<p>So apparently.. one of my mom's patients (she's a periodontist).. is on the school board for Harvey Mudd and told her if my scores were good he could get me in.</p>
<p>That makes me feel a little bit better. :] haha</p>
<p>Some of the best news i have yet to hear..</p>
<p>still hoping to get into Berkeley and/or Cornell.</p>
<p>I hope that's not true, to be honest.</p>
<p>How come? :/ You don't want me to go?? If i do well on the SAT i should get in anyway..</p>
<p>Gee, maybe its because everyone should be judged on merits, not based on who they know? I really really doubt that some one on the board can get some one in, based upon scores. Harvey Mudd is looking for ever so much more than.</p>
<p>We don't know Blackroses, nor the context of the conversation. Perhaps the "board member" knows enough of Blackroses to consider him/her a good fit and a likely candidate in other ways, as long as the test scores show up... and either (s)he misunderstood, or the "board member" was puffing up a bit.</p>
<p>OTOH, if this turns out to be a case of connections getting someone in without qualifications... how long do you think the someone will last at Mudd? :)</p>
<p>Blackroses, this does seem like a sort of obtuse post to make on a forum where/when so many Mudd applicants are biting their nails and waiting for April 1.</p>
<p>Good luck, everyone.</p>
<p>The reason I posted was because i was happy about it, and this is a college forum.</p>
<p>I agree- I don't like it when people just get in because of people they know.. however, i have the merit and scores to get in regardless. It just made me feel more reassured. I wouldn't want to go to a school that i got into if i felt i was way below the actual level of the average admit.</p>
<p>
The reason I posted was because i was happy about it, and this is a college forum.
OK, but surely there must have been some brief moment when some small voice in the back of your head said, "Ya know, maybe other students who've been busting their humps on applications for this college and are now on the edge of their seats waiting with anxiety for decisions... just might not be particularly receptive to a post from me about some back-door connection I might have with some guy who says he can pull strings to get me admitted." Surely. ;)</p>
<p>ya, i get what you're saying.. I'm sorry..</p>
<p>If it makes anyone feel better, I'm not even applying this year. I'm just a junior.</p>
<p>^^ Oh... well as long as you're not screwing over OUR chances then it is okay. :)</p>
<p>(end sarcasm)</p>
<p>haha, appreciate the sarcasm. :]</p>
<p>look.. im not screwing anyone's chances. i will get in regardless of whoever that guy is. Besides, what would be the point of getting help in if i couldn't get in by myself? When I get their I'd sink with the workload if i wasn't actually capable! :]</p>
<p>It was just good news to hear.. sorry for posting it. someone can delete this if they want, i don't know how.</p>
<p>Blackroses, I imagine at least some folks will cut you some slack for youth and enthusiasm. :)</p>
<p>From what I know of Mudd so far... if it's where you belong, you'll know it... and if it's not, you probably won't be all that interested. They seem to have a knack for finding and drawing in the kind of people who thrive on the challenges they offer. And who (I think) take honor codes seriously in letter and spirit.</p>
<p>Good luck with the rest of your junior year and your preparations for college apps!</p>
<p>that's why i was so interested in it, the great education and the honor code. (What, you think i wanted to go there for the aesthetics? haha) I come from a catholic high school, and i think it's great to have a trusting relationship among peers and professors. It actually bothers me when i see other people blatantly cheating. I want to be around people who are honest and generally make good decisions. </p>
<p>I know Berkeley is completely different, but that is my other top school. I'm planning to visit both and see how i feel there. I'm fairly confident i can get into both. I don't need help getting in, it was just good news to hear.</p>
<p>You should chat up mathboy98... a pretty thoughtful college guy... he says he looked very hard at Mudd, but chose Berkeley. His POV might interest you.</p>
<p>haha thanks, he was actually the first person on here I talked to, and we have messaged a lot regarding the two schools. :] His point of view has helped me a lot.. I still want to see what the feel is like, and think whether it would be better to challenge myself to go to a big public school, or stay in my comfortable small school environment; of course, there are several other factors, and benefits from going to both schools.</p>
<p>"You should chat up mathboy98... a pretty thoughtful college guy... he says he looked very hard at Mudd, but chose Berkeley. His POV might interest you."</p>
<p>=]</p>
<p>Yeah, we did indeed talk already, though for the record, I never said "small" has to be comfortable! I know what you mean though, you're used to private schools perhaps. As a note, I went to one myself for high school [as it happens, also a catholic one!]. The transition didn't bother me, but that has much to do with personality + educational style, things I'm sure you picked up from when we last spoke. I hope your selection/decision-making process is going well! If you have more specific questions about my own school, I'll be happy to take a shot at them.</p>
<p>"OK, but surely there must have been some brief moment when some small voice in the back of your head said, "Ya know, maybe other students who've been busting their humps on applications for this college and are now on the edge of their seats waiting with anxiety for decisions... just might not be particularly receptive to a post from me about some back-door connection I might have with some guy who says he can pull strings to get me admitted." Surely."</p>
<p>This phenomenon is incredible. At times, if someone I know is in a class I'm taking, and we're both kind of struggling to get what's happening, and I happen to go "Hey man, I totally feel like it's starting to click, I'm starting to love this material!" I may not get the best response ;) Either way, as someone not undergoing this college application mania, I can appreciate the enthusiasm, but realize why most people reading this thread are writhing in agony.</p>
<p>Hahaha I'm so amused at the small voice bit... =</p>
<p>Don't ask to "pull strings". Just don't ask favors. Bad idea.</p>
<p>Don't trust me? Then lets look at the possibilities:</p>
<p>1) You "pull strings": This would be essentially cheating IMO, and thus you would be breaking the Honor Code that you seem to care so much about. Sure you didn't sign it yet, but the honor code is more of an acceptance of general respect and decency than a legal document. So in this case you would be cheating because you want to go to a school that doesn't cheat. </p>
<p>If this is what tips you over and allows you to be accepted, then a few really bad things can happen. First, if you tell people what you did when you come here, word will spread quickly (it's a small school) and a lot of people will be pretty upset with you. I go here now, and worked incredibly hard in high school to get here (as did the rest of the class). I'd be pretty annoyed if someone had "strings pulled" to replace some work and accomplishment that the rest of us needed. Think of how much the stereotypical "principle's son" is hated; the one who gets cut slack just because of his/her relation. This "connection" you may have access to may be less than that stereotype, but its the principle and example that counts. </p>
<p>Then you may find that you hate this school. Absolutely hate. Most of the students here (especially the engineers) already hate the workload. Many leave because they can't handle it. It's nothing to be ashamed of if so; Harvey Mudd life is probably harder than that of almost all other colleges and perhaps careers in general (in terms of hours and difficulty). While you may want to come here now, if you're not the type to have a resume good enough to get in, you may become miserable fast. And trust me, that's not fun.</p>
<p>Or you could take the other option:
2) You don't ask to "pull strings". Then if you get rejected, hopefully you will soon realize that it's probably for the much better, and go to another great school with a good conscience.
If you do get in, then you, well, get in, whatever that entails. But you do so feeling good about yourself, knowing that you got in fair and were definitely good enough to be here. </p>
<p>So, the possibilities really simplify to this:
If strings help, but you would have gotten in anyway: Good minus conscience. Besides, whats the point of the strings for this?
If strings help, but you still get rejected: Well, then youd just feel pretty lame thinking that you couldnt even get in with those.
If strings push you over the edge : BAD MISTAKE
If you decide not to use strings, and get in: Accepted! Yay, if it works for you.
If you decide not to use strings and get rejected: You go to a school you will probably like more, and still are happy.
So, using the strings is just general a pretty bad choice for you. Please, do yourself a favor and dont do it.
On a side note: While it doesnt necessarilly help my argument, I would just like to put it out there that if you did get in it probably wouldnt prevent someone else from getting accepted who would actualy come here. Only 30% of the accepted applicants come here I think, so there would only be a 30% chance that youd be preventing someone else who would have come here from getting accepted if you did. However, if they were really that close to the cutting edge, then they may have had a lot of difficulty here anyway. Of course, it still wouldnt be nice if they were excluded unfairly.
Sorry if I came of as a bit harsh, but the concept of strings to this place really annoys me, because I have a lot of respect for the faculty here and would be dissapointed in them if things like that were allowed to occur. Also, I dont mean to discourage you from coming to Mudd if you do get accepted. If youre right for this place it may just be like heaven on earth. I go to Harvey Mudd now (if you couldnt tell so far) and really do like it. But Im a bit crazy, and so is almost everyone I know. Im just a Freshman and thus havent experienced the really tough work yet of sophomores and engineers. If you have any questions about this post or Harvey Mudd in general Ill be happy to answer them.</p>
<p>Thanks for the post.. and you're right, I do work hard in school and I do have the resume to get in anyway.. it was just kinda good news, even though I don't need the help. Like i said, if I'm not good enough to get in by myself, I'd probably drown in work and be miserable when i get there, so it really wouldn't do any good.</p>
<p>"If strings help, but you would have gotten in anyway: Good minus conscience. Besides, what’s the point of the strings for this?"</p>
<p>I very much understand your concern, which is that HMC, reputed to be a highly merit-based, sort of "pure academics" school would stoop to a low level. However, my opinion is that the post Blackroses made doesn't actually sound terribly awful to me...though as geek_mom put it, it may have been poorly received [small voices, etc]. </p>
<p>I'm quite confident from my conversation with her that she could handle a rigorous school either way. Nevertheless, whoever knows what factors play into acceptances? I'm not sure why I was accepted. Sure I had "perfect stats" in terms of the basics, and all, but ultimately something sort of made the final cut for me. Something has to sort of make the final cut for everyone. I think frequently, that ends up being a slightly softer factor than some of us may like; for instance, admissions officers may attempt to "get to know" the student's math and science passion through essays. In a sense, this post sounded like the "connection" knew Blackroses well enough, and if her grades were good, could make a convincing case for her being a good fit at Mudd. It's in a way taking this "personal" aspect to admissions to a whole new level.</p>
<p>One would think Ph.d. admissions are essentially merit-based, no? At least that they should be? Unfortunately, while awesome math education can get you on the list of candidates to be accepted to certain top programs, I'm quite certain knowing someone famous in the [elitist] academic community can <em>GREATLY</em> help one's chances, and may be essential. Sure, these guys getting letters from top faculty may be brilliant as heck. But they're still getting a nontrivial boost. </p>
<p>I am not sure how much this plays a role in undergraduate admissions, but frankly, I think it's probably easier to distinguish two Ph.D. candidates than undergrad candidates, given how much more developed the Ph.D. candidates are -- how much more info there is to consider [though, of course, some Ph.D. programs tend to have microscopically few spots]. It seems to be a reality that connections play a role in quite a few places. That doesn't mean quality is necessarily being compromised, but the idea is that instead of leaving things up to chance after developing a good application, one gets a little boost. I'm not saying I adore this, but I think there are legitimate reasons not to condemn the idea in general.</p>
<p>Hahaha. Let the young one come here and then ITR. It'll be fun...</p>