Harvard Hopeful

Student Lounge Hispanic Students
1

<p>Happy Holidays to all!</p>

<p>My son: Deferred and would like to know what he can do to enhance his app. in january for RD.</p>

<p>He is retaking SAT in Jan , hopeful to break 2000! ACT 29 not submitted
He will also contact baseball coach and request info on how to work on joining baseball team as walk-on ( not quite a recruit but very strong and dedicated player ( 8 years)</p>

<p>snapshot:</p>

<p>Male NY AA/Hisp (PR)
GPA 93/101 uw/w
Rank 6/399 top 2% (top MALE:))
SATI 1980 630 cr, 700 m, 650 w
SAT II 720 Physics, 710 WH
National Achievement Outstanding Participant
AP scholar with Distinction WH 5, Calc AB 5 Physics 4 USH 4 Comp/Lang 3
Senior APs Gov, Lit, Physics C, Calc B/C, Authertic Research (honors)
+Self Study Micro and Macro Economics ( not offered in school)
Community: Umpire, Library Childrens Room, Walkathons, Sandy Relief ( long island)
ECs: Travel baseball, Football, Track, Marching Band
Summer Howard Hughes Scholar Research Program 2010
College Course Summer 2011 CW Post
RIT Innovative Scholar 2012</p>

<p>Dream schools applied to: Harvard, Penn and Princeton</p>

<p>Other reaches: Brown, Yale, Cornell, Columbia, Dartmouth</p>

<p>Also: Notre Dame, Macauley CCNY, NYU</p>

<p>Safeties: Binghamton, St Johns, Hofstra, Fordham</p>

<p>Any advice on enhancements??? Thanks!</p>

2

<p>A higher SAT score would be helpful, particularly if the CR score is brought up above 700. With less than that threshold, all of the colleges in his reach categories will be concerned that a candidate will be able to be successful at their school.</p>

<p>I doubt that contacting the H coach will affect admissions, particularly as a walk-on.</p>

<p>If he gets any additional awards or recognition, that would definitely warrant updates to his schools.</p>

<p>I don’t know if it’s pertinent or not, but if he is self-studying econ for AP credit, that’s fine for later receiving college credit or placement, but it won’t affect his decisions if there’s no official recognition by his HS as he won’t take the tests until after the admissions process is over.</p>

3

<p>The self testing for AP Micro and Macro Econ was just mentioned to show his initiative in his approach to better himself as a possible business major. Do you know if Jan SATs would arrive in time for RD decisions?</p>

4

<p>If you’re talking about applying as a business major now, then like I said the only problem is some sort of documentation that he is actually self-studying in lieu of the listing of a course on his HS schedule, AP exam score, etc. If he could have it listed somehow officially (like as an Independent Study with a teacher) with his HS, that would help, otherwise, he is just saying he is self studying and it may carry little weight. If he is doing this for applying as a business major later in college, then that’s fine as he’ll have the AP test scores to demonstrate his work.</p>

<p>Schools vary on the latest tests they will take, so you need to go to the college websites or call. For instance, for H:</p>

<p>harvard.edu > Admissions & Aid, Undergraduate > Harvard College Admissions > Applying > Freshman Application Process (Testing Information); and you can also go a step further > Application Timeline</p>

5

<p>Your son is doing great as it is.</p>

6

<p>Yes my son’s guidance counselor listed his self studying on her recommendation for him. The head guidance counselor also requested from the College Board to set up these exams for him in May. We will notate this in his letter to Harvard in January. Thanks for all your help and support.:)</p>

7

<p>I often wonder if the 700 number on the SAT is really the number which indicates the student can survive at the school. Many recruited athletes attend these elite schools with sub 700 scores all the time. </p>

<p>I have read on cc above 600 shows enough proficiency. Food for thought.<br>
Having over a 700 will certainly increase your chances of admittance.</p>

8

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<p>A couple of thoughts:</p>

<p>First, for schools such as H, the majority of recruited athletes need to be strong academically to be admitted. This may not mean a 700, but not significantly lower either.</p>

<p>Second, athletes have lots of support that other students don’t, that’s one of the places where alumni money goes, towards special tutors and other assistance.</p>

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<p>Where on CC? I’ve been around a while and haven’t seen this. Also, WHO is saying it’s proficient? It’s not the highly selective colleges, because if you go to their CDSs, the data doesn’t support this.</p>

9

<p>I agree with 1961 on 600 and not 700 threshold. With the holistic view I believe H can decipher a student who may not be an optimal test taker but can dig in and be an achiever despite this through grades and long term achievements. I also know that at top universities tutoring and other services are offered to all students and not just athletes. I actually worked in a tutoring center and no one was excluded for receiving help if they wish. Despite this my son continues to strive to be on par with others SAT scores. This score to me still does not promise success for all students with the highest scores. My hope is that HYP and other top u’s do see this.</p>

10

<p>The range of most top universities admit from 600-800 SAT when looking at the 0%-100% range. 700 being the average. And yes those in the lower 25% are mostly athletes and URM + others disadvataged. They are accepted with the belief that they can prosper in a top university and can add to the diversity of their university which proves to be very important in the future of our leaders.</p>

11

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<p>Yes, I know that tutoring is provided at all schools, but not to the degree that it is offered to athletes, I’m talking about a tutoring staff dedicated to athletes, not the services for all students.</p>

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<p>700 is not the average, it’s closer to the the 25% level. Also, please read exactly what I wrote:</p>

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<p>I didn’t say that they don’t accept anyone with lower than a 700 CR, but that it raises a concern. That concern may be relieved by some other part of the application (eg. AP English or Social Science classes with high grades and scores), or it may be substantiated, either of which could sway a decision.</p>

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<p>So we disagree on the relevance of SAT scores, won’t be the first or last time members haven’t seen eye to eye on this subject. But I have to ask you in all honesty: Do you really think this last sentence was necessary or relevant to what is being discussed? Do you think anything I’ve said here or anywhere else on this forum belies a belief contrary to this?</p>

12

<p>Not directly relevant but links to the fact of the lower 25% which adds substantially to the diversity of the campus. I agree 700 is not average but about 25% which include URMs and athlete score between 600 and 700. That’s a substantial percent of incoming class and who in turn successfully graduate at about 96% rate . I just see so much emphasis on the SAT grades of which not all students get to retake 2 or 3 times as others can afford to or take expensive prep classes. I do hope and believe admissions officers can read into the differences amongst candidates to decipher who is just as prepared even with lower SAT scores. This is why I agree with 1961 re 600 score and I also agree that 700+ gives you better chances to be admitted…unfortunately this keeps great students out.</p>

13

<p>Personally I think, if he can score above a 660 on the Critical Reading I would feel a lot more comfortable about sending him to Harvard or Princeton. I would not let my son attend a college such as Harvard or Princeton if he had your son’s current SAT scores. I would be too afraid he would become socially isolated and develop all kinds of inferiority complexes about his abilities. These are schools where 25% of the kids score over 760 on Critical Reading. Statistically these kids are two standard deviations ahead of your child. I doubt he will have a pleasant experience in classes with kids such as these. I think he will be a lot happier at a school such as Notre Dame and NYU. That is just my opinion. I do not know if the adcoms would see it this way.</p>

14

<p>He did apply to Notre Dame and NYU as well and I do see your point. I still believe that the range is due to test prep availablity and I hope that admissions officers can decipher this.</p>

15

<p>Judging from his SAT Math, Physics Subject Test and AP Calc scores your son will do well in a university with a decent engineering program. What is he planning on studying at Harvard and Princeton etc?</p>

<p>I have a son who is planning on studying Electrical Engineering at TX A&M University. He decided to not apply to the elites such as MIT and the Ivies for engineering because he felt the course work would get too intense for him there.</p>

16

<p>I do believe you are very on point. He wanted to focus on business and of course his math skills are there as he has a 5 in AP calc A/B and was always accelerated in math. He did sway away from the sciences although I do believe he did very well in them. Now his interest is in Government and Politics plus the legal field. I truly think he is undecided at this point and thats why a liberal arts education is what he needs. He does have a few safeties as well but he has this drive to get accepted into an IVY league. I think I am getting the understanding that the best fit will be a middle reach college and he will do well there. Thanks for all your input as it has put me in a better place.</p>

17

<p>Yolie,</p>

<p>Your son will do fine at Harvard. I know of several athletes who are attending Harvard, Yale, and Princeton with sub 2000 SAT scores and are surviving. Good luck to your son.</p>

<p>My son is attending Cornell Engineering and states the school is tough and demanding. He is passing and will affiliate in his major. At Cornell there are special tutoring services for URMS. Exactly what these services are I can not say as my son has not used them. I would think HYP offers tutoring services to urms. If you think your son might use tutoring services, call the school and inquire.</p>

<p>My son’s high school was not competitive.
For informational purposes (1440SAT)770M, 670CR; 780M2, 660CHEM</p>

18

<p>Thanks for your support…we will forge ahead and he will do well. Good luck to your son as well!</p>

19

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<p>I agree he could survive and thanks for bringing balance if I was too negative. </p>

<p>Yolie, </p>

<p>my point is do you want your son to survive for the next 4 years or attend a school where he prospers thrives / dominates? You have an exceptionally gifted and talented child. In 4 years he could develop into a confident and academically stronger person who could dominate at an Ivy league in grad school. Your child seems to have the potential to be a leader and role model in his community, possibly nationally. </p>

<p>ps: Smiley:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>Your son was almost 3rd SD in Math and 1st SD in Reading. It is why I said, I would be more comfortable if OP DS had 660+ on SAT CR (that your son did).</p></li>
<li><p>Your son is studying engineering which requires high Math skills which your son has developed. However, it does not require xtremely high verbal skills that your son has not developed. So, he is a decent match for the major. OP’s son is not in same boat. He is thinking about law and management that require higher verbal skills.</p></li>
</ol>

20

<p>Perazziman,</p>

<p>I believe Yolie’s son can survive and do well with the resources Harvard has to offer but that is just my opinion. I know athletes at HYP performing well and their SAT scores were the same as Yolie’s son. </p>

<p>In my eyes the SAT is not a true measure of a person’s ability to do well in college. The first time my daughter took the ACT she scored a 26. She prepped and retook the ACT five months later and scored a 32. My daughter became elite school material in five months, I don’t think so. She learned the strategy of the test. </p>

<p>To do well on the SAT and ACT the student has to think counter to what they have learned in school.</p>