A few weeks ago, I had the pleasure of attending an MT production at “tippy top” program. I have seen many of their performances over the decades (like three). In the last few years, something about the cast members at large has caught my notice: In this particular show, with a cast of 10 -12 female cast members, more than half of them appeared to be of short stature - under 5’ 2"-ish to perhaps 4’9" or thereabouts (one woman appeared “tall” to my eye (6’?) and two/three “average”). Amongst the 12 or so men, maybe two were 6’ or taller, a couple average, the rest 5’9"-ish or under. This trend(?) has been very noticeable to me in the last three years or so at this program. Has anyone else noticed this at other schools? (I may be an outlier, since my S is north of 6’ and I’m always comparing actor heights) Is there something genetic that preconditions shorter-than-average young people to have a passion for MT? (I get the whole, “I was too short to compete in sports” or “Other kids picked on me because I was short and I never fit in” thing) Are shorter actors more “marketable” and therefor give your alumni an edge in getting hired so let’s pack 'em in? I do know that S has been rebuffed by a local casting agent (who has many clients in film/video) because he is “too tall” for television. Are these kids partially chosen because they can play “young” or will “fit” in the video realm?
The cast members’ credits listed in the program also brought to mind another debate that pops up frequently here on CC: a few of the student cast members - all freshmen to juniors - had previous film/video/TV credits listed and two freshmen already had equity cards and broadway experience. Is this perhaps evidence that “tippy top” programs get freshman classes made up of students who would “shine” no matter what program they were plopped into?
I am in no way disparaging the talent/skill of these students - the ensemble singing was phenomenal! I’m just curious if others are seeing a similar preponderance of a particular “type” at other schools - not talking about “underrepresented populations” (this cast was significantly more ethnically diverse than the kids at my S’s program). The students at my S’s program seem to have more “character” or “quirky” types than was evident in this cast (to be fair, this particular show would not highlight those particular traits and perhaps “those” students were not cast or those traits were subjugated in this staging).
Just wondering what others out there might be noticing in regards to “types” being accepted to any given school. Is this a reflection of which future graduates are deemed “hirable”? The leads in a recent touring broadway musical that came to my town were not as tall as one might expect - does this make it possible to pack more actors into a single bus, therefor representing a cost-saving measure? Have those of you with film/video interests had experience with actor height being an issue? Please don’t see this query as an intention to start a firestorm. I’m just a parent trying to peer into the MT “crystal ball”. Hah!
Sometimes I wonder too because my D is 5’10". I sincerely hope that being tall isn’t going to hold her back in any way. I mean Cheyenne Jackson is 6’5". There have to be more tall leading men coming up through the ranks, right?
There are just more average height actors (Male 5’9" and Female 5’4") so they are easier to cast. It’s easier on the camera operators as well. That being said plenty of the highest paid actors are over 6’. Don’t think it really matters as long as you are good.
This would make it plausible that if the majority of guys being accepted into the program were under 5’9", the school would invariably be looking for girls who are shorter so that the casting in shows would be easier. That is really interesting. I think once they are out in the working world, it won’t matter as much but in college where the casting pool is smaller, the program has to “fit” their class so to speak.
We just went on a cruise, and I saw only one noticeably tall guy in the (talented) dance/vocalist troupe. The rest - the women almost towered over the men.
I thought maybe women are just getting taller, and then they wear heels to perform - but now I wonder.
We’ve come a long way on blind casting I wish we would do the same with height. Girls should be allowed to be taller than their love interest. A 6’ girl should be allowed to play an ingenue. (guess whose daughter is 6’)? LOL
There was one interesting “romantic” pairing in this show. The 6’4"-ish (or more?? at least he seemed that tall in relation to the others on the stage) guy was paired with a less than 5’3"-ish girl. When they were together, it was like he was looking down at a child. In real life of course, folks of all dimensions pair up, but on stage this looked a little disconcerting.
Since Michigan is considered one of those “tippy top” programs, I’ll respond with what I’ve observed this year. Michigan has all shapes, sizes (height and weight) and ethnicities in its program. With a total of 80+ kids, there are plenty of possible height combinations for partnering. In D’s freshman class there are at least four boys who are over 6’ tall, a couple of boys who are short (under 5’5"), several girls who are about 5’7", and several girls who hover around 5’2". I think this mix mirrors the national averages of 5’4" for women and 5’9" for men.
I do think height matters in one respect, and that is when assessing type-- think tall, leading man, or short girl next door, for example. Other than that, I don’t think height counts for much when building an MT class. The auditors have too many other things to consider including type, skills, intellect, and character. They also no doubt consider gender, race, and ethnicity in their decision-making. So how can height really figure into it?
In addition, in D’s program many of the short kids were athletes as well–gymnasts, varsity tennis, varsity soccer, etc., so I don’t think short kids are drawn to the performing arts because they can’t compete in athletics. And, I don’t think more kids are picked on because they are short. I just don’t think there’s any correlation.
I honestly don’t know anything about equity credits earned by those in her Freshman class. I know some who didn’t perform anywhere except their high school stages or local community theatre so I don’t think equity credits mean much to auditors at Michigan. Those who have credits would be from areas with strong regional theatres or from the NYC area, where they had access to equity auditions as children or teens, or who earned them last summer prior to Freshman year.
These are just my observations, of course. No hard data to back it up.
The cast members’ credits listed in the program also brought to mind another debate that pops up frequently here on CC: a few of the student cast members - all freshmen to juniors - had previous film/video/TV credits listed and two freshmen already had equity cards and broadway experience. Is this perhaps evidence that “tippy top” programs get freshman classes made up of students who would “shine” no matter what program they were plopped into?
Just chiming on the above comment. My D has had her equity card since she was 13. She has film and TV credits in addition to her national tour and regional theater experience. And her college audition experience was filled with as many ups and downs, and as many rejections, as kids with a resume filled with high school and community theater productions. Her friends in the same boat (professional credits, union membership) have experience the same - highs and lows, acceptances and rejections. I truly believe that, when all is said and done, it’s what they do in the room that matters. In fact, when my D went to talk to the head of the MT program at her school about how she could squeeze in summer auditions as a union member who can’t attend the calls like Straw Hats and NETCs, the program head had not even remembered that my D had done a tour and was a member of AEA. Which in a strange way made my D happy, as she realized that she had been accepted on the basis of her abilities and not her resume.
Friend of son’s just accepted into a “top 3” program - he has no pro credits (or the like) and is a skinny 6’1". I sure do hope the adjudicators continue to have love for that “long and lean” type - as my kid (a junior) is similarly built.
My S is 6’3". He and about 5 other guys in his program are over 6’. But there are some guys in the 5’5" range too. Girls range from short <5’ to 5’10". My S recently made an interesting observation. He said the shorter kids might be more likely to book right out of school as they can play younger; while the “leading man” types like him would have to mature into the roles they would be cast in. An interesting comment that made some sense. I know one thing - at 6’3" I don’t think he is going to be a Newsie! :-0
Not an MT parent, but this thread is at the top of “latest,” so, here I am. If there are more petite or at least non-super tall students in musical theater at the high school level, it may be that in 8th grade the taller students were recruited for joining athletic teams in high school. Not just basketball, longer legs help a lot with running, volleyball, etc etc. And once they’re on that path, it could be hard to peel out and start all over with a new social group (theater kids instead of the athletes) once high school really gets going.
@MTDadandProud - my S is same height - hopes he’s done growing. No Newsies in his future. May have to hold on until he ages into more mature roles. His voice might mature by then, too. Perhaps it’s a good thing he can dance and lift girls over his head.
@beachymom - S was pretty thin when he went through auditions as HS senior. He and other similar body-type guys in his program are starting to fill out a bit. Just takes time. And patience. And many trips to the gym. And as much food as the meal plan allows for. . .
I think different programs have different aesthetics. Purely via the grapevine, but I have heard of some schools that have strong height preferences.
It is easier to cast average heights, and if we’re talking ensemble, most ensembles prefer similar heights (sometimes they’ll have a single ‘character’ exception, e.g. a heavy and/or plain person). I hate to be blunt, but MT and acting is a very visual business and many very old-fashioned stereotypes still hold sway. I love what you wrote, @bissou, and agree 100%. I don’t see why ingenues have to be all one look/height. I think they think it’s what sells, but I’m not convinced. (But I’m no expert!)
As for guys and height, I think lately there have been a ton of shows with large young male dance ensembles. I don’t have any hard science at all to back up my claim, but I do think top male dancers tend to have a smaller/slighter build. So my theory is that there is a high need for these types of guys. I do think many programs respond to what they see is being marketed and what they think will ‘sell’. Some programs try a range of types, others have a fairly uniform vision, and others don’t seem to have a type.
Regarding your question about top programs landing kids who are already experienced–I did look at Juilliard’s graduation class recently and with one or two exceptions, everyone was very experienced. My own S goes to LAMDA and it’s slightly different there, although a large subset has a fair amount of experience. Obviously we can’t know since there’s no control–I mean we can’t take the same kid and send him/her to a ‘lower’ tiered school and a tippy top one, and see if the outcome is different. I do personally think one benefit to such an environment is the level of learning from each other. If you compare this to, say, Harvard, it’s sort of the same idea.
On the other hand, and it’s hard to stress this enough, it’s no guarantee of anything, and also a bright kid can truly, truly make it anywhere, I firmly believe that. Some thrive even better in ‘small pond’ environments. There are so many factors. Same for BFA programs.
@connections I looked at the resumes of the LAMDA students yesterday and was really blown away but the amount of experience (and additional education) the group had. It is impressive.
Two of my city’s most successful college program applicants from last year and this year were males probably in the 6’7" range. One is a freshman in CMU’s BFA program. He got in, rumor has it, everywhere he applied. (Apparently also a top student and a very lovely young man… don’t know him personally but that’s the word.) The other’s decision is TBD but he has great offers to select from too and is truly a gentle giant with an incredible voice. So 6’+ males??? Yay and enjoy it! Shouldn’t hold you back.
Now meanwhile over in tall female land, my daughter booked one on-going gig in NYC because she is tall (just shy of 5’9" and they wanted “Amazon types”) and is currently in a tour where once again, (like in college where you don’t always have pp that are actually the right age to play older) the casting gods seem to have decided that tall = older and someone in their idea of older needs to play the mother-type.
Now I’m 24 years older than my mother and probably 8 inches taller and I was also 2 inches taller than my father (though he would not admit it.) And my 10 years younger sister is 3 inches taller than I am. So I really don’t get the validity of the tall = older casting concept but it’s a thing that lingers even in the professional world sometimes. Take heart that it can work in your favor too when they are looking for “Amazon-types” or someone to play older on a tour that they can’t convince an actual 30-40 something to join
.
Have those of you with film/video interests had experience with actor height being an issue? Please don’t see this query as an intention to start a firestorm. I’m just a parent trying to peer into the MT “crystal ball”. Hah!