Grade retention in 8th grade

<p>@michigan, physics is certainly not required to graduate at our school. Algebra2 is not even required, and you would need algebra2 at the minimum to take physics. There are other options (eg. earth science) which can be used in place of physics to satisfy the 3 years of science required.</p>

<p>Horrible idea.</p>

<p>As long a the student is taking (nearly) the most challenging courses available to him, they will have a fair chance at any school they apply to. I say nearly because you seem like you are little over the top and no school is going to care if a student has opted to take a couple of “easier” classes that are more interesting to them instead of trying to cram in every possible AP.</p>

<p>Wow in Georgia they have to have 4 years of science and 4 years of math. Although there are three different math tracks. I think Precalc is required to graduate although they may call it something else.</p>

<p>Same in Michigan - 3 math tracks (general, college prep, advanced)</p>

<p>Some further thoughts on the APs.</p>

<p>Most of the APs are not even close to equivalent of the equivalent content at elite universities. Outside of AP Calc BC, I would not advise anyone to take AP credit for any course in their major, regardless of score. If the course in an important pre-requisite, they will be much better off declining the AP credits and taking the class in college.</p>

<p>As for senior year math classes, unless your son is entering a major that doesn’t use calculus, I would advise taking a calculus based math class senior year. One year of calculus is not long enough time for a student to master and retain the techniques if they subsequently take a year away from using calc.</p>

<p>@Dreadpirit, I agree he should definitely do BC. Regarding your last statement, that’s an overgeneralization. I finished my year of calculus early in high school and then after a 2 year gap resumed some college math classes with no difficulty at all.</p>

<p>Following the recommendations of the dean & guidance personnel (essentially, “Don’t worry about AP courses”), expatSon took only the AP course in which he was interested, Environmental Science, in his senior year.</p>

<p>As far as we can tell, a lack of AP courses hasn’t impacted his college acceptances (he’s currently 4 for 6 – all what I’d describe as ‘match’ schools).</p>

<p>In our school district, many students will naturally take bio -> chemistry -> AP bio -> AP chem although physics is available in Junior. I believe it is too late to study Physics since they are busy on SAT1.</p>

<p>When I talked about retention, my plan is to keep my son in 8th grade in school record but he can take Geometry in middle school and some selective classes like performance, and even take some classes from high schools with his friends. To extend 4 yrs HS to 5 yrs, it may help him if he wants to study physics honor/AP in school.</p>

<p>BTW, my son is not in the advanced track since the math exam was taken in the beginning of 5th grade. It is normal to a young boy since he is not mature enough to enter the advanced class at that moment. But it is ridiculous that test can determine if students can study Geometry in 8th grade</p>

<p>WZG- if your son is typical, he will be done with HS (mentally and socially) by the end of Junior year. Please don’t hold him back in order for him to take AP Physics. You will win the battle but lose the war. Having him take a four year HS curriculum and spread it out over 5 years will NOT signal to college adcom’s “hey this is a talented, hard working kid”. There is not a single AP class which is worth spending an extra minute in HS for. Virtually every college in America will teach an entry level physics class more comprehensively than even the best HS AP.</p>

<p>My son had friends at MIT who were Physics majors who ended up taking plain vanilla Freshman physics (the beginning sequence) their Freshman year. Even scoring a 5 on the AP doesn’t necessarily mean you can handle the next physics class in the sequence, depending on who taught the class and how rigorous the prep was, AND how deep the calculus background of the class was when beginning HS physics.</p>

<p>Your plan is a terrible one- not to be cruel- but it is a terrible idea. Your son is so young for you to be tying yourself up in knots over college admissions. Take him to the library tonight when he gets home from school and you two can pick out a couple of books for you to read and enjoy (and discuss afterwards). That is better for him than staying in 8th grade for one second more than he has to!</p>

<p>OP, your son is very bright, whether or not he is on the advanced track. I can tell you from personal experience as the parent of a very bright young man that holding your son back for an entire year to meet some imaginary list of subjects that he MUST TAKE or never get into the “right” college that it would be a horrible mistake. Most kids who take an extra year to graduate do it because they are BEHIND in achievement, not highly capable! Your son will be bored silly and may begin to act out or cut classes or worse. </p>

<p>I doubt your school will even allow it, but if it does, colleges are likely to see it as your son being LESS able, not advanced.</p>

<p>Your best bet, if you really believe your son’s only track to success is taking every AP class your HS offers, is to take geometry outside of school and fight the school or district to get it counted. Or homeschool him in math only. There are many online, certified math classes out there.</p>

<p>Edit to say-I did not hold my son back, but my ex insisted on not challenging a school class placement and he was bored beyond words. He did not handle it well.</p>

<p>I’ll add that expatSon’s kindergarten teacher (who I believe walks on water) recommended that our son repeat kindergarten. </p>

<p>She may have been right, but we didn’t do it. My thinking then was, “If at some point it’s essential, we can do it – but I don’t see it as essential now, and we can never give him that year back.”</p>

<p>ExpatSon will start start college the week of (or the week after) his 18th birthday.</p>

<p>Some high schools will allow kids to take geometry and algebra II at the same time. Others will allow a summer school course. I’d look into both of those options before holding the kid back a grade.</p>

<p>I think taking both Physics B (now 2 years) and Physics C (typically a one-year sequence with two short exams) is a mistake. One or the other is sufficient, and the sequence will depend on the school.</p>

<p>It is indeed ‘silly’ for testing in 5th grade to set a path in math through their Sr year in hs. If your kid needs to move ahead the system fights against this until high school when generally here are many options to navigate this. As silly as it may be, it’s very common in many areas across the US. Your sons school is not an outlier in how they do this, or their reluctance to deviate from the path in middle school. Your proposed ‘course correction’ is a disaster. Parents who have ‘been there, done that’ have given you great advise both on ways to add the math class in 9th grade (same end result without the drastic step of retaining an advanced student), as well as practical ideas in working with kids gifted in these areas. </p>

<p>You say you’re listening. I can only hope you also hear what people are saying. You’re obviously a devoted parent who wants the best for their son, no one is questioning that.</p>

<p>Just a thought, can he take math or science from Duke/Johns Hopkins/Northwestern/local CC during the summer once he is in high school? </p>

<p>Our DD took honors chem during the summer after freshman year so that she could fit AP Chem in before senior year. Could your son do the same for math, possibly taking it online during the school year?</p>

<p>I think it is important to let kids onsite in classic classroom, especially for math and physics classes. I cannot image kids study them online or skip them and believe it will harm them in college. (except kids are really talent and can self-study everything)</p>

<p>I think it’s quite common for schools to track 5th graders for algebra-readiness. Our school would have allowed him into 7th grade algebra if he had excelled in 6th grade, regardless of the 5th grade placement decision. You mentioned a high SAT score, but is he excelling in his algebra class? Does he do Mathcounts and has he distinguished himself there in comparison to his peers at the school? You might have a little more influence with the school the better you can show he was placed too low for his ability.</p>

<p>@mathyone - just because it is possible, doesn’t mean it is a good idea for most people.</p>

<p>“I think it is important to let kids onsite in classic classroom, especially for math and physics classes. I cannot image kids study them online or skip them and believe it will harm them in college. (except kids are really talent and can self-study everything)”</p>

<p>Lots of kids do this very thing at our HS and are very successful in college - like above 4.0 GPA successful. If the issue is getting one more class out of the way for a highly capable student, then my suggestion is a legitimate option.</p>

<p>I guess my son’s math is top 10% in his school. He still has a big gap comparing with top 2%, who are in mathcount team. Their SAT1 math could be 750-800 in 7th grade.</p>

<p>@OP, if your son is talented enough and enthusiastic enough to handle the schedule you’ve proposed for him, then I don’t think an online or self-study class will be beyond him if he really wants to learn that material. And if you think that would be too much for him because he isn’t motivated enough, disciplined enough, smart enough, interested enough, or whatever, then perhaps you should also revisit your plans for his high school program. Is this something he can handle and will be happy with or is it just to satisfy parental ambition?</p>