Help! Oberlin or Dickinson?

Parents Forum
1

<p>My D has narrowed it down to two. She's decided the schools that waitlisted her can take a hike, and the schools that failed to show her enough love (money) will have to do without her. </p>

<p>She really likes both Oberlin and Dickinson, but can't decide between the two. The ticket price is almost identical. The financial aid is similar, although Dickinson offered a little bit more dough and Oberlin offered more of it in 4-year scholarship than one-year-at-a-time grant money. </p>

<p>Dickinson is closer to home. A lot closer. That's an advantage to my D. She's not one of those kids who desires to be far away from mommy and daddy. </p>

<p>Oberlin is better known, I think. More selective, more prestige perhaps. But in what way is that a benefit other than psychic?</p>

<p>Dickinson actually has a career services department---with it's own building, something that does not appear to be common among LACs. Oberlin? Well, they say they prepare you to think, not to get a job (ouch). My D has no desire to earn a PhD and become a professor.</p>

<p>Oberlin has a "cooler" campus. The town of Oberlin is smaller than Carlisle but less "hick?"</p>

<p>Oberlin has no frats or sororities, which is a plus in its favor. Dickinson has some Greek life, about 25% of the student body, but there is no eating in frats and sororities---they eat with all the other students. But take it from me, the dining at Dickinson could not be more ordinary and blah. Yet, the traditional dining at Oberlin is nothing special either, except for the Co-ops. My D is a vegetarian, so this might be a plus. </p>

<p>Dickinson has better dorms.</p>

<p>Culturally, Dickinson feels just right (to me). Oberlin may be TOO liberal. </p>

<p>Neither college has much diversity (my D is biracial). </p>

<p>Which is the better college? Oberlin or Dickinson?</p>

2

<p>They’re both overpriced full of pampered snots.</p>

<p>Neither will do much towards getting your D a job.</p>

<p>Once they take your money neither of them will give a
hoot about you.</p>

<p>Dickinson is a wanna be Swarthmore that has manipulated
its stats to rise up the usnews rankings and Oberlin is a once
top school that is becoming a tuition discounter.</p>

<p>Dickinson has managed to entice lots of chumps with years of
aggressive marketing. Oberlin has relied on its name and endownment,
both of which are in decline. If your D is a minority she’ll be an
oddity on the Dickinson campus. Oberlin’s minority population is
declining rapidly and school finances are managed by idiots.</p>

<p>What exactly does your d want to study? What do these places offer
that cheaper places don’t? Is there a plan B?</p>

1 Like
3

<p>Plainsman, I’m going to visit Dickinson on Monday and I’ll offer you my thoughts then. Just as an aside, I vote for closer to home for a person who’s happier that way.</p>

4

<p>^^ I don’t see why a Plan B is necessary, at all. The OP’s D has done an excellent job of finding her “fit.” Oberlin vs. Dickinson is an unusual dilemma to have, but I can see the different appeals. What are your D’s academic interests?</p>

5

<p>Oberlin has a stronger academic reputation and its students have stronger stats.</p>

<p>On the FA front, a 4-year scholarship sounds better than 1-year grants that can go away.</p>

6

<p>Plainsman, a coworkers S is a freshman at Dickinson and seems to really like it. He was sal of a smaller public HS near Pittsburgh. He is, by the way, far from a pampered snot, and doesn’t seem to think that of his classmates.</p>

7

<p>You and your daughter have done a thorough, thoughtful job of asking the fit questions. I don’t think any of us can tell you which of those factors matter most to her.</p>

<p>Forgive me if I’m misreading (with some clues from previous posts), but your concluding question, “Which is the better college?” seemed like a little bit of a non sequitur after your carefully considered list of pros and cons. If buried in that question was some worry about rejecting the “better” college for the better fit . . . both are fine LACs; I’d lay odds that your D will have a fantastic experience at either. Let her go with her gut.</p>

8

<p>I was also accepted at Dickinson, and though I ultimately am deciding to decline their offer because of location, I must say that, out of all my colleges, they have the nicest admissions officers. I got to meet the admissions officer who accepted me and gave me a scholarship, offering to arrange contact with any department and relating his own Dickinson stories. I’m not big on Greek life but the sorority girl who showed me around was very down-to-earth and sweet. In short, I don’t know anything about Oberlin, but the people I met at Dickinson were all very friendly and welcoming to me, a feeling I did not get from more “prestigious” big universities.</p>

9

<p>Wow Speedo, how do you REALLY feel?</p>

10

<p>i feel great - and I will agree with the op on the dining
experience - I felt like I was right back in high school or
maybe 13th grade - horrendous. The State U down the pike
in Shippensburg now there’s some real Pennsylvania food!
On my last visit to the Admissions office, I was half asleep
in the chair listening to some punk Admissions officer try to
persuade some obviously loaded parents that D was the right
place for their son. “He’s the perfect fit! Have you considered
ED?” They were soaking it up, pitiful.</p>

11

<p>Speedo: that’s a little harsh, don’t you think? Her Plan B is Penn State-University Park, but the only diversity they have is on the football and basketball teams. Penn State’s percentage of African Americans is actually lower then Oberlin’s and about the same as Dickinson. Again, it’s the least expensive option, but I am concerned about the large classes in the beginning, and my D doesn’t give a damn about big time football. She really doesn’t, and she won’t catch the fever either. But, again, it’s the least expensive option. </p>

<p>Keilexandra: My D isn’t sure what she wants to study. It changes every week. But she’s leaning toward Government, Poli Sci, or Sociology this week. Business, engineering, math, science–she wants no part of that stuff, although she’s enjoying the hell out of AP Bio right now.</p>

<p>Our second visit to Dickinson was excellent. The dorms were very nice, even for Freshman, better than the Penn State freshman dorms. Qwerkita, your experience was our experience today. </p>

<p>Father05: Agreed. We didn’t meet any pampered snots. The kids were no different than the kids we met at Penn State, except there weren’t any farm boys. But that doesn’t make them “pampered snots.” </p>

<p>My main complaint about these expensive LACs is mediocre or weak Career Placement Offices. My second complaint is the food. On campus dining options, even at Swarthmore, are EXTREMELY limited. I don’t know about my daughter, but I’d be bored to death of the food within two weeks. </p>

<p>But the small classes, which greatly facilitates learning, as does having EVERY class, without exception, taught by the professor instead of a graduate student, is such an ideal situation. Frankly, straight lecture classes with 600 students really suck. But are small classes worth the price tag? I don’t know.</p>

<p>For now, it’s Dickinson or Oberlin. Anyone know someone who attends or attended Oberlin?</p>

12

<p>I have lived near both schools so my thought are more impressions rather than first hand experience. Oberlin is highly regarded but might not be a good fit for someone who is somewhat conventional, the students tend to be ultra liberal and free spirited. (Not pampered snots, however!) Beautiful campus and close to Cleveland is a plus. Dickinson is in a beautiful part of PA, I love Harrisburg and central PA. One of my son’s classmates chose Dickinson over Notre Dame and was very service oriented, a great kid. I think it depends more on your daughter’s personality and interests and the type of people she enjoys being around. If she does not want to be far from home, then Dickinson might be a better choice. (Also NOT full of pampered snots, either!).
Good luck with your choice.</p>

13

<p>Oberlin has a very active and effective Career Services office; I’m not sure what made you think they don’t: [Oberlin</a> College Office of Career Services](<a href=“http://www2.oberlin.edu/career/]Oberlin”>http://www2.oberlin.edu/career/) .</p>

<p>And Oberlin students are anything but “pampered snots”–they’re passionately concerned about the world and its problems, and determined to use their educations to make a difference in the world. A very high percentage of the student body volunteers in the local community, and there’s an active office engaged in helping them do so: [Bonner</a> Center for Service and Learning](<a href=“http://www2.oberlin.edu/bcsl/]Bonner”>http://www2.oberlin.edu/bcsl/).</p>

<p>I think I recommended the [Oberlin</a> Blogs](<a href=“http://blogs.oberlin.edu/]Oberlin”>http://blogs.oberlin.edu/) to you on another board as a way of glimpsing what Oberlin students are actually like. The students posting there are representative–and the chance to be surrounded by peers like those is what the choice of Oberlin is all about. </p>

<p>Oberlin is one of the most distinguished institutions of higher education in the world, considerably better known and more prestigious than Dickinson (for what that’s worth). It changes the lives of its students. But whether it’s the better fit for your daughter no one else can tell you.</p>

14

<p>Oberlin is probably more diverse in the kinds of students, although they mostly lean left. If your daughter is at all interested in music, art, etc, it might be a better fit. There are kids from all over, but it’s probably a more sophistciated crowd than Dickinson. Its definitely less mainstream on the whole, but I think it attracts a more diverse crowd than a place like Bard.</p>

15

<p>

</p>

<p>That’s funny, my impression has been that the food service at some of these schools (not O or D) is WAY over the top. Back in the day, it was thin gruel in the morning, then a choice of Brown Stuff or Grey Stuff at noon and night. Now they’ve got wood-burning pizza ovens and a sushi chef.</p>

16

<p>Has your daughter gone through the college bulletins to compare gen eds and degree requirements for similar programs in each school? Does she prefer one or the other? Is there something she dislikes about the academic requirements at either school? Has she compared the study abroad offerings, if that is something she plans to take advantage of?</p>

17

<p>tk21769: I compliment you on your post: “thin gruel in the morning.” Very funny. Seriously though, the two areas where Penn State seems to have it all over the LACs are food/dining and career services. It’s not even close. </p>

<p>dave72: I’m aware that Oberlin has a career services office. Every accredited college/uni has one, even if it’s just a desk with a secretary and a mail slot. What I meant was the importance or prominence of the office. I formed my impression that career services are not stellar from the Oberlin blogs (almost every student remarked that they didn’t come to Oberlin to prepare for a specific job) and from a member of the Neuroscience faculty at a panel discussion. I asked the question of an Oberlin panel about the kinds of jobs kids interview for through “career placement services” and a professor practically sneered at me. Her response was: “many of our graduates go on for PhDs.” In other words, ‘we have a career services office but no one takes it seriously. We train future academics here, not people who want jobs at IBM or Exxon or Traveler’s Insurance.’ Let’s just say her response caused me some concern about the payoff after graduation. Perhaps this professor’s view was distorted. I plan to visit career services myself tomorrow and ask some pointed questions.</p>

<p>HeartArt: My daughter would not describe herself as conventional, although she can fit in that ‘world.’ I agree that the kids at Dickinson appear to be more conventional than what I saw on our last visit to Oberlin. But they were definitely not “pampered snots.” </p>

<p>I can definitely see some kids choosing Dickinson over Notre Dame or Oberlin or even an Ivy. The school does present itself as an “aspiring Amherst or Williams” and they fork over a lot of scholarship money to pull in kids who could get into Notre Dame or Oberlin but would not get as much money from those schools because of more competitive applicant pools. We met a few kids like that yesterday. Kids who were also accepted at places like Vassar and Colgate (and my D at Oberlin) but were offered significantly more money to come to Dickinson and were seriously considering it.</p>

<p>boysx3: My D, at the moment, is not particularly interested in study abroad. Like I said, she doesn’t really know what she wants to do careerwise. </p>

<p>One thing we learned yesterday about Dickinson that is attractive is the lack of a core curriculum. Other than a required “first year seminar” which the student picks from a list of 60 or so topics, there is only a foreign language requirement. To me a rigid core curriculum over the first two years is reminiscent of high school, but a lot of colleges/unis impose them anyway. It’s a philosophical difference, I suppose. Cornell seems kind of rigid but Brown is wide open. A school’s “ranking” does not seem to correlate with preference for a significant number of required core courses.</p>

18

<p>Is your D interested in languages because I understand that Dickinson has excellent language programs. One of my D’s friends is finishingher freshman year there and is studying Chinese. she’s a great girl, athletic , social, smart
I think she’s been very happy</p>

19

<p>

</p>

<p>That may have become a cliche, but only because it is the right answer for any good Liberal Arts College. What they mean is that they do not prepare for any specific job. They are not in the business of vocational training. Usually, they have no accounting or business, engineering or architecture major.</p>

<p>Oberlin grads typically would go on to graduate or professional school. They do have a good track record there. Or, they might go into a program such as the Peace Corps or Teach for America. Or, directly into a teaching job. A robust Career Placement Office may not be part of that culture, but it does not mean half their graduates are back to living in their parents’ basements.</p>

<p>

</p>

<p>How about Environmental Studies? Un-warming the planet should be a big growth area.
It’s interdisciplinary so she can get a taste of many fields. You can approach it from a policy angle and from a science angle. Encourage her to develop some solid laboratory skills, including statistical analysis, and she should be in demand especially if she gets some experience (internships, lab-related work-study, field work etc).</p>

20

<p>

</p>

<p>That little sniffy thing they do is just part of the attire, like tweed jackets and old school ties. There are special exercises every Ph.D. candidate has to do in front of a mirror every morning for a year before they defend their dissertations. After that, it becomes second nature.</p>