<p>Oh get OFF of these Ivies. I’ve HAD it hearing about them.</p>
<p>A possible compromise for a student with both academic and creative smarts is a top tier small elite LAC. But if Dad’s too snobby to even consider: Amherst, Williams, Reed (Oregon), Swarthmore, Oberlin, Grinnell…every single one of these has an art department. How much art does she want or need right now? Art is a lot about ideas. I know there are only a few studio teachers at a place like Oberlin, but you know who graduated from there? Julie Taymor (artistic creator of the Lion King on Broadway). I think she double majored in Religion and Art, went on to Bali to study their puppetry from the viewpoint of mythology…). Anything can happen. </p>
<p>It’s not an Art School, and I know that, but the D might like the balance of academics, creativity and personal contact nurtured at an LAC. These might be her match or reach schools.</p>
<p>I know Ivy-focussed people who turn up their noses at all the LAC’s. I also know graduate school professors who say the LAC preparation is better than the undergraduate IVY preparation. That subject (between Ivies and LAC’s) is an old one here at CC, but perhaps it is fair to ask Dad to open his mind and D to open hers.</p>
<p>Is the location of issue, in that a lot of Ivies are on the East Coast? What happened to Stanford? See, I wonder if he’s not also arguing for her to live closer to him if he lives on the East Coast.. and as Opie says, he’s half the equation here, genetically and financially. He gets to be a dork about his faves just as we are.</p>
<p>Brown/RISD is a new program that starts this year. It has a great potential, but it takes 5 years to graduate… I guess since you have to be admitted to both schools to do it, you should be able to drop out and continue in any one of them in case you don’t like the way it works? (it was my understanding that the students live and take classes at each of the two schools for half of the time, since the schools are on different schedules. It was always possible for Brown and RISD students to take classes at both schools theoretically, but the different schedules made it impractical more or less.)</p>
<p>It is my understanding that admission to Brown/RISD program is actually 3 separate admissions: Brown, RISD and then the joint program if you are admitted to both schools independently. Only 20 or so spots are available (I’m not 100% sure). So if OP’s D applies, several scenarios are possible.</p>
<p>A school in the West with a heavy focus on art is Scripps College. It is an all-ladies school, but it is next door to 4 co-ed colleges, and students mix very well and take classes all over the Consortium of 5 schools. It is also on my artsy D’s list. As a LAC, Scripps offers more than just art.</p>
<p>Thanks for all the input. I really appreciate it. It’s true that it can’t hurt her to cast a wide net and THEN decide after the fact. And yes, I know what the chances at Yale, etc. are, even for a kid with great numbers. I don’t think HE really knows that, though. It doesn’t take very long on this board to know what some of the stats are and how many kids with perfect everthing there are applying to and getting rejected from the big names. He’s back ten/twenty years ago when it was a lot easier to get into those schools than it is now. Not that it was easy, but certainly easier than it is now.</p>
<p>I don’t think this is going to be an easy process for us, no matter what we do, but my hope is that we can all try to keep open minds, more than we are doing now. I really don’t think he will refuse financial support. I was overstating in anger. Clearly, I need to look at my part in this issue as well.</p>
<p>Yah, the RISD/Brown thing is a shockingly high bar. You have to be brilliant and brilliant, and lucky. As to the 20 spots available, I wonder how many more than that would be able to qualify.</p>
<p>It <em>was</em> easier when we parents were high schoolers. I would never be accepted now to the schools I was accepted at then. I wouldn’t have the ghost of a chance.</p>
<p>Location in, or access to, NYC is very exciting for art majors at colleges and uni’s. Just adding that. Sarah Lawrence empties out on weekends because the kids go into NYC, I hear, which is GOOD for her. Vassar is a great suggestion, too, although too distant for NYC each and every weekend.</p>
<p>We did feel that Sarah Lawrence emptied out on weekends and my son didn’t apply there, though he did apply to Vassar. He has friends who are at Sarah Lawrence and at Vassar and love both. I think it’s very relativistic. Vassar kids can easily go to NYC but are more likely to stay on campus. Huge opportunities to do artsy film-related drama stuff. Big art history program there also.</p>
<p>Cardinal Fang, you are so right! I keep telling H that there’s no way he could get into an Ivy today, and he gets pretty miffed, but its true. All the schools are asking so much from kids today.</p>
<p>Heron, What’s your daughter’s idea of a perfect school? Does she know so that she can articulate her reasons or is she unsure herself which may be why her father wants her to widen her scope? </p>
<p>I’m coming in late to this discussion but I would reiterate what others have said: Yale and Brown (even without the RISD link) have excellent art departments and have graduated many successful working artists. My son chose the route of studio art within a liberal arts setting (at Williams) and it worked well for him, but I have to agree that it’s a matter of fit and personal preference. </p>
<p>If your daughter wants to be surrounded by kids who eat, sleep and breathe art 24/7 then art school is a better fit.</p>
<p>Time’s getting a bit short for preparing applications. I see no problem with exporting this problem to the future. Apply to Yale, apply to Brown. Apply to the art schools and a few colleges/universities with strong art departments and see where the dice fall in April.</p>
<p>Having the money issue left in a vague sort of limbo is a bit unsettling. I think that’s a point that needs to get clarified fast.</p>
<p>I have a friend who lives and breathes art. Naturally, art school was the only way to go and he got into a very prestigious institute. Now he hates art school because his interpretation of art is entirely different from his professor’s, to the point where he refused to turn in the final assignment for one class and accepted the F over succumbing to the teacher. </p>
<p>Ray192 – Picking an art school is really tricky. Many people think art school = art school, but just as with LA colleges, each one is different, with a different philosophy and different ways of approaching learning. Some are more flexible in their approach, some are less so (especially in the first year.) They approach academics differently as well. Some are big into obserbational art, some more conceptual. Getting as much information as you can is very important. My D’s top choice has now fallen, to the point where she isn’t even sure she will apply, because of their approach and philosophy. But she would never had known that unless she really investigated. Just as in any schools, the big names aren’t necessarily the best schools for a given student.</p>
<p>A friend’s D was SURE she wanted to go to art school, but her artist mom and an artist friend persuaded her to apply to some LACs too. She’s a VERY heppy first-year at Hampshire</p>
<p>Smith is a great, well regarded but still (imo) under-rated school. My D, whom I’d thought would never go to a women’s college, is now a senior and has had a spectacular experience there.</p>
<p>She should keep her options open. We have an arts student in this household too. He applied to some major universities (with good programs in his arts field) just in case he changed his mind about major once he GOT there. We know more than one student in the arts who changed their mind about majorin in the arts either after applying, or after enrolling. For a couple of students who attended “arts only” institutions, this meant transferring (one was at a music conservatory and the other at a major school of the arts). For a couple of students…the decided after applying and either auditioning or submitting portfolios AND getting accepted, that they didn’t want to pursue these interests. In those cases, they were very happy to have had other options to consider come April.</p>
<p>And…applying doesn’t necessarily mean acceptance or that the student will enroll. </p>
<p>Agreed with NSM…will this parent contribute to the costs if the student does NOT attend the school of his choice?</p>