As the older and only sibling, my parents tasked me to introduce my 9th grader sister to colleges and college admissions. I’ll be following up and advising her over the next 4 years until she wins her dream school! I’m excited for that however it feels a bit overwhelming as I don’t know from where to start and I don’t want her to stress out but rather enjoy her time with college picking!
Any advises on how start? Also which college admission books** are best to buy? What is the best global ranking magazine she can get?
For the books I found Fiske’s , Princeton’s complete guide, US News Best colleges (waiting for 2017 edition release) . I’m also searching for a global ranking magazine as she’s an international student so she may not limit her choices to the US only.
One place to start is the idea that she should not have a “dream school”. She should have a solid list of schools that includes safeties, matches, and reaches, all of which she would be happy to attend. It is harder to find the safeties and some matches, so don’t skimp on that part of her search. Also, she should not apply to anyplace that is unaffordable. Use the net price calculators on each website to confirm an estimate of what she would have to pay before going too far into research on the school. As an international, there are only a tiny number of colleges that are need blind and meet need for international students – and they are highly competitive for admissions, so her odds of getting into them are slim. So unless your family is well positioned to pay for her education in the US, cost may be a big driver of where it makes sense for her to apply in the US.
I am not aware of any global ranking magazines, but there are global rankings on line. Bur rankings are not everything, don’t just focus on those. Strength in her major and affordability (and maybe merit aid for international students) should be big drivers in your search.
Fiske is a great book for US colleges, my favorite.
… and then conduct a search based on all of the parameters that may be important to both your sister and your family.
Over time, I would develop a list of around 13 potential colleges or universities that you may be interested in… 5 Reach schools… 5 Match schools… and 3 Safeties. 13 may seem like a lot, but the advent of the common application means that it is much easier to apply to a # of schools, and more and more applicants are doing so. This unfortunately also means more overall rejections. 3 years ago, my older daughter applied to a whopping 17 schools and ended up getting rejected by 12… all of her Reach school and all but one match school. That is where she is attending now… thankfully. And she had a 3.98 unweighted GPA, test stats in the 98th percentile, solid ECs, good essays, etc. But she was also an unhooked white female applicant… and there are simply way too many of those applying these days.
If you have a hook of some kind… under-represented minority, athlete, legacy, etc. - you may want to consider that impact on your selection as well.
This year, my younger daughter is now applying to 13 herself. Of course, if you are able to apply early somewhere and gain an early admission to a quality program, that could allow you to limit the # of extra applications needed.
If you spend some time on these 3 websites, you should be able to narrow down your list fairly quickly. But do not underestimate the importance of in-person visits. You will really never know if a college is the right fit for you unless you visit there in-person to see if it feels right to you.
@intparent , What’s Fiske good at? What about PR’s complete book of colleges? US News?
Generally I need her to learn how to select the right college and to understand what makes a good college. She’s attracted to books with good layout and pictures (that’s childish right :)) )
Fiske has in-depth descriptions that tell you about campus vibe, strong majors, community around campus, intensity, housing options, general info about the types of students, etc. It is the best at evaluating some of those qualities that matter when seeking “fit”. There are so many colleges in the US – even fairly deep into the rankings there are some real gems. But as I mentioned above, for most international students finances are a severely limiting factor.
@WWWard, if the OP is applying to financial aid, that is a much bigger hassle than the Common App. It is not as standardized. So then 13 schools can be a lot of work.
@intparent True… but the CSS Profile and FAFSA make it fairly easy to send most info quickly as well. Regardless, the key thing is gaining admission to a program that you are willing and eager to attend. Had my daughter not applied to 17… she may have ended up at a safety… and extremely disappointed. I am not sure where the answer is… and we are going through it again right now. I wish D2 could find an early solution, but her top choice does not offer early admission. And she certainly cannot just roll the dice. So here comes a lot of time, energy and money dedicated toward many applications…
Every college has different due dates for FA information, has variations on what tax forms they want, and wants those forms sent in different ways (iDoc, fax, mail, email attachment). And quite a few have their own extra forms.
I would start with educating three important parts of the college application readiness. GPA/Class rank, Extracurricular (quality over quantity. Passion and continuation throughout high school) and test scores (PSAT/ACT/SAT). Help identify high school graduation plan/path based on interested major. Once these things are in order, there is no limit on number of colleges/options. College rankings would be my last preference!
Generally speaking, parents like to read Fiske. Teens like to read Princeton Review. Take her to the bookstore and let her get whichever she likes. You may also want to get a generic how to get into college book like “Admission Matters” or “If the U Fits.” Don’t get an admissions book focused solely on the Ivy and elite schools, but one that can be used for all types of colleges.
Visit any colleges close to home, just to see some campuses. If you are lucky, she can see the difference between a large university and a small college, for example. Or between a residential college and a commuter school. Or a liberal arts college versus an engineering school. Just to see what types of colleges might be interesting to her, not necessarily to apply to the ones you visit this early.
Go over college admissions requirements. Make sure she takes the right number of math, English, foreign language, science, and social studies credits over her high school career, and takes at least some honors or AP level if she can.
I was referring to families I know, not to the CC community. And, my advice was to take the student to a bookstore to look at them both, because I know there are exceptions to general statements like that.
@AroundHere why did you prefer PR? Unfortunately she may not be able to surf the books as they arn’t available in bookstores at the country we live in; we’ll buy them from Amazon. There is also PR complete college guide and 381 which is better ?
@intparent I’ve heard fiske not only offers tips for US colleges but also UK and Canada is that right?
What’s most important for me in those books is I need her to understand what makes this college good and a good fit rather from some stats for specific colleges (I think this would come to later stage when she narrows her country destination choice in her early junior perhaps).
And yes, I’ll give up on that idea of a dream school!
The PR “top” book has a bunch of lists - some are academic like good schools for this or that major, and some are things like schools for sports, parties, environmental awareness, etc. My perception is that the PR uses quotes from students more heavily. Each school gets a two page spread with school stats in the outside margins. The format is consistent for easy skimming. I don’t own the complete guide.
The Fiske guide is more detailed - they cover a school over more than a two-page spread, so there’s a chance to mention unique programs. The ratings are on a scale of 1-5 (PR uses 60-99, so a little more fine-grained.) There are lists of affordable schools and schools for popular majors, but overall fewer lists than PR. The tone is more like what a teacher or guidance counselor would say, though students are quoted in this book as well.
They are both useful books. It’s just a matter of what style appeals. You want the book your sister will read. You might try the library as a place to compare them if you don’t have a good bookstore.
With either book, you’ll be looking at just a sample of schools. You will still need to investigate your state system (unless your state flagship is one of the best in the country it won’t be in these books) and regional options.
Fiske is excellent and was the only college guide book my D used. I agree with everything @intparent says, and I do not agree with all that @WWWard says:-) Your sister doesn’t need to apply to any more than 8-10 colleges if she has a balanced list of good bets, match, and reach schools, UNLESS she is looking for as much merit aid as she can get.
More applications from less qualified students, or more sloppy applications, shouldn’t make it harder for anyone to get into college, despite the common app. My kid applied to 12 colleges and got into nine. She didn’t get into two tippy top reaches, and was waitlisted at two mid-low reaches but got off the waitlist at one of them. Her list was balanced, and in fact, she shouldn’t have applied to a few of the colleges she did apply to, because she lost interest in them.
I do agree that Niche is really good for students. My D spent a lot of time there. USNWR, IMO, is not useful for anything at all, unless perhaps the paid service is good. We never used it. Apart from this website, the best website for comprehensive college info about virtually every college is college data. It basically complies all the common data set stats for any college and publishes it so you can get the info in one place. It also has lots of helpful student stories about getting into college and useful articles about college.
Finally, if your sister has just entered high school, I suggest holding off a bit on the college stuff. There is a lot to get used to in ninth grade, and adding the stress of thinking she must do well to get into college might be better left unitl later in the school year, or next school year. I have a sophomore and he is already sick to death of college stuff, just because he had to live through it with his sister. I plan on waiting until next summer to start his college search in earnest. Of course, if she is raring to get started, go for it, but don’t push it.
Ps, yes, Fiske has info about UK and Canadian schools.
^ Well, I guess it really just depends then on what you perceive to be a balanced set of schools. In my daughter’s case, she was still in the top 25th percentile even for her Reach schools. But any college accepting 15% of less of its applicant pool must be deemed a high reach for anyone - regardless of stats. So the rejections that came from her 8 reach schools were not unexpected. But the rejections from 4 out of 5 of her solid match schools were surprising. In her case, applying to 8 reaches, 5 matches and 4 safeties seemed like a well-balanced approach. She applied to so many because she was really hoping for an acceptance from one of the reach schools.
That same year, 3 years ago, there was a post here on CC from a kid with a 4.0 unweighted GPA, 35 ACT and 2300+ SAT who was rejected everywhere accept for his in-state safety. So my point is… it can happen. And it is simply better to be safe than sorry.
Again… the best strategy may be an early admit to a school you would not mind going to… as that would remove a lot of the stress from this process.
I suspect the problem was the list and your assessment of what was a match. My D2 applied to 8 carefully selected schools and got into all of them, including her reaches. Getting into reaches isn’t an independent event, either – what keeps you out of one will very likely keep you out of the rest as well. Increasing the number of reaches on your list doesn’t do much to improve your odds of acceptance.
@WWWard , re the 2300 SAT student, that isn’t uncommon. Those stories appear each April on this site. Totally agree that sub 20% acceptance rate colleges are reaches for all. Also agree that EA or ED is a great idea. Nothing relieves stress like an early acceptance.
17 is far too many, IMO. If the student likes the safeties, I think two or three are fine. Your D did get into a match, and that’s great. Matches aren’t sure things. Impossible to know why she didn’t get into the other four, but she applied to enough schools to ensure she got into at least one she was happy about. But wow, what a lot of work that must have been. Even ten apps is a lot of work. And as somone said earlier, finding the match and safeties is hard work too. It’s easy to find reaches.
OP, this is all useful info for your sister. It’s important or her to be realistic and honest about her stats when the time comes.