends) in her field of study. My impression was that they do interview a lot of the people who apply. The interview was much easier than she thought it would be. On the Oxford and Cambridge websites there are or were a number of videos with mock interviews and the like. So, all in all, none of it was unexpected.</p>

<p>Good luck to your kid. Don’t forget, too, that there’s always the chance of the UK for grad school.</p>

<p>Thank you all for your responses.</p>

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<p>Does paying property taxes count, or are you talking about income tax here?</p>

<p>Which Oxford/Cambridge colleges are considered strongest for sciences and/or computer science? Is there even a computer science major at these schools? Thanks for the info.</p>

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<p>Have you ever been to the UK in the last 20 years? Cowley Road Oxford for example is one of the most diverse places I have ever come across anywhere. I am not saying there is zero racisim in the UK. There can be racisim anywhere. But I think that quoted above is an extreme exaggeration for which there is no evidence.</p>

<p>The UK has NEVER had institutioinalised segregation on the level on the US past at any time in history. Anyone can sit anywhere on a bus for example, and always has been able to.</p>

<p>(also Oxford football team has been relegated to the conference)</p>

<p>

I linked both university websites above. Feel free to click on them. You can also google UK league tables.</p>

<p>Kelowna, I’m pretty sure it must be income taxes–just as in the U.S., owning property in a state does not make you a resident and entitle you to instate tuition, in the EU you must demonstrate legal residency.</p>

<p><a href=“http://www.admin.ox.ac.uk/eop/raceq/racereport2009.pdf[/url]”>http://www.admin.ox.ac.uk/eop/raceq/racereport2009.pdf&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;

<p>the numbers for racial/ethnic diversity are not impressive by comparison to comparable US colleges; having visited, my sense was that it was predominantly ethnically white - and unlike the US, they are mostly of English ancestry, not of mixed European white origin. The colleges are, though, attempting to be recruit and retain a more diverse student body, including economic diversity.</p>

<p>The Norrington Tables are an “interesting” ranking for academics, but in no way do they represent either desirability or selectivity. My own college (Worcester) is never higher than middlin’, but has the highest number of applicants (and, I believe, highest number of applicants rejected.)</p>