<p>If she has study halls, get those relabeled - Self-study AP french or whatever.</p>
<p>She has amazing test scores, very good grades, and is a national caliber linguist - Those will draw in the vast vast vast majority of schools. If she can show that she is still progressing, she'll have a very good shot at any school in the nation.</p>
<p>"What options do you mean?"</p>
<p>"*1. First-year students usually register for their entire first-semester program at Scripps. Second-semester, they may register for one course at one of the other Claremont Colleges.</p>
<ol>
<li><p>Sophomores may register for one course per semester at one of the other Claremont Colleges.</p></li>
<li><p>Juniors and seniors may register for up to one half of their courses in each semester at another of The Claremont Colleges.</p></li>
<li><p>Cross-registration for courses in excess of those outlined above must have the signed permission of the student’s adviser. ....*</p></li>
</ol>
<p>It looks kinda limiting for me, considering my D's "hassle-hating" personality. She is very likely to end-up in female-dominated environment, which would be unfortunate for her. ;)</p>
<p>
[quote]
She feels uncomfortable, however, with the idea of going to some remote and small-ish place, possibly, in the middle of nowhere with limited choice of classes and people; with her uncertain career plans and "average" social skills, she thinks that big enough school, with the vast array of options to explore and the diverse student body would suit her better.
[/quote]
Has she visited Amherst? Not in the middle of nowhere, not really. Nor is Williams. Or Swarthmore. And I believe that moms and dads from those places, ejr1, interesteddad, momrath, on this board, would say that their kids have not experience limited classes etc.</p>
<p>Don't get me wrong. Neither of my kids would consider LACs. Despite my urgings. But I at least made them visit so I knew they meant it:).</p>
<p>Having gone through the application process in California and with a kid heavily into music, my observations, for what they are worth, are: 1. with those grades and SAT scores, your daughter is on well her way to getting into any UC she applies to, if she takes an appropriately rigorous courseload in senior year. The one she proposes is not rigorous enough and might cost her acceptance into Cal or UCLA, which are both excellent schools for linguistics and music. Other excellent UC's are UCSD, UCSB and UCD. They all have lots of music opportunities. 2. JHS is correct that the kids who get into the top Ivy league schools (at least Harvard, Yale, and Princeton) with music as their "hook" are outstanding musicians.</p>
<p>"If she has study halls"</p>
<p>She doesn't - at her school students may have from 5 to 7 classes each semester; by their junior year people who have all 7 classes become rare. Some concentrate heavily on advanced academics - take 4-5 AP's and nothing more, others - try to balance 2-3 APs with arts, journalism, busyness and other special interest electives.</p>
<p>Looks like at her school with it's tendency for overloading students with homework taking more than 5 of ANY academic classes (especially honors or AP ones) is considered "suicidal". :( But would colleges take it into consideration?</p>
<p>"kids who get into the top Ivy league schools (at least Harvard, Yale, and Princeton) with music as their "hook" are outstanding musicians."</p>
<p>Right now her linguistic achievements look more of a "hook" than the musical ones. ;) But I'm not sure what kind of colleges they are really a "hook" for.</p>
<p>I'm sorry if this is a bit out of line, but perhaps you and your daughter are in aa bit of a tug-of-war. You both seem to shy away from compromises, and each of you seems to have a very strong point of view. My favorite expression is "The perfect is the enemy of the good."</p>
<p>If your daughter knows what the conseuences of her decision might be and still feels adamant about her position then I say, que sera sera, whatever will be will be. She is a wonderful student. I don't think you need To be so anxious about the future. Neither of my children is as compulsive or competitive as I am. Lucky for them! Their decisions worked out fine for them. And if they had had to learn the hard way they would have had to. The worst that can happen here is that she won't get into one of the most competitive UC schools.</p>
<p>
[quote]
4. Cross-registration for courses in excess of those outlined above must have the signed permission of the student’s adviser. ..
[/quote]
</p>
<p>They just want to make sure people aren't using Scripps as an in to one of the other campuses. Believe me, if your daughter had good reason to take a language, music, or any other course at one of the different colleges, it would not be a problem. As juniors and seniors, students can take half of their courses at the other colleges, with no special treatment whatsoever.
That doesn't sound limiting to me at all, and if you see the campus and what they have to offer, you probably wouldn't think so either.</p>
<p>My son is at Pomona, and there really is no problem taking courses at the other schools. They also attend parties on all the campuses. I remember our handsome tour guide when we were looking at Claremont/McKenna- he had taken a break from visiting the Scripps pool (which is the best, they say,) and was planning to go back to the( girls) pool as soon as our tour was over. Lots of mixing. My son took squash for his PE requirement, and all PE courses are a mix of all the schools. The dining halls and cafes are for all the students. The library is for all the students.
I wouldn't brush Scripps off before she even has a chance to explore it. You both might be pleasantly surprised. (if I sound like I'm pushing it, I must be honest and say if I could have a "do over", Scripps would be my 1st choice, :))</p>
<p>And about Pomona - I'm not sure what courses you feel they want that your daughter doesn't have--she's taken chem, bio and physics, calc BC-- so I don't think there would be a problem with admission requirements. She seems to have done it all already - what's not to like? They also really like kids with language interests (they are one of the few schools that actually has language requirements for graduation), and they tout their music groups for their excellence--they need kids with passion to keep them strong.</p>
<p>myau, if the question in your heart is, "Will my daughter get into Harvard with this schedule," I think Northstarmom has given you the answer. Probably not. And if your D found her junior year to be too much, it's probably just as well. A lot of these kids who get into Harvard and Princeton and succeed are the very very durable type. The kind who thrive with no sleep and love the pressure and pile it on and ask for more. It seems to be a temperament thing. Or else they are kids who really are brilliant brilliant kids in one particular area. </p>
<p>For your D if she isn't super-tough then her brilliant brilliant piece could be languages. But in that case, she'd be better off studing Aramaic or something:).</p>
<p>You all really need to think about what places she'd be happy in and why. IMHO. Because with the intelligence she has exhibited so far she has no issue in terms of life success at this stage of her life that a school is going to address..</p>
<p>"You both seem to shy away from compromises"</p>
<p>On the opposite, I'm more the willing to find the compromise between saving letting her breath and not compromising her future.</p>
<p>"If your daughter knows what the conseuences of her decision might be and still feels adamant about her position then I say, que sera sera, whatever will be will be."</p>
<p>That's why I started this discussion. I'll give it to her to read so that she will see different points of view on the subject. I also very strongly encourage her to go and talk with her school GC every year before choosing her next year clases. So far, she kept getting away without it. I hope, this time (starting the senior year) she will not. My goal is to get her making ** informed** decisions. So far, she didn't have enough time or, sometimes, motivation to get really informed. ;)</p>
<p>"You all really need to think about what places she'd be happy in and why"</p>
<p>If only I knew what those places are ...</p>
<p>Myau- relax. Your daughter will end up finding a wonderful place where she can thrive. She is obviously a talented, mutli-dimensional person who has many talents she can explore.</p>
<p>Don't let this current tussle set the tone for her senior year, i.e. you pushing her (or gently prodding her) to work to her capacity; her pushing back that she feels overwhelmed and tired. Not a good way to set the stage for a productive senior year-- there are too many other pressures going on, not to mention the financial constraints that you've alluded to. </p>
<p>If the GC is savvy and helpful, s/he ought to be able to educate your daughter as to how kids with her stats and a light load senior year have done in admissions. If the GC is not, you will probably need a longer list of schools to explore to make sure you've got some options you can afford, that she's happy with, and that match what she's all about.</p>
<p>If it were my kid places like Rice, Skidmore, Wellesley, Barnard, Connecticut College, Muehlenberg, Brandeis, McGill, Sarah Lawrence, Bryn Mawr would be on my initial list (unless you decide to limit it to West Coast schools.) Merit money possibilities at some, lower ticket price at some, maybe need based aid at some. A savvy GC can help you figure out how to position her course load so she looks like someone who is focusing on her passions rather than someone who is taking a chill year after burning out- some of these schools will be more receptive than others to this message.</p>
<p>"On the opposite, I'm more the willing to find the compromise between saving letting her breath and not compromising her future."</p>
<p>Other than probably drastically lowering her chances of gaining admission to Ivies and similar colleges (which are reaches anyway for everyone even for those with your D's excellent stats), the only possible problem I can see with the sched that she wants is making it more difficult for her to go into a science or math related field, since those virtually require that students take rigorous science and math courses senior year in h.s.</p>
<p>Since, however, that doesn't seem to be your D's aim, and since students only get one shot at being a high school senior, if your D's dream is to immerse herself into music related activities, including by performing on stage, this could be one of the best chances in her life to do so. Why? The competition for high school musical and theater groups is much less than it is at most colleges and in community theaters (and, of course in professional groups).</p>
<p>So, this could be your D's main chance in life to be a star doing something that she may enjoy, but (if she's like most high school musicians and actors), but probably doesn't have the talent to do professionally or even to get great parts in big cities' community theaters.</p>
<p>I think that blossom's ideas about good colleges for your D are ecellent. She may even qualify for merit aid. I'd also add U Michigan. While it's a big college, it has some small residential communities for like minded students. It also seems to have some very nice arts opportunities judging by FrecklyBecky's experiences.</p>
<p>"If it were my kid places like Rice, Skidmore, Wellesley, Barnard, Connecticut College, Muehlenberg, Brandeis, McGill, Sarah Lawrence, Bryn Mawr would be on my initial list (unless you decide to limit it to West Coast schools.)"</p>
<p>Thanks for your suggestions.</p>
<p>We are not going to limit her geographically (except kinda discourage her from going deep Southeast ;)), but rather have an agreement that she needs to have a really good reasons for going out-of-state (such as big name recognition, unique and highly desired program, especially obvious "fit" ... or a really generous scholarship ;)).</p>
<p>from the UC Comprehensive Review Factors:</p>
<h1>1. UC gpa</h1>
<h1>2. Test scores.</h1>
<h1>3. Number, content and performance in academic courses beyond the minimum "a-g" requirements.</h1>
<h1>4. Number of and performance in UC-approved honors and AP courses.</h1>
<h1>5. ELC</h1>
<h1>6. Quality of your senior year program, as measured by the type and number of academic courses in progress or planned."</h1>
<p>.
.
.</p>
<h1>11. Special talents, achievements and awards....</h1>
<p>Alumother:</p>
<p>Williams is really in the middle of nowhere. It may not seem like the middle of nowhere during the summer, when it's on the edge of an attractive vacation area, but in midwinter (when my family visited my nearby in-laws repeatedly over the years) it's the middle of nowhere. Being 3-4 hours from New York or Boston by car doesn't make it somewhere.</p>
<p>The others you're right about. Amherst MA is Harvard Square compared to Williamstown (and the number of students in the area is like 20x that at Williams). Swarthmore is 20 minutes from downtown Philadelphia by public transportation.</p>
<p>Myau:</p>
<p>I think you've got the university/LAC calculus backward. For me, LACs are much more attractive for kids without really clearly defined interests, because they are generally much more flexible and nurturing, and its impossible to drift or to fall between the cracks. Also, you have much more freedom to participate in things that you might not be great at already, or to take good classes outside your major, etc. Universities offer more resources, more faculty, etc., but are never as user-friendly, and kids have to be a little assertive to get what they need. And often, in a university setting, the resources and opportunities are set aside for those completely focused on that area. So, for instance, only Econ majors can take upper-level (or even intermediate-level) econ courses, or only journalism students write and edit the student newspapers. (That tends to apply more at mega universities.)</p>
<p>When does your daughter find out whether the AP stats is a go or not? I think AP stats would be a good choice if it's available. Many of the colleges seem to recommend 4 years of math and 3 years of science. Your daughter's taken the desired triumvirate of Bio/Chem/Physics and that's enough science if she takes a math class, given that she doesn't like lab science. I'm of the opinion that taking only two academic courses in the senior year will have a significant, negative impact on her admissions results.</p>
<p>As far as the musical, has she participated in the past? Would she be in line for a major role? If she ends up with a small part in the chorus, will that really be worth what she gives up? Musical rehearsals can be extremely time-consuming for very little glory and gratification.</p>
<p>"When does your daughter find out whether the AP stats is a go or not?"</p>
<p>Probably, in August, right before the school starts.</p>
<p>"As far as the musical, has she participated in the past? Would she be in line for a major role? If she ends up with a small part in the chorus, will that really be worth what she gives up? Musical rehearsals can be extremely time-consuming for very little glory and gratification."</p>
<p>Yes, she did and her role in it was (and is going to be again if she'll do it) a very special one - highly important and recognized by the cast, director and orchestra, but not too glorious from the audience's point of view (that's why I feel about it the same way as you put it - "time-consuming for very little glory and gratification" - but she feels dufferently). Actually, she is a musician there, too, not an actor.;)</p>
<p>"I think you've got the university/LAC calculus backward. For me, LACs are much more attractive for kids without really clearly defined interests"</p>
<p>I'll let her read this ;). I encouraged her to look at different kinds of schools, and then she decided that in small schools she might become "claustrophobic". </p>
<p>Also, since we are immigrants, the diversity of the campus is important to her. And remote LACs seem to be more homogenious.</p>
<p>"Williams is really in the middle of nowhere. It may not seem like the middle of nowhere during the summer, when it's on the edge of an attractive vacation area, but in midwinter (when my family visited my nearby in-laws repeatedly over the years) it's the middle of nowhere. Being 3-4 hours from New York or Boston by car doesn't make it somewhere."</p>
<p>I agree. My hometown is in NYS, about a 45 min. drive from Williams. My hometown is a hick town, and so is Williams. Yes, they are attractive areas in the summer and fall, but they are very long drives from major metros, and those long drives are even longer in the winter. Flying in and out also is difficult as the airport --Albany, N.Y. -- isn't that close, is hard to get to in winter due to snow/ice, and lacks lots of direct flights from major metros.</p>
<p>Given your D's interests and the fact that you're immigrants, you may want to reconsider the Southeast.</p>
<p>I can think of at least 2 LACs in the South that are in or right outside major metros. Rhodes College is in Memphis, a city known for its music. Rollins is right outside Orlando -- a city that due to Disney and other parks -- is a bit of a mecca for people interested in theater, including its having job opportunities for young musicians.</p>
<p>Given her scores, she may be in line for some very nice merit aid at those places, which are well respected tier 2 colleges.</p>
<p>She also may wish to look at Vanderbilt, a university that's in Nashville, another city known for its music. Vandy also has some nice merit aid, and is ranked by U.S. news about #20 of the tier 1 national universities. To have a decent shot at merit aid, however, she'd probably need to carry a stronger senior year schedule than she's currently planning to.</p>