Yes! @BenKlesc do you mind having the mods combine your two threads since they are essentially the same topic?
@skieurope (I can’t remember the general mod tag so randomly tagging a mod. Lucky you, ski 
)
I closed the other thread directing any future responses onto this thread. Since the merge function is not ideal, this is the best solution
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Prerequisites differ from school to school. I would check the prerequisites from each, before applying. Oral surgery is a dental specialty, and the prerequisite requirements are usually slightly less in dental than medical school. That may be a good strategy if oral surgery interests you.
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If you want to take a look at what the DAT tests–here’s link to a bunch of free practice questions.
The DAT has 4 sections:
- natural science (bio, gen chem, ochem/biochem)
- perceptual ability
- reading comprehension
- quantitive reasoning (mathematics)
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Thank you! It was getting confusing.
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That sort of stuck a fork in my idea for my connection with the doctor who worked on me. So if I want to eventually become an oral and maxillofacial surgeon, does that require med school as well? Why only general dentists, and appreciate all of the explanations you are providing.
Thanks! So you don’t need med school to be an oral surgeon? My oral surgeon who pulled my impacted wisdom teeth has both a DMD and MD and went to both.
There are two different routes to OMFS, but both start out the same
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earn DDS or DMD then enroll in a 4 year hospital-based residency training program that includes 1 year of general surgery residency. There are 54 single degree programs
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earn DDS or DMD then enroll in a 6 year program that begins with earning a MD (2years), followed by 4 years of hospital-based residency training, including 1 year of general surgery residency. There are 46 dual degree programs
So whether you’ll earn a MD along the way depends on what post-grad programs you’re accepted into.
Most OMFS grads go on to do a 2 year fellowship following completion of their residency.
Fellowship areas include:
- Head and neck cancer – microvascular reconstruction.
- Cosmetic facial surgery (facelift, rhinoplasty, etc.).
- Craniofacial surgery and pediatric maxillofacial surgery (cleft lip and palate repair, surgery for craniosynostosis, etc.).
- Cranio-maxillofacial trauma (soft tissue and skeletal injuries to the face, head and neck).
So the total length of training for a OMFS surgeon is 8-12 years post bachelor’s.
Why only general dentists?
Because very, very few dental grads go into specialty training programs and dental schools want individuals planning to attend dental school to understand what the life of a general dentist is like because they will most likely end up in general dentistry.
Each of 100 OMFS residencies in the US only accept 2-4 students/year. And 10 of those OMFS residency programs are operated by the US military and only accept military dentists into their programs.
There are about 6200 new dentists graduating every year and there are only ~225 non-military OMFS residency positions. You need to the absolute best of the best to be considered for OMFS.
Additionally, other dental residency programs (like orthodontics, prosthodontics, endodontics, periodontics, etc) require the resident to pay tuition to attend the 2-3 year long programs. Tuition runs in the $120K-$250K/year range and residents are not paid during residency. Many young dentists already in tremendous debt from dental school cannot afford to go to specialty training.
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Wow. This particular OMFS is also a vet. Interesting.
Well, there is nothing wrong general dentistry I guess. I honestly underestimated how selective it is to get into these careers. I assumed because of labor shortage there is a high demand.
So, would any of you not recommend shadowing an OMFS this Summer?
In my opinion… med and dental schools have become more selective in recent years. The particular OMFS that I know, graduated in the class of 78. He’s in his 70s.
The acceptance rates of med schools in that era were a lot higher than they are today. I guess that is irrelevant though to the conversation. Looks like I will most likely be preparing to be a general dentist. If… I choose that route and if I could even get in.
Actually that’s not true about med school acceptance rates being higher in the past.
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In the mid 1970s, med school acceptance rates were actually lower than they are today. Acceptance rates were in the low 30% range ( see TABLE 1 in Medical Education and Societal Needs: A Planning Report for the Health Professions.) Not since prior to 1963 has the med school admission rate been above 50%. Med school admission rates have been remarkably stable for the last 50 years.
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The number of available seats for first year MD students has increased by 38% since 2002-2003; the number of available DO seats has increased faster. Osteopathic med school enrollment is increasing at the rate of 4.2%/year. 3-4 new med schools open every year.
More people are being accepted into med school than any other time in history, however, the difficulty and competitiveness of gaining an admission has not changed much over time because more people are applying, especially people who were not particularly welcomed into med schools in the past (women, people of color).
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I understand what you mean
I was reading this from a few commenters…
“A testament to how crazy competitive dentistry has gotten as a whole. The OMFS I shadowed prior to starting dental school flunked out of undergraduate his first go around. He went on to start a family and went back to undergrad where he did very well and got into UAB’s dental program. From there he finished up and then went into OMFS, but I find it hard to believe that something like that would happen today.”
Now they consider your undergrad GPA. Darn.
Some more great advice…
"I’m a dental student right now in the HPSP program and am talking about OMFS stuff to my chain of command. Ultimately just get into dental school (aim for a 3.5 GPA plus and a DAT score of atleast 20; mine was a 3.3 with a DAT of 21) and then excel as much as you can
Civilian OMFS is VERY hard to achieve (think top 20-10% of class). Military OMFS is much easier (think top 50% of class) to the point where we don’t even need to take the standard application test to get in. Honestly, get into dental school and worry about OMFS after; that is the biggest hurdle"
Well looks like I will just focus first on getting into dental. If that ever happens, maintaining GPA. I should not even be thinking of specialties right now.
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Professional schools have always considered your GPA.
It’s possible for someone to flunk out of schools, take some time off to ‘grow up’ and get their priorities straight, go back to school and get accepted to med or dental school. It happens all the time. It’s called reinvention.
Individuals who have been out of school for several years, had another career, then go back to school and excel are looked at differently by adcomms than more traditional students. Not all school reward reinvention, but some do. Particularly if the applicant has a good narrative to go with their renewed academic efforts and has shown excellence in academics, standardized test scores, ECs and leadership since they started back to school. This is not to say that one’s prior bad grades are ignored, but some adcomms at some schools may place less weight on them.
There are also specialized programs for med and dental hopefuls who do not have the grades it takes to get into professional school. For med school aspirants, there are Special Master’s Programs. SMP students take coursework that mimics the pace and difficulty of the first year of medical school to prove they have the academic skills, stamina and determination to succeed in med school. For dental school, there are Master’s in Oral Biology programs that serve the same purpose.
SMPs and Oral Bio programs are high risk/high reward. Do well in the program, finish in top 25% of your class with GPA ⪰ 3.7 and you have a 50-50 chance of getting accepted into professional school. Finish outside of the top 25% or get a GPA <3.5–and you’ve permanently killed any chance of a professional school admission.
Residency directors aren’t the least bit interested in what your undergrad grades looked like; they only care about your med/dental school grades, your board scores, your recommendations from your med/dental school, your research & publications, and how well you will fit in with their program.
This is absolutely correct.
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Masters in oral bio sounds intriguing. In community college I had like a 2.5 GPA. I returned to online school to complete bachelors and have a 3.9 GPA. In theory… I could complete my bachelors at SNHU, and then do a masters program at a real college. At that point if I have a masters, I believe my undergrad will matter much less. Especially since I have 6 months to graduate, I would prefer not to switch schools in the middle of undergrad if I can just get a masters.
Ah…but what you don’t tell is what he did between that and when he eventually went back and got his undergrad degree. For all we know, he went to Harvard in person and had a 4.0 GPA.
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Right…and do the things you need to do to be a favorable applicant.
And have a plan B.
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As noted above, unless you are doing a special masters program, medical schools won’t consider masters level courses.
I don’t know about dental schools.
You had stated before that you have 3 semesters left. That’s not 6 months.
You wrote this:
I have two semesters left. Then I get my bachelors of science, with focus in wetlands and conservation (environmental science) from SNHU online school
When exactly will you be graduating from undergrad school?
I think you are either misunderstanding or being very cavalier about these programs. Maybe both.
MSOBs are very competitive for admission and accept only a small number of students each year. Some MSOBs only accept those who have completed or are concurrently enrolled in dental school. MSOB degree program are only offered at dental schools.
All MSOB programs require the completion of an original research thesis. (Do you have any hands on research lab experience?)
Boston U has one of more successful GPA enhancing pre-dental programs. It’s a 2 year program and costs $69K (tuition for the entire program, including summers)
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