<p>Its hard for me to see how Smith could possibly be underrated. its highly selective, has a rich history, many famous alums and is a Seven Sisters college.</p>
<p>DKE, Smith’s acceptance rate bounces around on either side of the 50 percent mark, SAT scores are de-emphasized and the average is probably somewhere in the 1300’s (partly, but not completely, due to many young women having not so hot Math scores), and the term “Seven Sisters” has little to significance to this generation for whom the Ivies, and the Little Ivies (AWS), offer outstanding opportunities co-ed. I do believe that Smith is a great “admissions value” as someone once said but given all said at the beginning of this post, it’s not as highly regarded as it might be.</p>
<p>Btw, for the OP, Smith has its own art museum and its Art majors, both History and Studio, are pretty well regarded.</p>
<p>Vassar has a wonderful art history program and a terrific art museum on campus. Its studio art program, however, is not particularly strong.</p>
<p>I’d suggest that she look at Washington University in Saint Louis which has an outstanding art school within the university. She (and her dad) may be very pleasantly surprised.</p>
<p>Her Dad doesn’t sound terrifically open to surprises.</p>
<p>We have many friends who are practicing artists and/or art professors and their range of educational experience is quite wide. Some went to pure art school, then did an MFA at a university. Some did the opposite: BA in liberal arts then MFA at art school. Some just did art school and picked up the rest through self-education. </p>
<p>My husand did a BFA and MFA at an art school. He was older at the time (mid-20’s) and many of his peers already had BA’s or even careers in totally unrelated fields. After observing the ideas and different disciplines that our son was exposed to at his LAC, my husband says if he were to do it over again he would definitely get a BA first.</p>
<p>I’m not “down” on artschool. As I said it’s a matter of personal choice – just as some kids want business school or architecture or (in Europe) even medical school from day one. And the decision, whatever it is, is not irrovocable. Many kids transfer from art schools to liberal arts and vice versa. There’s a parent who posts on the Arts board (name escapes me, sorry) whose daughter started in art school, transferred to an LAC, then transferred back to art school because she missed the intensity.</p>
<p>I would say again, however, that the financial thing needs to be clearly spelled out. Art school too is pricy and it would be better to hash things out with the father now rather than take a chance later.</p>
<p>We’ve all had a long talk. All is well. (For the moment!) </p>
<p>Bottom line: So many choices, so little time.</p>
<p>Heron,</p>
<p>Tufts has a wonderful combined BA/BS and BFA program.</p>
<p><a href=“http://www.smfa.edu/PDFs/Hbooks/2007_Combined_Degree_Hbook.pdf[/url]”>http://www.smfa.edu/PDFs/Hbooks/2007_Combined_Degree_Hbook.pdf</a></p>
<p>One the one hand do what Northstarmom recommends. She can throw her aps. But, her Dad needs to know that the odds for any Ivies are in no ones favor so that when/if she isn’t accepted he won’t withdraw financial support. I can see and completely understand someone doing that under her circumstances.</p>
<p>On the other hand what would be so terrible if she applied to a couple and didn’t sabotage her ap. My own DDs really don’t know what they want until they see it so maybe, she applies, she looks into it more closely, she gets in, she falls in love. </p>
<p>I think a compromise that works for your D is the best course of action.</p>
<p>She wouldn’t throw her apps. We’ll be casting a wide net and making decisions later. It’s the right way to go.</p>
<p>Way to go on talking it out with D and your EX.</p>
<p>This can all work out. My EX and I approached the college issue as something that we both wanted (college) and needed to assist in making happen for the best of our son (financially). But, each of us discussed the level and conditions of our financial assistance with our S seperately. </p>
<p>We were fortunate that S took over the process of applications and selection of schools to which to apply. So, EX and I each talked to S, but basically stayed out of the selection process. When the acceptances were “in,” I asked him to provide me the costs of each school. He said that he had decided to go to “X” school which was the one that had offered very substantial merit $$.</p>
<p>When the amount necessary above the scholarship money was determined, EX and I agreed to split it. WIN, WIN, WIN.</p>
<p>I agree that having D “throw” apps is NOT the way to go. No one, including EX’s, likes to be “played.” And it is a terrible lesson to give your young adult child AND, when it blows up, it could be highly damaging to the relationship between D and Dad. </p>
<p>Let D carry the brunt of this. My S and I worked through all our issues w/o Mom and so did Mom w/o my “help.”</p>
<p>I’m glad the three of you worked it out Heron. I hope that you can see that your ex sincerely wishes the best for your daughter. Art is a hard row to hoe. If it were my daughter, I’d be pushing her to attend the best school she could and I’d insist on a liberal arts education–not art school. The odds of anybody becoming economically self-sufficient as an artist are very low. It is far more likely that she will make her living doing something else, with art as a sideline. It makes NO sense to me to forego a liberal arts degree in favor of a narrowly focused art school experience given the probabilities out there for working artists.</p>
<p>Very, very wise advise! Couldn’t agree more!
“If it were my daughter, I’d be pushing her to attend the best school she could and I’d insist on a liberal arts education–not art school. The odds of anybody becoming economically self-sufficient as an artist are very low. It is far more likely that she will make her living doing something else, with art as a sideline. It makes NO sense to me to forego a liberal arts degree in favor of a narrowly focused art school experience given the probabilities out there for working artists.”</p>
<p>I know a lot of people making a go as artists, but in more practical parts of the field. I know several illustrators, one who does book covers, and a bunch of art teachers. All of them do more serious painting on the side. I also know a couple of artists doing imaging work at a med school.</p>
<p>Art really isn’t a bad bet in terms of employment, depending on your major. Sure, if you major in painting, you might be in trouble. But as mathmom says, illustration is a good bet as are graphic design and industrial design. (I’m sure there are others as well.) So many kids come out of LA colleges these days with no idea of what they want to do! I really don’t think art schools – that can really train one for a job – are a bad idea. </p>
<p>That said, an open mind and a wide net, that’s my mantra. Thanks all for your opinions and support.</p>
<p>what we discovered while looking at “art schools”- or schools with a narrow focus of study, was that OTHER opportunities might not be so available, things that people may not realize they want</p>
<p>My D ONLY wanted an Urban city school with an untraditional campus UNTIL she saw a school in a city with a more traditional campus…she didn’t realize that she indeed wanted more of a traditional experience</p>
<p>My advice is to visit at least one school that is an Art University- it may be a perfect fit, it may not be</p>
<p>We in SF have the Academy of Art University- my younger D took a couple of classes there= loved the classes, but the school itself, while wonderful, was not what she realized she has in mind</p>
<p>Citygirlsmom: I don’t think that AAU is really representative of an art school – it’s not selective, and unfortunately many of the students are there largely because they have no goals or aim and are being indulged by parents. My daughter has taken a number of classes there, and would consider it to be the equivalent of community colleges in relationship to LACs. AAU also has other complicated issues; because it’s “for profit” and has huge real estate holdings, it’s frequently accused of being a real estate speculation company more than an art school. (That is, the school exists to create tenants for all the rental properties the school owns.)</p>
<p>Thanks for the interesting thread. It’s cool to hear all the points of view, especially of parents who want their students in a LAC with an art department, and not an art school My son is at a great LAC. My daughter, however, feels <em>very</em> strongly that she doesn’t want to be at a LAC, but a true art school – Parsons, FIDM, FIT, etc. I used to be a lot more stressed about that, but it’s become clear to me that she’s very focused on becoming a successful artist/businesswoman, and not just sitting in a studio painting. While I would normally be of the “go to a LAC” school of thought, I think if I pushed that on my daughter, she’d just drop out and never complete any schooling at all. She pretty much hates traditional academic classes, struggles writing essays, etc. When she can present her ideas visually, she excels, but I don’t think college professors will be as likely to accept her essays in comic book style as her high school teachers have been. </p>
<p>I have never been concerned that my daughter would not be able to support herself with an art degree. Her work is very pop-culture and commercially viable, to the point that she’s been making money selling it via the web for some time now. I sort of feel bad for her sometimes that her academic courseload at her high school is so rigorous that she can’t keep up the demand for her artistic work – there are only so many hours in a day. </p>
<p>Now my <em>son</em>, I fully expect him to be a starving academic for much of his life. :-)</p>
<p>A friend of my d’s is very happy at the Tyler School of Art, which is one of the schools at Temple University. It has a Core Curriculum in addition to the art, and students can take classes at Temple’s main campus as well as at Tyler.</p>
<p>My D is finishing her first semester at Brown and will almost definitely concentrate (major) in Fine Arts. She is a very talented artist (not only my opinion-- others have said so 
) but she did not want an art school for undergrad. She can take courses at RISD which is a big draw, but interestingly, the other day she said she didn’t think she needed to; Brown’s department seems to be fine. She absolutely loves it (school in general and art department in specific) and although it is definitely hard to get into, she did it with good grades and scores, good ECs, a fine slide portfolio (definitely submit this supplement wherever you apply), extra-curricular art classes, RD, No legacy, No URM, NYC residence. It is possible!</p>