<p>And why in the world should the female types "pick a side" we are a bit more complex than that, thank you very much</p>
<p>We can be strong and soft, at the same time, imagine that</p>
<p>
[quote]
It's true of basically ever woman I know.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>With your attitude toward gender roles, jason, no wonder different women don't associate with you.</p>
<p>In my household it depends on the task. I love to do anything outdooors including mowing the lawn. But I also love to cook/bake/sew. I'm also good with financial numbers, I managed my financial households, do my taxes, pick investments which supposedly a male thing.
However, my husband is great at indoors stuff like cleaning house and working the cars which I don't like. If I'm not married and my car breaks down I would call AAA. Modern day convenience.
Yes I did learn how to change a tire and brakes but I don't like to do them. I need to keep my perfectly manicured hands intact.(:-)</p>
<p>That's mean, Mallomar. If you met me, you'd think I was the nicest guy you'd ever met.</p>
<p>But I know what I'm saying.</p>
<p>In a way, you are right... I would much prefer to have a guy change my tire than do it myself. However, this has nothing to do with how capable I (or all women) are at performing typically "male" jobs. We just know it's extremely easy to get someone to do it for us, so why bother? I mean honestly, who is the smarter woman... the one who struggles to change a tire to prove her equality or the one who calls a friend and gets to sit and watch the tire being changed?</p>
<p>I would consider myself a feminist, but at the same time I'm not above accepting favors or the good things that come out of being a pretty girl in today's society. If I have to put up with all the bad parts of being a girl (worries about safety, lower income, double standards, etc.) then why can't I enjoy the benefits?</p>
<p>So Jason, I was totally trying to "be on your side" or whatever, saying that you are making some generalizations but there is a lot of hypocracy in our culure and society today...</p>
<p>but...</p>
<p>the last few posts you made me really think that you're a bit sexist. No matter how many times you say that your not, you are. You're classifying a whole group of people (classification: first step to genocide! AH!)</p>
<p>There are plenty of women in this world who can change a tire and do things that "men only do" better than men themselves. Theres also plently of men in this world who can do things the "women only do" better than women. You must hang out with some serious bimbos if you know of know woman who can do things that men can do. You're making a COMPLETE generalization.</p>
<p>YES there is hypocricy in our nation and culture.
NO it's not "every woman" who is this way.</p>
<p>BTW I'm a girl and I've helped my guy friend change a tire because he was confused and I had to go help him out. Look at that!</p>
<p>AND GRIM, you make an excellent point.</p>
<p>Have you noticed that a lot of the things you've mentioned rely on physical strength? I know, process-wise, how to change a flat tire, but damned if I'd be able to physically do it if I ever had to. Same with why I'm going to try to enlist some male classmates to help me move out...I doubt I'll be able to carry pieces of furniture that weigh more than I do down 2 flights of stairs by myself. That's nowhere near the same as something like vacuuming the carpet, which doesn't require any special physical strength. And for the record, my dad helps with householdy things sometimes, and my mom helps with mowing the lawn sometimes and nobody has any sort of problem with this. You could always stop doing favors for people, if it bothers you so much that they ask.</p>
<p>I don't think anyone who complains that men get the short end of the stick can be taken seriously on gender issues. </p>
<p>FWIW, I'm a woman, I can and have changed a flat or two, I would never be so dumb as to leave my lights on so the battery runs out, I can and do change the oil in my car, I mow the lawn, I do most of our household repairs... of course you are generalizing. I'm not pretty so I've never enjoyed the so-called benefits of having other people do stuff for me, but I get a lot of satisfaction out of doing things for myself, so I don't really see that as a benefit.</p>
<p>
[quote]
There are plenty of women in this world who can change a tire and do things that "men only do" better than men themselves. Theres also plently of men in this world who can do things the "women only do" better than women. You must hang out with some serious bimbos if you know of know woman who can do things that men can do. You're making a COMPLETE generalization.</p>
<p>YES there is hypocricy in our nation and culture.
NO it's not "every woman" who is this way.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>Hey, you callin' my mom a bimbo?! LOL.</p>
<p>But seriously, don't assume that I assume no woman can do the things I listed. I'm not saying that at all. And seriously, out of my family, the only girl who could change a tire is my mother. My aunt and sisters? Nuh-uh. I have about six girls I'd consider friends, and all of them have said in so many words they would rather a guy do some of those things than do them themselves...because they don't know how.</p>
<p>It's a generalization, but it's nothing hostile. I don't think women are beneath me because of their limitations. But at the same time, it irks me when I see and hear women being all "I am woman, hear me ROOOOAR!" yet they defer all the stuff they don't want to do to a man. You can't have it both ways. My philosophy is I'll help someone who is in need...someone who needs me to do something they can't do. But if you're my equal and you can do it, you just odn't want to, I don't want to waste my time helping you.</p>
<p>That's fair, right?</p>
<p>
[quote]
You could always stop doing favors for people, if it bothers you so much that they ask.
[/quote]
</p>
<p>You were doing fine until you got to the end, BlahDeBlah. I'd help her again. It's the kind of guy I am. I'm not complaining about helping, but see above. My thing is, I don't like the idea that we chastise someone for something that we use to our advantage. Take your example. Would you chastise and put down a guy who spends a lot of time at the gym pumping iron and call him a Meathead? Then, when you're ready to move, he's the first guy you ask? Doesn't seem fair, does it?</p>
<p>You can't say, "I'm a victim. I need a gun. But I want to you pull the trigger if I ever need to use it. I don't want my hands dirty."</p>
<p>
[QUOTE]
I don't think anyone who complains that men get the short end of the stick can be taken seriously on gender issues.
[/QUOTE]
</p>
<p>Nobody is going to call you a sexist, though. I can sit here and explain myself all day, and still be labeled. You make that one comment, and I bet we won't hear that word mentioned once in response.</p>
<p>
[quote]
You were doing fine until you got to the end, BlahDeBlah. I'd help her again. It's the kind of guy I am. I'm not complaining about helping, but see above. My thing is, I don't like the idea that we chastise someone for something that we use to our advantage. Take your example. Would you chastise and put down a guy who spends a lot of time at the gym pumping iron and call him a Meathead? Then, when you're ready to move, he's the first guy you ask? Doesn't seem fair, does it?
[/quote]
</p>
<p>I don't make fun of my friends and I don't ask people who aren't my friends for favors, so no, I wouldn't be doing that. But I don't really understand what you're getting at...it just seems like you want another reason to make negative generalizations about women and keep everyone confined to stereotypical gender roles. </p>
<p>Aren't there things you don't know how to do? If you wanted help with doing them, wouldn't you ask someone who did know? If like 90% of the people who do know happen to be of the opposite gender, so friggin' what? Why do you have to make everything into a battle of the sexes? Why do you care so much?</p>
<p>See, you've asked me why it seems I "target" you, BlahDeBlah. Now I can ask you the same thing.</p>
<p>First of all, and I've told you this before, it was an example. Why is it so hard for you to get over yourself and see something from someone elses point of view? Or, in this case, go along with an obvious analogy. And stop trying to infer so much into what my ulterior motives are. You're not wise or experienced enough for that.</p>
<p>Second, you need to read what I said...again. That much is obvious. What I'm talking about is girls who want to be traditional in some cases, and modern in others. Some of it is natural, I know. But don't say, "I'm a girl and I need you, a man, to help me" in one breath and then, "just because I'm a girl I don't need your help! I can do things on my own, thank you" in the next. It's HYPOCRITICAL to try and reap the benefits of traditionalism and modernism. </p>
<p>Yes, some guys do it, too. Like when men want a lady in the street and a whore in bed. </p>
<p>Third, don't ask me why I'm so overly concerned with this topic. Every time a post like this comes up, I can always count on your input...often times before my own. It's a subject of interest to me, as it is to you. Do I question your participation? No. So don't question mine.</p>
<p>Well I don't think you have a very good "argument" or anything to really get mad at. There are not many people who are completely traditional, nor many people who are completely modern. At all. It's all in the eye of the beholder. For instance, you seem to have a very strong idea of what modernism and tradionalism is to you and to you, they're extreme opposites. Some people may find them to be close; modernism and traditionalism don't have to be enemies of each other. </p>
<p>I don't agree with your argument that you hate when girls say "IM WOMAN HERE ME ROAR" but when they need something, they go to a man. 1) they don't always go to a man 2) do you also hate when men say "IM MAN HEAR ME ROAR" when there are plenty of things men can't do, or go to a woman to do.</p>
<p>looks to me like you don't really have much of a reason to complain. In society today, "extremes" are frowned upon. Since no woman is really "extreme" (traditional or modern) nor is any man really "extreme" than there is no point in your argument or your post.</p>