So I am a rising senior and I’ve been thinking about where to apply early next year. I really don’t want to waste the early application and want to apply to the school where I fit in the best based on most aspects (academics, school location, student life, overall environment). Based on academics and location alone, Harvard seems to be the best fit out of my 3 options (Harvard, Princeton, UPenn)…Boston is a hub for hospitals and is also very green and eco-friendly, Harvard has amazing bio/research opportunities, it is crazy well-known…etc.
However, I realized that I know nothing about the actual student life as I haven’t been able to visit. I definitely want to this summer, but there are some things I want clarified.
Do students live on campus all 4 years ? Is it required? Even if it isn't, do most people live on campus anyways ? How is off-campus housing ?
How hard is it to get a single dorm (I know at UPenn it isn't too hard, even freshman year)?
Do dorms have kitchens and do they allow appliances (i.e. Rice cookers, food processors or blenders) ?
I saw something about the meal plan being only unlimited...that sounds horrible. Do students have to have an unlimited meal plan all 4 years ?
I’m not trying to get off campus and be away from the college community…I want the traditional college experience. However, personally I want to develop a lot of skills that will prepare me for independent living. I don’t want to go to a school that doesn’t allow students to have the option to cook for themselves, live off campus, work off campus, and live by themselves. I have a lot of dietary restrictions and haven’t purchased cafeteria food since elementary school (I am lactose intolerant, allergic to some nuts, and I’m a vegetarian…and in general I’m a bit of a health and fitness nut).
I don’t mind having a meal plan for a year or possibly 2 (if I can choose the minimum meal plan, which at some places is like 8 meals a week), but having an unlimited meal plan for 4 years…that could get me thinking.
Sorry this post is so long, thank you for all of your help! I know I can look some of this up, but a lot of the info regarding meals is confusing to me.
Yes, almost all students live on campus for all four years. No, it is not required. Off-campus housing is expensive and hard to find.
It is hard but not impossible to get a single room, especially if one is very difficult or disagreeable. Roommates and dormmates are a highlight of the Harvard experience.
Many freshman dorms have kitchens in the basement areas. All the houses have student kitchens. Some of the upperclass "swing" housing, which is used for a few houses that have a lot of students and is also used for the students whose house is being renovated, are apartment style and have kitchens. But not many. Few appliances are allowed, but there are many coffee makers, rice cookers, air popcorn poppers, electric kettles, and microwaves in dorm rooms anyway. There are fewer food processors, blenders, and appliances that require a dedicated kitchen sink for successful cleaning and use.
Yes. The plan includes CrimsonCash and BoardPlus, which allows you to eat at a very limited few places in addition to the dining halls. Harvard Square is full of interesting restaurants with diverse and delicious fare, and surrounding neighborhoods have terrific offerings as well.
Harvard will be able to accommodate your food requirements (lactose intolerance, nut allergies, and vegetarianism), but you will not be eating gourmet meals with or without these requirements.
There are many Harvard students who are interested in food (I believe @carlson2’s child is one of these students), there are food clubs, and there are some spectacular classes focused on food, but based on your interests and requirements, Harvard might not be the right place for you.
@EastGrad thank you for the helpful response! I think I’ll definitely have to visit and decide if the dorms / meal / campus “negatives” outweigh the fact the positives at Harvard. I guess I was just surprised as most schools on my list don’t have the same living and meal requirements as Harvard… @skieurope haha of course those aren’t the only schools I’m applying to. For options I meant for SCEA or ED. I have plenty of safety and match schools (including state flagship and a school that accepts nearly all of my school’s students)…thank you anyways !
I can’t speak for Princeton, but Penn has many options for affordable off-campus living close to campus; that’s just not the case at Harvard. Not living on-campus is just not an option from a financial perspective for most Harvard undergrads. Additionally, unlike Harvard, some of Penn’s dorms have kitchenettes in the some rooms (not in the singles though, AFAIK), which gives students eating options outside the dining hall.
FWIW: Princeton also has plenty of off-campus housing: https://offcampushousing.princeton.edu. Ditto with Yale and most other ivy league schools. Harvard is unique in that the surrounding area of Cambridge is currently the most expensive place in Massachusetts to purchase a house (http://realestate.boston.com/buying/2016/06/17/cambridge-most-expensive-home-prices/) so apartment rentals are also more expensive than anywhere in the state. So, most Harvard students choose to live (and eat) on-campus, as the alternative is too cost prohibitive.
Something like 98% of Harvard undergrads remain in college housing. To put it more positively, the house system creates real communities and many don’t want to leave. There are many options for layout of living situations, but in general real singles go to those with disabilities ( if you cannot be around certain foods you might qualify) who require them. There are suites and room situations with two rooms and a common area, so you can easily have a room with a door that shuts, just not, technically, a single.
One of my kids has celiac and type 1 diabetes and ate at Harvard for the entire time in a house. You should probably meet with the dining hall supervisor and chef, whoever does that kind of thing now. They can accommodate you. They can prepare meals for you if you give them a little notice. They are very attentive.
I think it would be a shame to avoid a school because of dietary restrictions when it really isn’t a problem.
ps my kid did live off campus one year; roommate situations can be affordable and financial aid for housing will help cover rent and food off campus if you get need-based aid. There was a special circumstance unrelated to anything in your post.
@compmom I decided to make a pros and cons list for early admission…and I’ve scheduled a tour of Harvard
Yah, it seems super petty not to like a school because of food / living… I think I will make more pros and cons later after I actually get results. It was between UPenn and Harvard for early and in the end, although I like UPenn a bit more, ED is a bad option as I want to consider some merit offers if I get any.
I’m full pay at every school (even Harvard) and wanting to be pre-med can be tough…thank you for the anecdote! It’s not too much about being able to have anything to eat, but just the lack of independence per say. I think cooking and being able to live alone are important skills one should learn…but you are definitely right. It’s not smart to cross off a school just because of the factors I listed.
Full Disclosure: My daughter went to Harvard and thought the food was just god awful – for the most part anything served hot was prepared three hours before it was served, like the food at a bad wedding reception – it was pretty much all “institutional food” except for the sands (stay away from the hard boiled eggs, as they all seemed to have been cooked yesterday). Ditto with my son at Yale, which is why both my kids looked forward to coming home on breaks and having a home cooked meal
There is also a coop house off campus for Harvard. Realistically, not too many grads of any college can afford to live alone
Some colleges (including Brown for last year) have apartment suites with a full kitchen. I don’t know what the renovations at Harvard are focused on, so take the info from those of us whose kids have graduated as possibly outdated…
Enjoy your various tours.
You know there is no merit aid, right?
Also no premed. You can major in anything and go to med school, just have to do the prerequ’s during undergrad or at a post-baccalaureate program.
Just to follow up: By ivy league conference rules, no member institution within the ivy league (which includes Harvard, Yale, Princeton, Columbia, Cornell, Brown, Dartmouth or UPenn) can offer anything but need-based financial aid. In other words, merit aid is NOT offered to any student at any ivy league school. Furthermore, if an applicant is offered merit aid from a peer school plus need-based aid, an ivy league school is prohibited by conference rules from matching the merit aid portion of another school’s financial aid award.
@compmom@gibby thank you for the information! It’s not about the food for me, it’s about having the freedom to cook and prep meals and save money … but it’s not necessarily the most important thing in the entire world. It’s not like I need to eat gourmet meals…I just don’t think it’s fair to be paying tons of $ at school dining halls for food that I don’t eat that is more expensive. But I’ve realized it’s not that important…
And don’t worry, of course I know Harvard, Princeton, UPenn etc. don’t give merit. What I mean is that I’ve decided ED is a bad choice because I want to be able to consider merit from my match and safety schools. I know pre-med is a track, not a major, but just mentioned it to focus on the fact that I need to pay money for med school too so undergrad debt is a consideration for me, although my parents have the savings to pay for an Ivy League school…it’s complicated lol. I care about the money more, they care more about reputation and there is not use arguing anymore…
Thanks anyways for the info I know lots of people on CC don’t know about Ivy merit and pre-med stuff; I’ve been on CC for too long to not know that haha
Bottom Line: there are many wonderful reasons for wanting to attend Harvard – IMHO being on the pre-med track there is not one of them. You may actually stand a better chance at med school by attending a less prestigious university and receiving a 4.0 in your science classes rather than attending Harvard (or any other ivy league school) and getting B’s in those same science courses.
Just as course rigor varies among high schools, there are also varying levels of course rigor at different colleges. Harvard – rightly, or wrongly – believes they are teaching to gifted and talented students, so to challenge those “best of the best” students, professors are encouraged to pour on the work. Some courses normally taught over an entire year at another college are taught during one semester at Harvard. LS2 (Evolutionary Human Physiology and Anatomy), which is the Bio course recommended for students interested in pursing medical school is a good example of that. The course is jammed packed with things you wouldn’t be asked to do at another college, like identifying every bone in the human body by week two in the course, something my wife didn’t have to do until medical school! Yes, it’s a fabulous experience, but very few students get A’s in the course: http://scholar.harvard.edu/adamfrange/files/life_sciences_2_evolutionary_human_physiology_and_anatomy_syllabus_2012.pdf.
Full Disclosure: My daughter graduated from Harvard with a humanities degree, then enrolled as a second degree student at CCNY to complete all her pre med requirements, took the MCAT and just went through the medical school applications process. She will be starting medical school next month at WashU in St. Louis. Although she realized late in her undergraduate years that she wanted to pursue medicine, she probably would have dropped out of the pre-med track at Harvard given the stiff competition there.
@gibby, Wow that article was really enlightening. I’ve heard and read lots of debates about the low ranked school vs Ivy for pre-med…the only reason I would think about a tougher Ivy would be because I don’t think many can be 1000% certain about medicine.
I would also be interested in computational bio (with biotech startups and other companies), teaching at a college level, as well as hospital administration/managrment…at least for teaching and hospital administration, the name of the school matters more. I don’t know. I’ll have to see in college what happens…I just thought Harvard would be easier for pre-med because of grade inflation and the fact that lots of people go there for law, history, a few for engineering…unlike JHU for example where pre-med dominates (something I don’t want in a school.). But I guess I was wrong!
^^ You seem to have much misinformation regarding Harvard, the college application process, and jobs.
Yes, you were wrong. It’s NOT easier to be pre-med at Harvard. In fact, IMHO I think being on the pre-med track at Harvard is very difficult as so few A’s are given in those pre-med courses.
Try googling some of the professors at Harvard and see where they received their undergraduate degree. Do the same for hospital administrators and you’ll see that the name of an undergraduate school doesn’t matter much – it’s what you have done at your undergraduate school that matters more. For example:
So many young people want to be doctors but change their minds. And you are already thinking about other careers. I hope you won’t base your choice of undergrad school on med school prospects.
In fact, I hope you can put career concerns aside for awhile, find a college you like, and study what you enjoy and are good at. It really is still possible to go to college to learn and deal with career afterwards. There is more flexibility to life than many of us are taught early on.
