<p>i agree with reading and neverborn, like i said, i could never handle abstinence.</p>
<p>hotpiece: Exactly. I don't think casual sex is a good thing by any means - it's primal, disgusting, and spreads STDs. I think you should in fact be in love before you have sex. However, if I'm in love, why wait to get a formalized contract from the state of Illinois known as a "marriage license" before I have sex?</p>
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I'm amoral. But abstinent. Don't ask why.
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<p>Same. I haven't quite found someone I want to share the experience with yet, but I will. And I don't even know if I'm going to get married in the first place, so that's out of the question.</p>
<p>Man, saying that marriage is just a piece of paper shows how far our society has declined. It has nothingt o do with the piece of paper, it's an agreement between to people to not have sex with anyone else and to be faithful to each other until they die. No wnder divorce rates in this country are over 60%, it reflects the general lack of respect we have for each other. Here we have politicians arguing over whether gays should be getting married when they can't even keep their own marriages together. That's jsut hypoctitical, the bible says that people shouldn't divorce unless there has been adultery, and then the adulterer should be stoned and killed. If people are using the bible to justify not having gays marry, then they shouldn't be gettign divorced and should be stoning others when they scommit adultery. I hope none of you are as hypocritical as that.</p>
<p>oh, I'm all for the stoning.</p>
<p>(?)</p>
<p>yes, marriage was at one point a sacred bond resting with the church, it just isn't that any more. You can go to a court and get a piece of paper... and that's really all it is. Hell, I know an athiest who got a license to preach online and is now a pastor at a church. A piece of paper doesn't constitute something morally or ethically acceptable.</p>
<p>oh, and i'm not saying that premarital sex is unethical.... i honestly don't see myself getting married, at least in the semi-near future. (well, something's been discussed for need-based aid and whatnot... but we're not going there!! haha) but if I feel like i want to be with someone, i personally don't see anything wrong with sleeping together.</p>
<p>Marriage HAS ABOSULTELY NOTHING to do with the church, that is catholic, protestant, buddhist, muslim, or whatever other religion you follow. Marriage has been around for a very long time. Mostly it has been a male-dominated institution where men would trade wives to seal peace agreements or things like that. But plenty of atheists get married, for most people it's somethign to express their undying love for one another. Of course, I'm not advocating polygamy sicne that is illegal, nor do I believe taht men should have multiple wives, even though that would be sort of cool for guys...I'm not saying it's sacred or anything, I'm saying that you shouldn't even think about marriage unless you intend to keep those damn vows you have to make. Instead, sleep around, be single, date others, explore your life, just don't make marriage seem like something that Chirstianity of the government enforces. It's based on individual choice.</p>
<p>yeah...I agree with someone. A marriage license is a meaningless symbol if the faith that should lie behind it is missing. I don't neccesarily mean a religious faith, but a faith in the institution or some sense of the sanctity of the bond.</p>
<p>Woah Meestasi - you kind of veered off of the track a little. For the record, the Bible or any religion should never be used to legislate against or for <em>anyone</em>. The fact that Republicans have adopted Christian morality as their philosophy and bases that as their opposition to gay marriage and abortion is absurd. The reason that many people act hypocritically is because no one bothers to define or identify to themselves what <em>anything</em> is anymore - not just marriage. What is morality, and how does it apply to human life? What is good? What is bad? No one defines or agrees on these terms anymore. No one can be consistently bad - what results is compromise. When you follow an irrational philosophy (read:religion:)) you are constantly battling against human nature, and the good premises that are part of western culture and civilization. Good premises support bad ones. That is why adulterers aren't stoned to death - we haven't regressed to a theocracy yet. The only time you'll find un-hypocritical Christian right wingers, is when there's a theocracy. Maybe the Republican party should <em>think</em> about what they've betrayed and what they've embraced. They might even earn their soul back (pun intended).</p>
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I don't think abstinence unconditionally is a good thing - marriage is just a piece of paper from the state formalizing a contract.
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<p>meestasi, i think neverborn was saying that marriage entails love and devotion. which are things you can give to someone without having the formalized piece of paper signifying a marriage. thus, he wasn't demeaning the worth of being married, but simply saying that he doesn't need to commit the act of getting married to feel the same emotions and thus have sex.</p>
<p>Well, geez guys, I'm sorry if I overreacted, but you can't tell tone on these forums and I thought he was talking about marriage jsut being a peice of paper and that there's no point to it. Of course it entails love and devotion, no doubt some people feel like they have that. I personally am still driven by those primal instincts that govern many men's behaviors.</p>
<p>/agree with hotpiece</p>
<p>meestasi - when you say you are driven by primal urges, does that mean you try to have sex with every pretty girl you meet? Would you enjoy having a whore? What do you value in a relationship?</p>
<p>i wouldn't call it an overreaction, but rather viewing marriage as more than what it has become. marriage now for all intents and purposes is for legal reasons regarding property and alimony if it doesn't work out. but for now, i'd just focus on being my age and not so much on finding "the one" at this point in life. but that's just me :)</p>
<p>hotpiece: Exactly. I admire love and devotion, but formal marriage is just a piece of paper from the state - I can have an ideal loving relationship without it.</p>
<p>Yes, if I had the chance I would sleep with every pretty girl I met. Enjoy having a whore? If I was a pimp maybe. No, primal urges means that at the moment I would not want a long term relationship, and that I would rather engage in one-night stands with random girls at parties that take my fancy. Well, I can't say that right now since I am actively engaged in a relationship, but I know that I would not want to settle down into a marriage, even if I did find the perfect girl. Most likely I'm afraid of commitment, or I would jump into somethign headfirst without first seeing where I would land. But I try to value commitment in a relationship, I have not and would not cheat in a relationship. And when you say what I value in a relationship I dunno what you mean, do you ask what I also value in a girl and what I expect from myself and her?</p>
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Yes, if I had the chance I would sleep with every pretty girl I met. Enjoy having a whore? If I was a pimp maybe.
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<p>I enjoy your honesty meestasi.</p>
<p>If I WERE a pimp, not was. Subjunctive.</p>
<p>I don't care what anyone else wants to do with their life, I'm not having sex until I'm married and I have religious basis for it.</p>
<p>AND only the religious right extremists in the Republican party use religion for political arguments...and on both sides of the fence, the extremists are the most vocal, but not the majority.</p>
<p>And my head hurts, Calculus, Calculus...</p>