<p>I disagree about pre-med. A lot of kids do get weeded out of premed, but the required classes for pre-med aren’t that terrible. You just have to get through Chem, Orgo, and Bio basically. Not terribly difficult to get a B average in those and you have all your other classes to bring up your GPA.</p>
<p>This topic of conversation comes up periodically: <a href=“http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-admissions/1151390-grade-deflation-vandy.html?highlight=deflation[/url]”>http://talk.collegeconfidential.com/college-admissions/1151390-grade-deflation-vandy.html?highlight=deflation</a> I agree with those who say it’s school- and major-dependent. I also agree with Vandy3023:
The professors were always enthusiastic about helping my daughter whenever she asked, either for guidance on a future assignment or pointing out how an exam could have been improved. My d enjoyed being a double major (poli sci and classical languages), and thought that the poli sci grading was more forgiving than the classics, econ, and math/science classes she took.</p>
<p>There’s great support at Vandy for students who seek it out, from faculty, administration (excellent advising for post-undergrad options) and other students (a cooperative, not cut-throat, atmosphere).</p>
<p>Avoiding “freshman follies” is key but you are only human. One of my son’s went to too many parties at Duke and had to drop his Calc class (goodbye 5 grand!) and retake it. Vandy son over-committed and majored in his extra curriculars of a much more serious nature on campus, and thought he could study the night before an exam like in high school. (hello summer school@!) The key is to have a serious talk with your student re they are in charge of facing reality as a semester wears on. If illness, poor social decisions or too many weekend trips for a school activity have resulted in a class with a bad grade that will not be possible to rectify, there are options. First, your son or daughter has to learn their limitations and change their lifestyle to fit them…very difficult as all our kids that make it into Vandy were “perfect” learners who worked very hard in high school. But they will be staying up very very late now and their social lives are challenging to figure out for each of them.<br>
At Duke you are allowed to drop ONCE if you do it in the correct Drop Add period and if you have a reasoned response to the reality that your performance and preparation for a class is subpar. Then you have to go to the academic dean and state your reasons, goals and remedial plan. This is a humbling experience for people with 4.0s in high school. Our son probably learned a lot from making these appointments and sucking it up re a big fat OOPS. You don’t get extra points in college for doing your homework, raising your hand, etc. You have to get real about the grades on exams and papers. </p>
<p>Vandy son dropped a class which put him on academic probation since he was below the required hours for a full time student. He had no intention of taking that science class again but he did go to summer session and take a new science. You can also overload a semester to make up for a semester when you goofed up but you will be held accountable by your advisors for your response and your addressing your own problems. It is your job to watch Drop Add deadlines carefully and to make sure you are getting your hours done properly in all categories.</p>
<p>Important to note for those who will take courses at Vandy. Vandy has what I think is an exceptionally sane approach to the problem of classes that must be mastered for career paths. You can for instance, take Organic twice. Yep. Not at Duke but yes at Vandy. Your Bad grade stays on your transcript! But it won’t go into your GPR. This is a safety net approach to excellent students who have different problems the first round in a required class in any department. Again you will be seeing an academic dean if you are permitted to do this and you will be seeing your advisor. But I think this is a great policy. Why discourage people in science, math, engineering? Everyone comes with different readiness and everyone hits their social scene differently. Again, Vandy does not allow abuse of this privilege but it is worth noting.</p>
<p>Vanderbilt does have grade deflation - but if you work hard you should be fine. Also, check out Ratemyprofessor to get feedback on teachers.</p>
<p>Sorry for hijacking this thread lenny2! Thank you guys for your responses. I think I’m pretty sure now that I’ll be going in as a poli sci major on the pre-med track. Poli sci seems to be a little more manageable GPA-wise, and I’m quite interested in it. I’m really going in with the mindset to work hard and to keep grades the first priority. I’m gonna rush for Greek life, but I’ll make sure it doesn’t get in the way of studying as much as possible. So what do you guys think? Is this plan manageable? Is poli sci at Vandy a little more forgiving than science/math majors?</p>
<p>Sounds good to me. Poli Sci will be no where near as challenging as a hard science or math major/minor. One other suggestion I’d throw in there is to investigate taking a science course over the summer. I know you have to take Bio/Chem/Orgo/Physics within 3 years to be prepared for the MCAT (and med school admissions in general) meaning that 1 of those years you have to take two sciences courses at a time (each are composed of part a & b). It might be wise to take whichever one you feel might be the most challenging at a state school in your hometown over the summer and just make sure the credits transfer.</p>
<p>I’ll probably take Orgo or Physics next summer (after my freshman year) so that I will gain some college-class experience and know, beforehand, what to expect of difficult science classes. Should I try and knock out Bio freshman year? Are the Poli Sci classes ridiculously hard to get A’s in?</p>
<p>Polisci classes are not particularly difficult. As are not hard to come by.</p>
<p>Most pre-meds knock out Chem their freshman year and take Bio later. I don’t know anything about this “within 3 years” rule. You’re going to review it all for MCAT anyway.</p>
<p>As far as summer courses, either take them at Vandy or make sure the credit will transfer before you take it. Vandy doesn’t take credit from anywhere. Taking these courses like Orgo and Physics over the summer is a great way to get it off your GPA though.</p>
<p>It’s not a rule to have it finished within 3 years, but you will need to know all the stuff covered in those classes by the end of your junior year to be prepared for the MCAT. It just makes sense to have college training in all those courses before you attempt the MCAT which is why I said having it finished within 3 years is what he/she should be shooting for. </p>
<p>I’d suggest taking Chemistry freshman year as well. It’s pretty much a rite of passage for freshman in my opinion and a lot of freshman go through it. I remember when I was a freshman and almost my entire hall was studying at the same time before the test and we walked over in groups for the late night test (started at 7pm in Stevenson). It was actually kind of fun because so many people were going through the same thing together, ah nostalgia, mastering chemistry sucked though, but you’ll learn more about that when you get here.</p>
<p>D is a non-science major and still has to take 2 more math/science courses for AXLE. Any suggestions for easy/fun ones that won’t kill her GPA? She took the “easy” calculus and got an A, but I doubt that more calculus would be a good idea. </p>
<p>Regarding political science, those classes are not easy As (at least not the introductory ones). Many are graded by TAs, and Bs and Cs are common.</p>
<p>Also, I should mention that one of the science/math courses must include a lab. What would be a good, fun choice for a non-science person?</p>
<p>I agree with lenny2 re: grades in poli sci. Oppenheimer loves to give 86-89 on papers. Ratemyprofessor will back me up on that. He grades the papers/tests if the class size is manageable–like Legislative Process. S was just in a 100 level class with 300 people. taught by Oppenheimer and Clinton. He took it this year because it’s only offered election years–and he thinks Oppenheimer is a gifted teacher. The TA’s grade the papers in huge classes such as this. I can think of one poli sci class in which S received a straight A, and that was Nacol’s class, Democratic Theory. She is on leave at Cornell this year but will be back next year. She got the Undergraduate Teaching Award last year and is an amazing teacher. She puts a page of typewritten comments with your first draft and allows you to rewrite. Moreover, she is interesting. You will have to have one political theory class, and I highly recommend her. S has never gotten a B in a poli sci class, so he has gotten all A-'s and B+'s in poli sci with the one A in Nacol’s class. I hope this helps, persiandad. I commend you for thinking this all out before you even meet with an advisor. It helps to have a plan, especially when you are headed to medical school using such an interesting route.
lenny2: S loved Oceanography with Goodbred and he doesn’t think of himself as a science person. He thought the lab was great; however, someone’s daughter on here HATED Oceanography, the lab, and everything about it. I think S liked it because it was so much like AP Environmental Science which he took as a senior in high school. He regarded it as an easy A, and that made up for Vanderbilt’s not giving him credit for that particular AP credit.</p>
<p>Lenny:Probably the best science class for non-science people off the top of my head would be Catania’s neuroethology class (I took the seminar for a major seminar requirement, but talking to someone in the full class it seems the lecture content is largely the same). The class tours different animal sensory systems and their relation to behavior. It’s essentially a live national geographic/discovery channel special every lecture (though the seminar was structured as a discussion), and Catania’s a wonderful teacher and very engaging (and very smart – eg, he got a macarthur genius grant a few years ago). He also brings in animals (he brought in baby alligators and eggs for us to watch hatch, owls, hawks, an opossum, etc.), which is awesome.</p>
<p>Otherwise just go with prior interest/rmp. I might love, say, virology, but if your kid’s science interests lie in cosmology or something that’s what they should take.</p>
<p>Persian:Orgo’s a bit rough (went in expecting to be able to dick off and get by and got destroyed first semester + lots of people retake it and the retakers tend to screw up the curve for the first timers), so if you take any summer class I’d take that one. Physics was obnoxiously easy at Vandy.</p>
<p>Lenny2–Geology (aka rocks for jocks) was the lab class of choice “back in the day” to fulfill the science requirement for those who were not serious science students. Don’t know if that is still the case; that neuroethology class mooodrets mentioned sounds more fun.</p>
<p>Just learning about grade deflation at Vandy…my D1 got her first A- ever this semester. she also got an a+… no credit for the a+, but no perfect GPA anymore! She is going to take physics over the summer at a local U.
My middle is going to join her sister in the fall, and they’re already planning on what to take together to optimize each others strengths for studying purposes!
One more thing, a VERY dear friend graduated from Vandy last May. He’s now at Wake Forrest for med school. He started at a state flagship school, stellar straight A’s. Transferred to Vandy, and had to study, study study…but said the B’s and C’s he got at Vanderbilt he was more proud of than any A he got at his other school. He also said that after his first semester of med school, he was more prepared than his classmates at Wake, and has one of the highest GPA 's in the class. So if your end goal is med school… Vandy will prepare you for the rigors of med school!</p>
<p>Anybody know anything about neuroscience?
I’ve heard its one of the more taxing majors…</p>
<p>I’m likely going to be a neuro major! Neurosciece at Vanderbilt requires around 70 hours of classes whereas most majors only require around 40 or fewer hours. For the major, you will need a year of calculus, general bio, physics, chemistry, and organic chem. In addition, you will take intro to neuro, 2 molecular neuro classes, 2 systems neuro classes, 2 other neuro classes, 2 related classes (psych or higher level science), and 4 hours of research. Overall, the classes are similar to classes in the bio or psych department depending upon what you want from the major. It can be very science intensive or more social science based. However, it’s an intense major for everyone because of the built in premed requirements. If you have any other questions, you can contact me. </p>
<p>About grade deflation. I’d say it definitely is present. My friends and I at had around 3.5s this semester with B range grades in the “weed-out” classes and As in the other classes. However, a lot of people I know make A-s or B+s in writing/humanities classes too. Quite a few people from my high school that struggled in AP classes have 4.0s at various state universities, so it’s definitely harder to have a high GPA at universities with stronger student bodies. However, I love it at Vanderbilt and feel like my Bs here were worth more than any As I’ve made at high school or other colleges.</p>
<p>There is grade deflation at Vandy?</p>
<p>A good friend of mine is pulling 3.8 something GPA double majoring in Economics and Engineering. He must be smarter than we thought :/</p>
<p>Easy A for math credit is Logic.</p>
<p>Moonpie - Will Vanderbilt accept the Physics class your child is taking at a local University this summer? I had been told they were very strict about accepting units that were taken after high school.</p>