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This really doesn't matter, and I'm sure you realize this. You say that your generalization is smaller, but the degree of its smallness is subjective to you. The point is that you can't refute what I've said because it generalizes and then propose a "better argument" that still contains generalizations (and you do, see below).
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<p>I wasn't trying to refute your argument, I'm just saying it should be taken with a grain of salt, and my statement with probably a little more than a grain of salt. Since I'm more familiar with engineering professors I think it's somewhat reasonable to guess that Haas professors might be better on the whole, but I'm certainly not familiar with all departments at Berkeley, and I don't think you are either, so it's a much bigger stretch to say that Haas professors are more interesting than most other professors (in every department).</p>
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Generalize much? Haas professors conduct research and write papers too, and probably just as much. The Haas website has lots of info on research. The burden is on you to prove that they don't. You obviously are making assumptions in territory that you are not familiar with.
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<p>Really? A lot of Haas professors do consulting on the side, set up instructional programs with nearby school districts, or even visit other universities and teach there (and getting 6-digit incomes too). Haas's CED (Center of Executive Development) especially participates in a lot of these programs and have been expanding as of late. I've seen hundreds of contracts on this stuff although I don't have access to these records anymore and can't exactly scan them and show them to you, but don't start making assumptions that this is unfamiliar territory for me.</p>
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As an aside...I must say that as firax mentioned, you do this very much, whether it be about the research habits of Haas or the intelligence of people who are not engineering majors. And you seem to do this with a high level of seriousness, contrasted with my much more casual writing.
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<p>Actually, this is the first time I've mentioned the research habits of Haas on CC.</p>
<p>As for the intelligence of Berkeley students and Berkeley engineers, all I can say is that I've seen/talked to/know plenty of engineers, non-engineers, and mediocre students. Every student I can think of who's struggling in what I consider to be rather easy classes is not an engineer, and if you were to ask me to name the smartest undergrads I know at Berkeley, they all happen to be engineers. The ones who take the most courses, have the highest GPAs, understand the most difficult material easily. </p>
<p>Now I'm sure there are non-engineers who could come into an engineering class and kick the engineers' asses, but sadly I haven't seen or heard anything like that. In fact, non-engineers don't even take engineering classes because they're afraid of the difficulty level. Out of my Physics 7A discussion, 16 out of 20 students are engineers, and 2 are majoring in physics, and this isn't even an engineering class!</p>
<p>Now getting back to the point, I didn't write all this just to praise engineers and denounce all other students. My point is that I actually hate generalizing about this stuff as much as you do. I try to tell it as I see it, and unfortunately I haven't seen anything that's making me change me mind on the topic. I really wish I would, something other than "well there's GOTTA be a lot of really smart, high-achieving non-engineer students" but until I do, I'll keep making my generalization and hope that you'll see it for what it is and not take it too seriously or factually, because after all, it's only one person's opinion.</p>
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This is easily refuted by Berkeley's schedule of classes. As I've already mentioned, almost every Haas class is in double-digit waitlists. Haas students don't get put on the waitlist, but students in every other major do. These are not pre-Haas students, because the only Haas classes that accept sophomores are 101A and 101B. People outside of Haas are clearly interested in Haas classes and this is clearly more than a little problem.
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<p>Alright, I did what you said and went on Berkeley's Schedule of Classes. This is what I keep seeing from Haas classes:</p>
<p>Limit:130 Enrolled:22 Waitlist:27 Avail Seats:108</p>
<p>Now obviously, they're only waitlisting students to let the Haas students in first, and there's plenty of space in the class for Haas and non-Haas students. I realize that students are still nowhere near done with enrolling in classes, but the way you wrote it made it sound like the classes are all entirely full AND there's a double-digit waitlist, which clearly isn't the case.</p>
<p>Besides, these waitlists tend to be what...20-50 people long? And how many Haas classes are offered this semester? Maybe around 20? So at most you have a few hundred of students on these waitlists, out of about 20,000 undergrads at Berkeley. So about 98-99% of Berkeley's undergrads aren't even trying to get into them. Thus, I stand by what I said. If you're not in Haas, it's very likely that you won't try to get into Haas classes anyway.</p>