I am an incoming transfer student for Fall 2020, and I committed to Haverford College a while back. I was (and still am!) super excited for Haverford, it was one of my top choices and the community values seem perfect for me. However, I just found out today that I was admitted off the waitlist at Carleton College, which makes my decision so much harder! I don’t find out about financial aid from Carleton until Wednesday, and they need a response by Monday, June 15. If either school offers me significantly more money than the other, that will pretty much make my decision for me, but I have a feeling they will offer me similar aid, since many of my other schools did.
So, I would greatly appreciate any current/past students or parents from either school offering me some insight on this! For reference, I am a pre-med student interested in natural and social sciences, and I am very passionate about theatre, a cappella, and some club sports for extracurriculars.
I didn’t get to visit either school due to Covid-19
Some pros of Carleton:
slightly larger student body of 2000, I feel that this is a sweet spot for LACs
-Slightly higher rankings in most lists (I truly don’t care about rankings much but I suppose its worth noting)
-Less “preppy” from what I’ve been hearing online, not as many kids are var athletes etc.
-Community vibes, very friendly students (again from hearing online)
-Intellectual environment
cons:
-Minnesota winters (I’m from California lol)
-More rural environment, farther from big city
-Midwest environment might be more suffocating
-trimester system? (honestly not sure if this is a pro or con, it’s just different and I’m not used to it)
some pros of Haverford:
-suburban environment, 15 min away from downtown Philly, plus just a couple hours from areas like NYC and Boston
-Honor Code allows students to focus on community values, academics w/o competition etc.
-Offered me a good amount of aid (Idk about Carleton’s aid yet)
-already committed, makes it easier to choose this one lol
-more mild/pleasant weather
-consortium w/ Bryn Mawr, Swarthmore, and sometimes UPenn makes for larger community and more opportunities
cons:
-very small student body of 1300, may be a tad too small.
-ranked slightly lower (again not that important to me)
-lots of students play Var sports, I’m not a var athlete but would be interested in club sports, but definitely don’t want whole social life revolving around sports
-seen the word “preppy” thrown out a lot online about Haverford
-would have to go to Bryn Mawr to pursue theatre, and some other subjects that interest me
My understanding is that the Trimester System at Carleton College is similiar to that at Dartmouth College in the respect that one takes just 3 courses per term. If correct, this alleviates a lot of the pressure found at quarter / trimester system schools with 4 or 5 courses per term.
Carleton College is located in the same small town as is St. Olaf College (the singing school). Check out whether a student at one school can participate in EC singing activities at the other school.
Assuming that the financial aid offers are similiar, then it becomes a question of weather during the school year. Haverford College wins this issue.
Tough choice.
Based on my limited knowledge, I cannot make a recommendation other than to trust your instincts as it is largely a matter of personal choice. But, if seriously cold weather is a concern, then the answer seems clear.
I’m from So Cal and have lived in NY since 2004. Winter in PA and winter in MN are both going to be a giant shock to you. I personally don’t feel the difference in winters in both places is enough to base a decision on. Either way, you need a darn good coat, hat, gloves and boots.
I don’t think you should worry about rankings, both are well regarded.
To me, it sounds that you prefer the vibe of Carleton. It is known to be a little more quirky / nerdy, with intelligent students who thrive in the somewhat intense academic environment. It’s not that it’s super intense as much as the trimester system means you need to stay on the ball with your work.
I think Haverford appeals to a very particular person. You need to be sure you are okay with the small student body, the preppy-ness (not terrible, IMO), and the honor code. (FWIW, my kid, who is not preppy at all, disliked Haverford but loved Carleton. Sadly, she didn’t get in.)
I think it’s unrealistic to factor in proximity to a city. Carleton is FAR closer to Minneapolis than Haverford is to NYC or Boston. Haverford is not right in Philly, and you will find at both colleges, students spend most time on campus. Boston is close to five hours away. NYC is two hours.
You can wait until you see what the FA is like from Carleton. Beyond that, I suggest you base your decision on where you think you can be happy.
Going to Bryn Mawr for basically anything is a non-issue at Haverford because they are VERY intertwined schools. This also makes Haverford feel less small to my D- she is at Bryn Mawr for classes/meals/parties all the time. One of my D’s double majors is at Bryn Mawr and the other is a TriCo major, but it doesn’t really change anything for her. My D at isn’t preppy in the least (think piercings, tattoos, and rainbow hair), but she’s never felt out of place. She’s a club athlete and loves how she gets PE credit for it and how the school is so supportive. There are a ton of a cappella groups on campus. She did (prior to covid, of course) go into the city regularly- it is a very quick/cheap train ride.
I don’t know really anything about Carleton, but I’ll be happy to pass any question you have about Haverford through her!
Haverford’s location is much better. Consortium is a huge plus.
I don’t get the comments about Haverford being preppy. Not my observation at all from having a child who graduated a couple years back.
Athletics do not dominate the campus scene at all. Haverford will have a higher percentage of varsity athletes but that is purely driven by the fact that it has a smaller student body. It’s a very inclusive campus and since athletics don’t rank high as an admissions factor relative to other colleges, Haverford has never presented to me as a jock-y place. Athletes are as intellectual as the rest of the student body.
Agree with the view that preppy is not an adjective associated with Haverford College – earnest, intense, yes, but preppy, no. Also, the community of H’ford and BMC is intertwined, it really is a community of 2000+ students, with classes, majors, dining, clubs fully integrated.
I am originally from the midwest, and did my undergrad at Bryn Mawr. Winter is much more serious business in Minnesota than in the Philly area. It is much colder, longer, darker, and snowier.
That said, if you choose Carleton, the people there will be able to advise you on appropriate winter gear. Your CA fall/winter clothing will get you through for long enough find out what you will need, and you can build your wardrobe up gradually. You won’t need snow boots and a parka on the first day of class.
If you would like an example of a respected publication that ranks Haverford ahead of Carleton, Kiplinger placed Haverford a superb 9th (and Carleton an excellent 20th) in this ranking that includes both liberal arts colleges and universities:
I echo that I’ve never felt the preppy vibe at Haverford and don’t think it really exists. There are a lot of sports but it’s more of the ultimate frisby level of sports mania than preppy always-wear-sailboat-gear-though-don’t-own-sailboats. I’ve never felt that preppy country-club vibe there. I also find Haverford has its share of quirkiness.
As others have noted, it’s not really 1300 students because BMC and H are basically twin campuses. Together they are about 2600 students. You get two schools in one. The schedules mesh; the culture around testing meshes; they share ideas of governance; you can freely take part in clubs at both schools; the campus of BMC is an added bonus because Wow! Is it Gorgeous; the students also do go into Philly often, which really opens up the world. You can also take classes at UPenn–nothing to sniff at. And at Swarthmore–buses also travel there though less frequently.
H and BMC announced that they will be opening this fall in person and will be running the “blue bus” which delivers the students back and forth between campuses frequently. This year they will limit numbers of riders, and I suspect that they will run more buses even more frequently. But the schools are only about 1 mile apart! I have walked between them several times.
The buses on Saturdays take students to the shopping areas nearby as part of the circuit–so trips to Trader Joes and such.
My feeling is that the students at Haverford have a very pleasant life and the social and academic life is enhanced because of its close association with Bryn Mawr.
Thank you to everyone for the helpful advice and information! I got my FA from Carleton, and it is slightly more in total aid than Haverford, but slightly less grant money, so the overall difference is not enough to base my entire decision on. At this point I’m leaning a bit towards Haverford, partially due to location, consortium, and community/Honor Code values. But I’d still love to hear more comments on both schools if you all have them!
I am anxious about this decision because I did not like my first school at all, hence why I’m transferring, so I’m scared I’ll make another “wrong decision”, although, as many of you pointed out, there isn’t really a right or wrong between these two and I’d probably be happy at either one. Not being able to visit just makes this process a lot more daunting! Thanks again!
