<p>Public universities also block kids from even entering them- it's called getting rejected. Should all public universities have to take every applicant because they are taxpayer funded?</p>
<p>I can't see how it's somehow less elitist to go to a highly selective school over a highly selective program within a larger school. Well, maybe I can--perhaps it's like the difference between going to an exclusive luxury resort, or going to Disney World with a pass that gets you to the front of all the lines. In either case, however, I think there is a risk of thinking that you are better than other people.</p>
<p>Seem to be discussing many of the honors college specifics. To see if we can put together a list, what would those things be? Further, what are the pluses and minuses of each. Here are some I have read in this thread:</p>
<ul>
<li>Special pre-registration</li>
<li>Special housing, or at some schools 4 years of housing</li>
<li>Tuition breaks</li>
<li>Research programs</li>
<li>Mentoring programs</li>
<li>Special classes</li>
</ul>
<p>While each program may be different they are often a combination of a number of things. If we can provide some thoughts on each of the components we may be able to better understand how best to proceed in a particular case.</p>
<p>For me I would focus more on research opportunities and "special" classes. What I mean by special classes is really more of a teaching style in classes that you often do not get in a typical high school. For example, seminar like classes instead of a lecture.</p>
<p>OP, my daughter is in the honors college at Mizzou. It wasn't a factor in her picking the school, and her best opportunities have not come directly from it (study abroad, great summer job, Big 12 student government conference, internship). Those came from relationships with other smart kids, and I believe one came from her being active in student government. I guess what I am saying is that she picked Mizzou, not Mizzou's honors college, if that makes sense. </p>
<p>She really pays attention to what activities or opportunities other kids are doing or getting, and will thoroughly look into cool internships or things that they might just casually mention. She is proactive and does not wait for things to happen to her, she kind of makes them happen.</p>
<p>In the end, she will graduate with the honors designation, and maybe that will be a factor in what law schools or grad schools show an interest in her.</p>
<p>Honors perks that helped D along the way during her undergrad at Barretts Honors at ASU that we weren't aware of in the beginning:
Honor's only study abroad summer trip ..small group,6 credits in 6 weeks,travelling with Honors professors.
Honors Thesis..writing the thesis and defending it during senior year gave D the writing sample she needed for Grad School apps,and the fortitude to do the campus interviews after facing the Thesis committee.
Extended library priveleges...Honors students were allowed to keep books out all semester long,this helped tremendously during the Thesis research time.
This was all in addition to the perks listed in others posts..mentoring,advisement, housing,early registration,access to extra activities ,etc.</p>
<p>Kristin, i can certainly accept many of your reasons for going to mizzou, but </p>
<p>"i anticipate being near the top of my class at mizzou. i plan to continue pursuing honors classes. i do not think i would be near the top of my class at virginia. finishing with a solid gpa and class standing is very important to me and i think it will be more feasible to achieve that at mizzou". </p>
<p>Isn't that a strange reason to pick a university? I seem to recall that we go to college to be educated rather than getting good grades. Why do you think that you won't be top of the class at Virginia if you were equally well educated at Mizzo or UVa?</p>
<br>
<blockquote> <p>I seem to recall that we go to college to be educated rather than getting good grades. <<</p> </blockquote>
<br>
<p>Kristin is a future med school applicant and so grades really matter.</p>
<p>Hey Geezermom:
I thought I was the only one that had those sentiments. My parents spent a FORTUNE on my education -- seven sisters, Oxford, top-ranked Ph.D. program -- and yet I never felt supported intellectually or nurtured. Rather, I always felt kind of 'out of my element' -- and I remember frequently feeling as an undergrad like I was ill-prepared and couldn't really compete with the rich kids. My parents think I'll be doing my own children a huge disservice by not spending all our money on private college for three children -- and yet I wonder if my life would truly have been different had I gone to the more supportive, close to home college that many of my high school friends went to. I always thought I was the only one that felt this way --</p>
<p>I guess the grass is always greener....</p>
<p>I wanted to go to a big university and refused to even seriously consider any small LAC's. Then I was really overwhelmed for my first year and questioned my decision and my capabilities. I eventually did hit my stride when I joined a small-ish school within the university, and then I loved my experience, but it took a while!</p>
<p>
[quote]
I guess the grass is always greener....
[/quote]
I look it as more of every student is different ... and different envronments are better/worse for different people. Whether that be
- big school small school
- likely to be a top student or likely to be a middle of the pack student
- need to be pushed versus need to be comportable
- being in a program like an honors program feels like a reward for effort and achievement or a seperation of the school into classes
- rural vs collgetown vs city
- close to home versus experience a new place</p>
<p>All of those were meant to written as neutral choices ... in the abstract each choice is neither good or bad ... for a particular kid some of these attributes may have a dominant choice.</p>
<p>Momzie,</p>
<p>"My parents think I'll be doing my own children a huge disservice by not spending all our money on private college for three children "</p>
<p>Don't you just love when other people try to tell you how to spend you money? LOL- I'm laughing with ya honey because my folks were the same way. They have come around though.</p>
<p>All I heard about throughout college was how expensive it was, and how stressed out my dad was at work, and how he'd like to retire but can't...and then he started having heart problems when I was a junior in college, which only made the stress and resentment worse. </p>
<p>When it came time for my kids to go to school, they were dismayed that we did not "force" our kids to go OOS or private (our kids chose to go to our instate public flagship). Deep down inside I wonder if they didn't just want to see us go through as painful experience as they did.</p>
<p>3togo, you're so right about that -- that what's good for one child isn't necessarily good for all children. </p>
<p>I have one daughter in particular who is shy and, well, kind of fragile -- and I can't imagine suggesting to her that she should go thousands of miles away to Stanford (we're from VA) even if intellectually she could handle it. I guess we're lucky we have so many fine schools in Virginia.</p>
<p>We Marylanders envy you Virginians for just that reason, Momzie.</p>
<p>There's something for everyone within your state system. It's like a college buffet.</p>
<p>Dean Brady, the dean of the Schreyer's Honors College at PSU, maintains a blog.
His latest posting is titled "What is the Purpose of an Honors Education".
He makes some good points that are relevant to this thread...</p>
<p><a href="http://engage.shc.psu.edu/%5B/url%5D">http://engage.shc.psu.edu/</a></p>
<p>Hi cathymee, how did your D like her experience at Barretts. My S is a rising senior and Barretts is one that we are looking at. Is it a great Honors College? Will you recommend that to others? Thank you.</p>
<p>"Great post. What do you think about the admissions chances for post-grad. work when comparing State Honor vs. Private? If all factors are equal whom do the admissions people pick?"</p>
<p>Putting asides the "honors" question - if you are a top student at a state university, you are likely to get more research opportunities, better mentoring, more internships than if you were just a middling student at a top private. From that, the answer becomes obvious. (Half the students at the top privates end up in the bottom half of their classes - fancy that!)</p>
<p>I recommend it highly,if the atmosphere at ASU outside of the Honors College meets your students needs.I have to say D graduated in 2005,so some things may be a little different.
ASU itself is a tremendous University (size wise)A kid needs to feel comfortable in that atmosphere b/c while Honors does create somewhat of a "bubble" they are still in the midst of a bustling crowded campus.D loved being there,she was a Music Performance major to start but had friends from every major possible. She loved the core classes (the 2 Human Event classes required) ,had good advising and great departmental mentoring,did an Honors Study Abroad,wrote a great thesis,loved living in the desert but in an urban atmosphere,learned alot,found her passion,had a great outcome for Graduate School.Many friends went on to med,dental,law,physical therapy,music therapy,pharmacy,etc.She was a recipient of their National Merit Scholarship,as were many friends and the "deal" was fabulous.She even attended some football games,which she never dreamed she would do.Cultural offerings were important to her,as in outside art museums,movies and symphonies and Phoenix fufilled those needs.The airport is less than 10 minutes from the campus .Off campus housing is readily available and reasonable.The campus is diverse in the #'s of Hispanics attending classes, and Native Americans.Probably less diverse thannormal in # of African Americans, but Arizona as a whole doesnt have a large AA population.Theres a walkable student shopping/restaurant area (Mill Ave) and upscale Scottsdale is pretty close by.Students make trips to Las Vegas (sort of a rite of passage -5 hrs away) some go to Mexico for breaks.Its hot there but after awhile you seem to get used to it.
D took a mix of honors/non honors classes.Music of course was non honors based..Many reqs she did honors.She added a minor in Womens Studies along the way. She graduated summa cum laude and won a departmental award.Shes now at a prestigious private midwestern U for grad school and feels she was as prepared as others in her dept for the rigors of the work for the PHD.</p>
<p>cathymee, thank you very much for the information. Is the National Merit Scholarship from ASU a full ride or you still have to pay some?</p>
<p>leungpy
in D's years, it covered tuition and dorm.food plan we paid for.wasnt enough for books,etc.D moved off campus after soph year and then the $$ stretched farther, as off campus rent was cheaper than the dorm.The amount has been raised since,take a look at their scholarship info on the financial aid pages.</p>
<br>
<blockquote> <p>Deep down inside I wonder if they didn't just want to see us go through as painful experience as they did.<<</p> </blockquote>
<br>
<p>Only then would we appreciate their sacrifice, knowing exactly what they went through! I've told one of my Ds that I hope she has a picky eater for a child!</p>