<p>My son was by no means the top of his class in math, but he was motivated and disciplined. His 9th grade Alg teacher identified the first week he was terribly mis placed, and contacted us to discuss options for him. Second semester our son took Geometry online (so that was double time), working after school a few hours along with homework for his other 7 classes (inc several honors). He got As in both math classes, perfect scores on state exams, and the teacher recommended him for hon Alg2trig the following year. He was by no means the smartest kid in the class (far from it), but he works very hard. I’m sure your son works exceptionally hard, loves to learn, and would be fully capable of completing geometry online if that’s what he wanted to do. I’m not forcing the choice, I’m saying it is a very viable choice for motivated kids and doesn’t take Herculean efforts.</p>
<p>My 8th grader is also taking an online high school course this year on top of a full schedule. She has no interest in the topic but needs it to fill a requirement and stays motivated by the fact that this will allow her to pursue more of her many interests in high school.</p>
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<p>I think you should take a look at some on-line providers, in particular Stanford EPGY. My D (now a CS major in one of the top 10 universities) took many classes, including university-level math and physics, from EPGY. The work she did at EPGY has been helping her tremendously.</p>
<p>I think we’ve all (OP included) reached a consensus that leaving the kid back is a bad idea. The question now is what to do about the tracking situation, and my thoughts on that depend entirely on how satisfied your son is with his math offerings right now. If he is bored out of his mind and/or really upset about the idea of not taking the most advanced math courses a few years down the road, that’s a problem. But if he’s reasonably happy and challenged in class, don’t worry too much about whether or not he can get into an Ivy four or five years from now. Yes, he probably COULD cope with geometry next year, but the fact that he may not be on track to take a particular AP class isn’t going to keep him out of Harvard. Frankly, if you’re banking on him getting in on the basis of math skills, the fact that he’s not one of the best math students in his school is more of a problem than whether or not he takes every AP available. But this isn’t really a problem anyway, because there are loads of great schools out there and you can’t really predict what kinds of schools will be in your son’s range until he’s well into high school.</p>
<p>I do think that if the level of instruction isn’t appropriate, that’s worth fighting the school over, as it is silly that a test your son took in fifth grade is treated as an eternally reliable diagnostic. But even if the school won’t budge, it seems to me that you’re looking at the whole issue too narrowly. Yes, it would be ideal if your son’s current district offered everything you were looking for, but you do have the option of supplementing his classes with online enrichment courses or, if you’re looking for a classroom experience, by taking a course at a local college. </p>
<p>I’m also a little unclear on some of the facts here. If your son takes algebra II in 10th grade, as I assume he would be on track to do right now, is he taking the same class that the highest-track ninth graders take, or do they get Honors algebra II whereas he gets Regular algebra II? By senior year, can he take BC Calc, or is that only available to students who are in calculus as 11th graders? If it is simply a matter of taking a class a year later than he might have, that can be rectified by taking the very few courses he is losing out on by being “behind” elsewhere; if the tracking means he is consistently unable to EVER take the highest level courses, more drastic measures (although not retention) might be necessary assuming your son’s abilities, interests, and ambitions warrant them.</p>
<p>Keep in mind that kids today have a different relationship with communication online. It’s not something foreign to them. They don’t remember a time there wasn’t a search engine to find what they needed, friends to chat with, etc. Many elite brick and mortar universities are starting to experiment with online education with the birth is MOOCs several years ago. Some schools are trying hybrid courses to maximize ‘FaceTime’ with professors with students watching lectures online prior to class, then using class time for discussion. I don’t think online learning will ever replace being in a classroom but our kids aren’t uncomfortable with the medium and many will successfully integrate it into their hs and college experience. Online learning is not the enemy and it’s not going away.</p>
<p>Another school in district confirms he can take Geometry in summer for the coming 9th grader with their approval. So I have solution already considering I prefer to move home to that school.</p>
<p>In our HS, physics honor is available to >10th graders whose algebra 2/trig are ready. If he takes physics in 10th grade, he needs to take algebra 2/trig in 9th grade.</p>
<p>Well, you’re determined to push him into this plan you’ve devised-I hope it works out for you. You don’t mention if HE wants to do this! I just hope he doesn’t decide to major in music or art. Heaven knows what that would cause you to do!</p>
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<p>I do not agree with such generalizations. A better way to determine proper placement would be to try the college’s old final exams of the course that is allowed to be skipped with AP credit. That will give the student an idea of whether s/he knows the material from the college’s point of view.</p>
<p>Of course, if the course that is allowed to be skipped is only a peripheral requirement, rather than an important prerequisite to other courses (e.g. chemistry for some non-chemical engineering majors), then skipping it with AP credit is safe and allows the student to choose a free elective in its place.</p>
<p>I hate to kick the hornets nest…
Who is orchestrating this, you or your son? Yes, he may need assistance, but shouldn’t the choice of which science classes he takes, and when, how he steps up in math (doubling up, online, changing schools) be something he decides? I have found universally that students taking classes early, doubling up, even out of sequence by exception, are all very self directed, know what they want, what they are interested in, and the parents are merely facilitators. The students are usually convincing the parents, plan ready to go. Have you asked your son what he wants to do?</p>
<p>He super-likes science, especially physics. Math, he feels a little boring if I ask him do too much extra works. But he is a good boy in my eyes since he follows our guidance very well.</p>
<p>I would be cautious about pushing him when this isn’t his idea 
(if it isn’t…)</p>
<p>It is not clear to me why the math track is such a big problem.</p>
<p>It seems that the student’s current placement (algebra 1 in 8th grade) is already a year advanced compared to the normal track, and will have him complete calculus BC in high school (assuming that the high school offers calculus BC in one year instead of two). It just does not seem to be worth it to push him ahead another year.</p>
<p>Yes, if he lives and breathes math, high school math courses (even honors ones) may be too easy for him. But moving him another year ahead in the curriculum may not solve that. Perhaps other math activities outside the high school math curriculum may be of greater interest to him.</p>
<p>In terms of physics, his current math track should not stop him from taking high school physics of any type (including AP).</p>
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<p>Based on the prior posts, I have a reasonable guess as to which school system the OP is in, and if I’m right, the perceived issue boils down to this. The system sorts and accelerates kids in math on several different tracks starting very, very early on. Except for some truly gifted outliers, the top math students in the county wind up on a track where they start Algebra I in 7th grade and progress through to AP Calc as juniors (either AB or BC). At some HSs in the system, hardcore “STEM kids” can take MV Calc as their senior math class. Kids with appropriate grades in prior classes can take honors versions of the pre-AP classes even if they’re on the “slower” track (i.e., algebra in 8th grade). </p>
<p>The problem is that parents get very concerned that if their kids aren’t on the AP Calc by junior year track that they won’t be competitive for [INSERT YOUR OWN MAGICAL LIST OF COLLEGES HERE]. In the context of the system, that fear is not entirely unjustified, although it puts an unfortunate amount of pressure on the kids to track “correctly” in middle school. (Sixth grade math is a trail of tears for that reason.) </p>
<p>Others here far wiser than me have offered up some constructive suggestions on how to “level up” the OP’s child without sentencing him to another year of eighth grade without parole. But I’ll echo the thoughts about making sure that the kid really wants to go after this game plan.</p>
<p>@OP,</p>
<p>I would consider repeating a year only if your son switches schools. I think it will harm him socially not to progress to the next grade in the same school with his peers.</p>
<p>Here’s a secret: one reason the kids at the top private prep schools (Andover, Choate, Groton) seem so much smarter then their public school peers is that, on average, the prep school kids are older-- a significant percentage of them enter the prep school as “repeats”, i.e. they deliberately hold themselves back a year to give themselves a competitive advantage in admissions, in the classroom, on the athletic field. There are even double-repeats: kids deliberately held back 2 years!</p>
<p>It’s Academic Red-shirting, and the colleges are just fine with it. There is no stigma to repeat if you are a good student and do it deliberately to give yourself an extra year for the opportunity to take higher level courses.</p>
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<p>However, there are plenty of colleges good for physics (or its applied cousins of various kinds of engineering) that are not super-selective, so even if this were a concern (and assuming that the student is still really into physics in late high school or college), it is not like this problem will necessarily derail his path into physics.</p>
<p>You know that. And I know that. But I live in an area where many parents appear to believe that there are only 20 acceptable colleges and universities in the United States of America. (Hint: Our state flagship is not one of them.)</p>
<p>I haven’t had a chance to read the whole thread thoroughly but what strikes me is that in addition to the fact that there are lots of ways for the student to take the courses he wants throughout high school, there is the fact that this could be devastating for him socially.</p>
<p>All of his eighth grade friends go on to high school… And he stays behind.</p>
<p>The trash talk he will have to endure … This year and when he enters high school a year behind them.</p>
<p>And the students in the younger grade are unlikely to kill him with kindness either… They will tease him as well.</p>
<p>Why would you make him go through this just because you don’t like his math placement? Couldn’t he take an online class over one if his summers to catch up? Or take a class at the local community college?</p>
<p>Maybe if you are switching into a highly competitive prep school with very high academic standards that might work out. But the OP hasn’t mentioned anything about wanting to send his son to prep school or spend a ton of money on this. His son would probably end up bored in his other classes, which he’s been held back in, and might also find the social scene immature, because it’s not the older cohort he’s grown up with.</p>
<p>As I said before, I feel it is too late to study physics in 11th grade since they are too busy on SAT1. physics is the foundament of science and technologies. Even MCAT tests physics. I am good at physics. I believe an interactive (with teacher/classmates), classic, long term (>3 yrs) class/environment is necessary to learn physics in deep. Many foreign school physics is a 4 yrs class (3-4hours/week). Move math to fast track can give more room on his physics.</p>
<p>I have a son at a very good school (top 25), third year mechanical engineering, he took AP Physics his Sr year, and has done absolutely fine…in admissions and college. Great internships with national aerospace companies, deans list, happy as a clam, finishing in four years with a math minor. We couldn’t have asked more from him. </p>
<p>YOU may feel you want more time for physics instruction for your son, but this isn’t necessary for students to master concepts, for competitive admissions, or college readiness.</p>
<p>SATs are necessary but they should not be all consuming, and course selection certainly should not revolve around it.</p>