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<p>Amen to that! </p>
<p>Fortunately, the next 3 are boys who will be 1) less emotionally invested and 2) more open to suggestion. The first one has ALWAYS been difficult about everything, and made the others look easy in comparison. Once we get her settled, we’ll be golden when we go 'round again in 2 years!</p>
<p>Sometimes people refer to tree-hugging environmentalists, when they mean someone curious about environmental policy, involving the intersections of government, economics and natural resources. Subtopics include: land use management, zoning, wastewater treatment, biofuels, urban gardening, urban forestry. Urban schools can teach that effectively, with good field trips. Internships could occur in federal offices, state capitol buildings or city halls. I’m not saying this is what your daughter wants to study or do for her work, but only that it can be studied in urban settings.</p>
<p>I just went to a college review site and checked the student responses to NYU, Columbia, BU and W&M. Respondents are asked to give A-F grades to their school on the “Overall Experience.” The average “GPA” of the student ratings of Columbia was 3.51. BU was 3.57. NYU was 3.59. W&M was 3.91. Totally unscientific and inconclusive, but I was pretty sure that W&M was going to get the best reviews from among the four.</p>
<p>If she were my daughter, I would really push for William & Mary. You can’t beat the value as an in-state resident. </p>
<p>Perhaps you should get your daughter to read this thread just so she can see how the majority of posters here have such wonderful things to say about W&M. It may get her to reconsider her position.</p>
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Don’t know about the other schools, but W&M’s actual undergrad average GPA was 3.23 in Spring, 2010. So either some really brainy kids rated the school on that review site, or some kids who were having a lot of fun with it. :)</p>
<p>Years ago, we went to a program at W&M and one of the profs was working on some very interesting things in the wetlands around the Williamsburg region. Perhaps a visit there that includes some in depth visits with environmental profs might be helpful.</p>
<p>William and Mary has some association with VIMS (Virginia Institute of Marine Science) for graduate studies.</p>
<p>My prediction-- 4 years from now you and she will look back and laugh over this. She’ll be about to graduate from W&M, will have tons of friends and great relations with professors, and will say, “Why was I so fixated on New York?” Her stubbornness will have helped her land a great internship, she’ll have studied abroad. Right now she’s just had two hard knocks-- Columbia, and NYU $$. The gap year idea makes her crazy because she sees it as failure… In a few more weeks things will have changed markedly.</p>
<p>I’m thinking the “GPA” referred to above is a “grading” of the schools by students…NOT the GPA averages of the students who are taking classes there. In other words…as a total package…WM gets a “higher grade” than the others.</p>
<p>I personally think that VA has a LOT of wonderful instate public universities. WM is not the only one that could have been considered by this family…but that is water over the dam.</p>
<p>True, those of us from outside VA wish we had those options.</p>
<p>Seriously…I would let the college CHOICE discussion drop for now (other than to put NYU to rest as a no go). Any further discussion will sound like ramming WM down your daughter’s throat right now. Wait until there are some other acceptances so that you can talk about making a choice.</p>
<p>thumper, I understand what you are saying. The issue though may very well come down to finances. If William and Mary is the only instate school that was applied to and the cost of an instate school is all they can afford, the options may not really be there. It’s too late to apply to UVa,VT,etc . It sounds like Vanderbilt and BU are the only schools they’re waiting on and I would imagine that admission to Vanderbilt is tough and that merit aid may be limited there even if admitted? They really may have put themselves in a bind by having applied to such expensive private schools.</p>
<p>Sev…I agree with you…and at the end of the day…sometime at the end of April…a decision WILL have to be made. BUT right now…it is only going to sound like this student has ONE choice which is a place she really doesn’t want to talk about right now. Personally…I’d let the dust settle. When the final acceptances and aid are in…there will be more things to discuss, including the impact on finances.</p>
<p>I don’t recall that the family put price restrictions on this student’s college search. BUT if they did…there could be two schools in the mix…St Johns (let’s not discuss what WE think…it’s the student who is going to college) and WM (hopefully) that will be in the “affordable” bracket. Who knows…when the final decision time comes…this student could well decide that WM is a better choice than St. Johns.</p>
<p>What Thumper said was correct. The students rated their overall school experience an A, B, C, etc. and I just converted their ratings to a GPA for an average student rating. I would guess that the collegiate experience at W&M gets higher ratings because at the urban schools, you have students who may have been more enthusiastic about the city than the school they chose. At W&M it’s all about the school, which I think makes for a more cohesive and loyal student body.</p>
<p>“Oh no, William and Mary won’t do.” --from My Old School, Steely Dan Since it is now stuck in my head I thought I’d inflict it on you all too.</p>
<p>(The girl in that song insisted on Bard…the ‘old school’ in the song. Refrain-- ‘Oh I’m never going back to my old school.’)</p>
<p>^Thank you for that, Gwen Fairfax. I’ve had that song in my head all day.</p>
<p>OP, thanks for starting this thread. Each year, CC would get a couple of this type of stories. Last year, a family whose DD got into Rice in ED. After much struggle, they did not get the FA they were looking for. </p>
<p>This is why most of the students applied to a wide range of schools. The CC “rule of thumb” is that you need to apply to at least one safety that you want to attend. </p>
<p>At this stage, have you talked to NYU about the FA package yet? They might adjust if you give them so good reason. How far are you from having the needs met? </p>
<p>While I don’t understand why would anyone pick NYU for Environmental science. It is your DD’s dream school. I would do everything possible to let her have her dream.</p>
<p>DadII the op said that NYU gave them only loans. That means the family is on the hook for the full cost of attendance if their kiddo goes to NYU…about $55,000 a year. </p>
<p>The family seems to be looking for merit aid…not need based aid.</p>
<p>I would not allow one of my kids dreams make her and her sibs and my & H’s life turn into a nightmare, which is what happens when kids go to schools that are simply and totally unaffordable. OP said NYU only provided LOANS–how can that be anywhere near what the parents need for them to pay to make it affordable with 3 more kids to come?</p>
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<p>Even if it comes with a nightmare of debt?</p>