High-achieving student with "lite" senior year courseload - chances?

Parent Cafe
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<p>Suppose, we have a student at highly-competitive, high demanding public school which by the end of her junior year has stats like this:</p>

<p>SAT 1: 800, 800, 750;
SAT 2: 800, 790, 780, 700;
GPA: 4+ (the only her B's so far were PE ones ;-));
AP's: Mus. Theory, APUSH, French, Calc BC;
Honor classes: Physics, Chem, Pre-Calc, French 4.
Member of 4 school clubs, officer of 3 of them, president of 1.5 of them.
Has some local and national honors and awards in various academic contests, including 1st place at national-level language competition; will present US team at the international-level olimpiad this summer (not in the very popular academic field).
Usually liked by grown-ups, so teacher's recs might be good if only those teachers will be forgiving for unavoidable sleepiness in their classes. ;-)
Plays 2.5 instruments, has state-level honor for one them, plays other at the local pre-professional youth orchestra; passionate about choir singing - with multiple getting to regional and All-State Honor Choirs, informal self-started community service as the TA and accompanist in choir classes of her former middle school, being sectional leader and occasional temporary conductor at her high school choir, awarded as the "best in the subject" by her h/s; uses her musical abilities as the means of "community service" and occasional money earnings.
No sports whatsoever. :-(</p>

<p>That said, she really disliked her life this past junior year with 2-5 hours of sleep nightly, had some health problems and not enough time to pursue her real passions - music and languages (that is, to practice her instruments and TO READ anything beyond the school requirements :-(). So, she tries to get herself a senior year schedule which would let her have more time for her passions and for more enjoyable life.</p>

<p>So far, it's more or less certain she will have the following classes on her schedule:</p>

<p>AP English
AP US Gov/Econ
Concert Choir
Jazz Choir
Jazz Band</p>

<p>There might or might not be AP Statistics which offered at her school in the after-school time (conflicting with many school-related ECs) and is not guaranteed to seniors who already had taken AP Calculus (even though being an only math class left to take for such students at her school). She had also planned to study some new foreign language at community college.</p>

<p>The problem is, she created herself such a schedule in March (I expressed my concern here at cc about her not taking any AP sciences ;)) and found out about possible unavailability of AP Stats and after-school time conflicts with her favorite school EC just recently (and c/college language classes as well) , as the school year ended. That left her (and me, consequently) to worry all the summer what to do with her schedule next year. </p>

<p>The thing is, she worked so hard all this years, achieved enough to be considered by any selective colleges, so it would be a pity to blow all this with the unwise course selection for the senior year. On the other hand, it would be cruel to deprive such a student of the things she REALLY likes to do. </p>

<p>As of now, she is considering to through away that AP Stats class from her schedule for the sake of being able to be in school musical (which requires enormous time commitment); or, to make the most of the school day and to reduce after-school time conflicts, to take some first-level language class at her school instead of the college one (which means sitting in the class with the hs freshmen, doing elementary level of work ;-)); or, to take multiple foreign languages (either, at school and/or c/college) without any math or science courses. I try to promote the idea of taking some advance math class at c/college or on-line, or to take AP Comp Science at her school, but with no success. ;)</p>

<p>Her preliminary college list (as of now), however, is ambitious enough (including Ivies, top UCs and whatnot) to be cautious about such a "lightheaded" decision as eliminating all math and science courses from her workload. </p>

<p>Could such a decision be "justified" and "compensated" for adcoms by her strong passions, previous achievements and high involvement into most time-consuming school-related extracurricular activity?</p>

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<p>check your pm for a reply</p>

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<p>I see that she has taken Calc BC as a junior. You can argue that she really doesn't need any more math for college admissions purposes. I don't see any reason for taking AP stats.</p>

<p>But only having 2 college prep classes in your senior year for someone who is shooting for selective colleges seems "off" to me.</p>

<p>Could you add another year of French or maybe a non-honors bio class to the mix and take out one of the music classes?</p>

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<p>does she go to lynbrook? haha
cuz those classes looks strangely familiar
especially with the whole AP stats situation</p>

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<p>My D had a study hall her senior year, and is now in a highly selective school. BUT, she had pretty much exhausted her class choices, and still took 5 academic classes - French IV (no AP at her school back then), AP Physics, Cal AB, AP English Lit, and AP Gov and Econ (one semester each).
I think for admissions she will be fine forgoing AP Stats just "to take a math", what sciences has she taken? Any AP science at all? Are there any other non-AP sciences to take, or history classes?</p>

<p>Another approach would be to write essays about choosing her classes this year, and weighing academics with music. What does the GC say? Will she get that important "most difficult class schedule possible" check box.</p>

<p>My D was admitted ED, and while her grades remained fairly good, her AP scores weren't the greatest, because she realized she would get no credit, no matter how highly she scored. They also ha a choice with Gov/Econ, they could elect to take one or both of the exams, she chose to take only one, again becasue no credit.</p>

<p>At her school the high school musical is all in the spring, so you could even drop one class if it was unnecessary for graduation - I'm not pushing that idea, truly, just a thought.</p>

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<p>"Could you add another year of French or maybe a non-honors bio class to the mix and take out one of the music classes?"</p>

<p>She had already taken all French available at her school, took non-honors bio in 9th grade and absolutely refuses to take any music classes out of her schedule.</p>

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<p>"what sciences has she taken? Any AP science at all? Are there any other non-AP sciences to take, or history classes?"</p>

<p>She took bio (no honors in her school), honors physics and honors chem. Decided not to take any AP sciences because of lack of interest in them as well as lack of really good science teachers at her school. There are no other history classes in her school - she had taken everything avaliable.</p>

<p>As to "most difficult" chekbox I can't say for sure, because, on one hand her school's GCs strongly discourage students to take more than 2 APs per year, on the other hand most ambitious students do take 4-5 APs nevertheless.</p>

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<p>In that case, let her enjoy her senior year with the schedule she has. If she gets into her selective colleges, great. Worse case scenario, she might have to "settle" for a second tier UC, but if she is OK with that, great.</p>

<p>Life is all about the choices we make...</p>

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<p>"she might have to "settle" for a second tier UC, but if she is OK with that, great."</p>

<p>Which of them are good in her favorite fields - music, languages and linguistics?</p>

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<p>Sometimes your kids are who they are. My son made some choices that may well have kept him from getting into his top choice colleges. OTOH he had a very happy stressfree life in high school and he's still going to an excellent college. Possibly one where he'll be happier than where he thought he wanted to attend.</p>

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<p>With those kind of stats, I think she'll still get in where she wants. She just has to express that music and languages are her passion. Music majors aren't expected to be that great at physics. Let her follow her passions and she will get where she wants with her obvious strengths(amazing test scores, etc.).</p>

<p>And if languages is what she likes, and she is at a national level, that is a big draw, not a hinderance.</p>

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<p>UC Berkeley probably good with linguistics.</p>

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<p>Aw jeez. If you push her you risk her literally breaking down once she gets to college. Let her follow her choice here. Honestly, the only times I pushed my kids, once for each, I regretted each and it backfired. No breakdowns, but just no particularly good outcomes.</p>

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<p>"UC Berkeley probably good with linguistics."</p>

<p>I'm sure it is.;) But I asked about "second-tier" UCs aka "safeties". I know about UCSC having strong liguistics and decent music, but it's generally considered 3rd-tier ... she might be fine there, too, but it would kinda waste of her hard work all those years.</p>

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<p>I concur with posters who say to let her follow her own bliss. She will certainly end up someplace wonderful. I think it's too much to go for college courses just for her resume. I think her accomplishments speak for themselves already. My S refused to take AP Chem even though he says he wants to be a doctor. I did both school play and school musical. I had to remember that he was living his life, not just preparing for future life. He ended up having choice of Top Research U., Ivy, and top LAC. (He wasn't interested in HYPS because he feels competition too fierce. Work on supplementary material (musical tapes). They will make her case as will her essays in which her passion for her own areas and her strategies will speak for her.</p>

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<p>I don't think this is a panic situation at all. I think the "story" that she's doing what she likes is fine.</p>

<p>I also agree that AP Stats adds nothing important to her picture, so I would just forget about that and its problems.</p>

<p>I do, however, see two problems. She's really light on science, and her transcript will not exactly communicate a passion for languages and literature. It will communicate a passion for music, but you have to be an awfully good musician for that to carry you into the kinds of schools to which she wants to go. Chances are -- like thousands of kids with a passion for music -- she's not that good.</p>

<p>So I would think about doing one of two things: (1) Adding some challenging science course. It doesn't have to be AP anything. My kids' school had some great non-AP electives in Biochemistry, Organic Chemistry, and Astronomy. There must be some decent science teacher there; take whatever he/she is teaching. (2) Set up an independent study in French literature. The AP curriculum doesn't exhaust the subject. Go deep: Read the first two (or more) books of Proust and some commentary (there's lots of it). Or read all of Racine or Flaubert. Four or five more Balzacs. Chretien de Troyes. Anyway, something deep and cool, with some papers, to show that she has real academic interests that she's pursuing.</p>

<p>The school ought to be willing to give you a hand here. She's obviously a great student and a great candidate, and the school should want her to shine.</p>

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<p>I have to admit this would worry me. Your comment about your DD wasting her work tells us you do care about the prestige of the college she attends. If both of you feel this way, I would not let senior year be any less rigorous than others.</p>

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<p>from a student that just finished senior year and is immensely happy with my college decision and upcoming college career:</p>

<p>let her take what she wants. she will excel and perform above and beyond your expectations if she tailors her schedule to what she wants. she will study harder and work longer if she's doing something she's passionate about. after all, if her "hook" for colleges is that she's hugely into music (she uses it as a type of community service even!) then it makes perfect sense for her to take more music/languages and less math and science. </p>

<p>for what its worth: one of my friends was in a similar situation. she could have either taken a really tough courseload (which "looks good" to selective colleges) or pursue a bunch of extracurriculars she wanted to do (stuco, v soccer capt, 2 jobs, volunteer) that a tough schedule wouldn't allow. she went with the easy schedule and extracurriculars, then wrote a KILLER essay about her choice and how she made it (which she could tweak to fit almost every question) and is off to yale next fall. (read: she took zero APs senior year and is sitll going to her top choice!)</p>

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<p>JHS: I agree with your ideas about non-lab science & French (Rimbaud + Gide my favorites), but we S had a different experience w/music. Many top schools have weak (or in the case of Brown none at all) performance programs. Really talented musicians are heading off into conservatory programs or audition only BM programs. Liberal Arts programs at unis or LAC's are looking for musicians to fill their majors and staff their ensembles. My S is "not that good" in youur parlance, not Juilliard level by any means and several of his acceptance letters mentioned "his wonderful supplental tapes".</p>

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<p>"Your comment about your DD wasting her work tells us you do care about the prestige of the college she attends"</p>

<p>Then I'd better explain it. ;) Most of my concern is not about prestige per ce; it could rather be described as concern of 2 things:</p>

<ol>
<li><p>the college name-recognition for employers/grad schools which, it seems to me is especiallly beneficial for undergrads with the "non-practical" majors (which my D with her interests is likely to pursue ;));</p></li>
<li><p>it's social and intellectual "fit" as well as the quality of students' life.</p></li>
</ol>

<p>A year ago, when I first suggested to her to take a look at UCSC as a safety, she gave me a weird look, like "can you imagine me falling THAT low?" (personally, I've heard UCSC is a great school, but that what Her Ambiciousness felt about it ... then ;)).</p>

<p>But right now, after that crazy junior year, she claims that she will be fine wherever she would have enough sleep. ;) :(</p>